diy solar

diy solar

EG4 3000 EHV-48 fire. Been running a 12 panel system with 2 EG4-lifepower batteries and the EG4 3000 EHV-48. Added the battery rack and 3rd battery

I would place additional OCPDs at the battery end of the cable, as well. That 125 A breaker that ships with the inverter, is shown in the manual, at the inverter.

It can be convenient, having a breaker at the inverter, as well as for the protection that it can add.

POD
 
For an AIO that does both inverting and charging, do you put 1 fits-all OCP device or you should cover both ways, 1 OCPD for the inverting and another OCPD for the charging?
 
For an AIO that does both inverting and charging, do you put 1 fits-all OCP device or you should cover both ways, 1 OCPD for the inverting and another OCPD for the charging?
All (?) AIOs have current limiting circuits on the charging, so OCP on the output is not needed. Even if there was a need the OCP would have to be rated for the typically much larger load current that would have to go through it.
 
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Based on tear down it shares many similarities to a powmr 5.5kw inverter I have. Same style case, same blue pcb, same brand caps and relays, same fans, same internal plastic covers, same batt terminal, same labeling, etc...but I don't know who makes this model for powmr either. While some of their models are SRNE and Voltronic clones this one is not.

Neither one will communicate with solar assistant, but all the other Voltronic rebrands I have tried do.

At the end of day I am just curious who the OEM is. Bluesun is another distributor of this same inverter.

I was planning to buy a PowMr 24v version that looks very, very similar to the EG4 3000 EHV-48, but then I realized that the battery positive and negative terminals are very close to each other that they can cause a short if one is not careful enough. Please correct me if I'm wrong here, as I'm only basing it on pictures.

Nevertheless I guess I have a "short phobia" now ("Sins of a Solar Empire" ?) that I'm now actually shopping for an AIO that has the battery terminals way apart from each other.

As for the PowMr and EG4, I believe they're both clones (Voltronic)?
 
At the input? What would the purpose of that be? I would put it at the battery.
It allows for a tap to be made in the line between the battery OCPD and the inverter OCPD... maybe for a charge controller or multiple units. It also should be there to protect the inverter... to a small degree at least. The inverter also is required to have a disconnecting means, which is usually interpreted as dedicated to the load.
 
If you put the breaker at the input of the inverter, there is nothing protecting the cable between the battery and the breaker
View attachment 103321

So lets fix this with a breaker at the battery.

View attachment 103322

Now the input to the inverter is double protected. That adds complexity but does not really help, so why have the breaker at the input to the inverter? Just use the one at the battery:

View attachment 103323

Over-current protection devices are always needed at the output of the power source. Over-current Protection devices are very rarely needed at the input of a load.
The supplied cable is only 4 feet long, I put the breaker right in the middle
 
Often a bad and/or loose connection can put heat into a PCB over time, which in turn causes a cap to fail.
 
I was planning to buy a PowMr 24v version that looks very, very similar to the EG4 3000 EHV-48, but then I realized that the battery positive and negative terminals are very close to each other that they can cause a short if one is not careful enough. Please correct me if I'm wrong here, as I'm only basing it on pictures.

Nevertheless I guess I have a "short phobia" now ("Sins of a Solar Empire" ?) that I'm now actually shopping for an AIO that has the battery terminals way apart from each other.

As for the PowMr and EG4, I believe they're both clones (Voltronic)?
Simple solution would be to wire to your inverter first to make sure the wires are not hot and don't short. Then connect to battery terminals.
 
I have both EG4-3000 EHV-48's running nicely, Signituresolar has been great to work with, very helpful! Our RV uses a lot of power, more than I would have expected just running the refrigerator, it works on AC, DC, or propane and is a power hog on AC. Our full size refrigerator uses less power but wont fit inside. Will be moving the panels to the garage roof next month and the system into the garage.
 
I have to say Signature Solar replaced the bad unit and I now have two Eg4 set up for 230 volts and running well, batteries do not charge below 28 degrees, so I have a propane heater to keep them warmer. Only current problem is the system will not charge the batteries from the generator. Working with Signature to find solution.
 
The China comments are ridiculous. What inverter is made anywhere else? Even Victron are made in China. Get over it.
The comments are not completely ridiculous. With Chinese manufacturing, you get what you pay for.

Having worked in the PC industry, I have a little experience in working with Chinese manufacturing. The bottom line on Chinese quality is that a company will get what they contract for and have controls in place for. If you don't have the proper clauses in place in the contract, you will get low quality. If you don't have proper controls/incentives in place with the manufacturer you will get low quality. On the flip side, if you have all the right contracts and controls in place, you can get excellent quality.....but you tend to pay for it.

The problem with many brands that move their production to china is the move is done by the business people and the cost is king, so they are not willing to pay extra for quality and controls (And often don't know how to put the controls in place).

Where it can get really bad is when the company turns both design and manufacturing over to a Chinese manufacturer. When this happens, it is very difficult to also put quality control processes in place. The best thing to do in this case is to have stiff contractual penalties in place for quality issues, but even this can be difficult to enforce.

MPP, Growatt, EG4 and many others seem to have turned Design and manufacturing over to Chinese companies without adequate controls to ensure quality.

Solark seems to also have turned the design over to china, but they may have better controls.

Victron does not manufacture in china. They manufacture in India and S.E. Asia. However, Victron does its own design and they seem to have much better quality controls in place.
 
The comments are not completely ridiculous. With Chinese manufacturing, you get what you pay for.

