Most reacted posts

I posted this info in another thread but it was on the end of a long thread - so may well be missed by many. Reposting the info here so others get to see this info. I believe this small Hatz diesel genset to be very different to every other small genset I have seen...

might have got caught with a large amount of LFP before the price drop and they cant move them at the price they paid = game over

Where I will be operating there is diesel available (still spotty but doable) Any GAS has to be hauled in to the boat from far far away. On a trip, if I run out of gas it becomes a headache. Plus gas shortages are common here. I can easily generate current for charging batteries but once out...

I think you are onto something with that approx ! Yes a BMS on each battery is the only way to do it. This brings in another level of redundancy. An ATS (Automatic transfer switch) of some kind would probably be the way to go here. Thanks for your well wishes - this project is going to...

This seems to be a nice Diesel battery charger. Hatz (German and very old well respected company) single cylinder with a Hatz designed and built 56v 100 amp *PMG* attached to the flywheel of the engine. J1939 CAN bus equipped from the factory. There is a 24v version if thats your voltage with...

Steve, glad you joined this thread. I have read a metric TON of your posts in the last 2 years or so. Part of what put me off the prismatic cells is what you have to say about them. I dont feel confident that I can get REAL EV grade prismatic cells - too many stories of people not getting what...

is another way to deploy a 24v LFP bank that is easily charged by 40v panels and then use a dc-dc to push those amps collected and stored in the 24v battery, into the 48v battery? The only downside is the loss in the dc-dc. Having another battery at 24v is no bad thing.

Thanks for the info Tom. There is a LOT involved in all this. What is your opinion on Silver Plating in general - better performance? Most likely not cost effective. But its interesting.

Some great info in the thread. Interesting that the +ve cell terminal gets the hottest when the cell is charging/discharging. The guy whom said he is placing temp sensors on his battery is going to use 2 x ESP32 as each ESP32 can operate 8 temp sensors - so he is clearly using a 48v setup as he...

Yeah...how did we do this before the Internet? They do specify an RPM - so the engine is running at a given RPM (2000/2200/2400 that they spec for a given output at a given voltage etc) - but I dont think it is a strictly governed per se. As the rev's go up and down a little the output is...

Yes that is the same conclusion I have come too - i will be having a 24v battery in addition to a 48vnom set of batteries, so what you have said is entirely possible - a little bit of wastage though in losses, but seems to be about the easiest and most flexible way forward.

From the Agree with what you say. Aluminum flat Bar can be upsized in dimms to match the ampacity of Copper. Aluminum will dissipate heat better, so that would be an advantage. However Aluminum will change dimensional size faster then Cu (expansion/contraction), so that's a down side. I am...

Thanks for that Offgrid. Some interesting choices you have made - its very interesting.

Some good points raised. I have not written a big long story about what I am doing or why. Just trying to keep it as succinct as possible but while still fleshing out concepts- its a balancing act! My battery system is going in a sail boat. The questions I am digging into at the moment are...

what happens if you get a cell out of balance - the so called "runner" ? That cell needs to be either brought back into balance (either charged or discharged) - if the need arises how do we do that? Of course one way is to just take the cell out of the battery, get it to the right voltage and...

Yeah, it gets scary fast! I will open another thread on designing my battery system - there are many concepts I am still absorbing. Again, my awkward prose is not helpful. What I was trying to convey without getting too into it was, I am trying to get as many batteries as possible onto the...

Some even go up to 600/700 VDC. Very efficient for running large loads but the cost of DC fuses/switches etc will be very high for these voltages and 600vdc is kind of scary. Still, the solar arrays are running at these voltages these days and plenty of DIY'ers do thier own solar installs.

and THAT is the crux of it. Thing is plenty of people have working systems using either method - a straight series config, some with a straight series config with multiple batteries in parallel, some with cells paralleled first then put in series and then systems with cells paralleled fist...

****LONG TEXT HEAVY POST AHEAD**** fleshing out what this is all about so its better understood. I tried to keep it simple and to the point in my first post but it seems that just caused more questions then answers. This idea struck me as a way to solve a few problems, but seems an awkward...

The local quote I am getting for the 1B50E with 56vdc PMG is approx $6K Its not a terrible price for what it is. It is very small and can fit into the hatch I have on my sugar scoop. I was looking at building my own DC genset with a Yanmar 3 cylinder Diesel. It works out much more...

so what happens if a cell in one of 3P strings short circuits?

Great thanks for the info. This is a good calc to know.

Thanks Up North

OK then. Just so I am understanding this better - so those bussbars that connect every cell together in the pack is passing the same current that the battery is outputting? If thats the case then I dont understand how those 2mmx 40mm bussbars are handling the load - if we do a 1c discharge from...

Totally Totally agree with this. However if one wants to use the ATESS inverters shown in the pdf uploaded that shows the range then what is one to do? There are pro's and con's; Pro's - 1/ HV dc is a way to keep amps down overall. 2/ HV dc is a way to reduce parallel strings in a given...

What I would say to that is, it is what it is. I need the power from as large a battery bank as I can fit onboard. I like the idea of redundancy - plus out here we live by the motto - 2 is 1 , 1 is none. Out at sea that is especially true. So having two battery banks and 2 inverters is a nice...

What does this mean? Any more info?

Well sure. I get your point. However I have been reading this forum since inception and there are some pretty clever ppl here. I know the ones who's opinion I would trust and hope they chime in on the thread. In the end it would all have