Having worked in the PC industry, I have a little experience in working with Chinese manufacturing. The bottom line on Chinese quality is that a company will get what they contract for and have controls in place for. If you don't have the proper clauses in place in the contract, you will get low quality. If you don't have proper controls/incentives in place with the manufacturer you will get low quality. On the flip side, if you have all the right contracts and controls in place, you can get excellent quality.....but you tend to pay for it.

The problem with many brands that move their production to china is the move is done by the business people and the cost is king, so they are not willing to pay extra for quality and controls (And often don't know how to put the controls in place).

Where it can get really bad is when the company turns both design and manufacturing over to a Chinese manufacturer. When this happens, it is very difficult to also put quality control processes in place. The best thing to do in this case is to have stiff contractual penalties in place for quality issues, but even this can be difficult to enforce.

MPP, Growatt, EG4 and many others seem to have turned Design and manufacturing over to Chinese companies without adequate controls to ensure quality.

Solark seems to also have turned the design over to china, but they may have better controls.

Victron does not manufacture in china. They manufacture in India and S.E. Asia. However, Victron does its own design and they seem to have much better quality controls in place.
I agree with you. Bad manufacturing can occur anywhere, it is up to the design party to ensure it is done right. My point was being manufactured in China is not actually an issue. Being designed poorly or not being tested properly, those are real issues. Personally I think China has the most experienced manufacturing capability currently if leveraged correctly.

Not being able to confirm but it would seem that MPP, Growatt, EG4 etc are using reference designs from some company and just making a few feature requests.

PS I work in the PC industry and have done contract manufacturing with many different parties.
 
I have to say Signature Solar replaced the bad unit and I now have two Eg4 set up for 230 volts and running well, batteries do not charge below 28 degrees, so I have a propane heater to keep them warmer. Only current problem is the system will not charge the batteries from the generator. Working with Signature to find solution.
Glad you were taken care of ....Did you ask Signature Solar what they recommend for a breaker-fuse.???
They sold you the stuff Minus the panels .... right? No doubt would be interesting to see their recommendation for your solution.

Reading through this mess from other ppl is typical on forums now and in the past. The welding forums went through same thing 15-20 years ago as China inside appeared. Then welders changed from transformer based to mosfet igbt based light weights.
on here just like then and there Ppl are commenting just to comment..... ie: drinking all the kool aid with no clue as to the various flavors. There are a ton of things could say about the responses you have gotten but again typical with forums like this. I have extensive experience in power generation and motor management from design software and end item Production - in the field research about 35-40 years of it. Toot toot blowing my own horn..... I can pee on the big trees too.

I think some confusion on their behalf is not looking at your system components ie: the EG4 server rack style 48v batteries come with the 100 amp circuit breaker. Some of the commenters seem to think you added the breakers and are were all wrapped up in it. Hahhaha okay so some ppl need a picture...

When you are working with Bleeding Edge technology can bet you are certifiying it in the field with your application - you are literally doing the long term research and development for the manufacturer out in the field. The 500volt high solar input voltage means when something goes wrong it is going to be bad .
when you collapse a field suddenly the power the voltage goes crazy high. Never know what you are going to get.... until it happens.

I worked on diesel electric locomotive power generation primarily some aircraft.... as well as some automotive. The limiting factor is not really the wiring but the temperature of the melting point for the insulation. 10ga wire usually rated for 30 amp home circuits but can cover up to 40 amp although 8 ga is highly recommended. That is account of the insulation factors. The actualy wire can easy carry 2-3x rating losing more and more as it turns into a heating element.
General Electric was wanting to reduce the number of failures to the power rectifier fuses blowing on locomotives. So they simply removed the 900-1100 amp fuses depending on model locomotive then installed: buss bar, a Current Transformer that fed a computer circuit which was suppose to react in time to stop any damage. The results were catastrophic disaster..... 1600 cable vaporized in sections.... hahahaha Big difference for theory vs reality.
Same as designing setting up ground relay circuit testing for the locomotive main alt. Those big diesel engines basically just run the big alternator everything else is mostly electrical. Anyway: Using a fuse and wire might work to trip the ground relay most times...took trial and error ..... but sometimes the wire inside the insulation would vaporize.... the fuse would still be good. The insulation would still look good after it danced in the air before disappearing. Hahahaha So electricity although it has basic rules does not always follow them. Hahaha
Why these inverter companies stipulate such large wiring.... safety zone..... they know these inverters are going to fail. Not if but when.
In a good place and time the companies would seek these FAILED products returned so could R&D them more with a dive into failure reasons to develop improvements. I suspect the 500 volt pv or maybe 400 volts you described is problematic and not reeady for prime time.= failure.

BTW be aware the EG 3000 inverter you have is very limited for actual pv current input. If you start going parallel vs staying in series will find another problem. You'll end up with another fire. Bring the hot dogs and marsh mellows. This is the exact reason these inverters can't get UL listings. Bleeding Edge Technology.... everyone is rushing to make money from it too. The technology has been around for a long time just not implemented like now. If you burn your house-rv down then the insurance might deny the claim too.
Again ask Signature Solar what they recommend based on your system and then share the info. They are selling you the system so they owe you some based tech support. Should be interesting to read and make them earn their drop shipped money. ??
Let us know about the generator issues.... some inverters will not phase - cycle frequency lock with the generators - need a newer inverter-generator and even still that can be iffy. . But will be interesting to see the resolve. You are paying to be a pioneer and factory tester. ??
 

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Was the wire provided lower quality copper clad aluminum CAA wire? I noticed lot of sellers using this lower cost wire for heavier gauges.
 
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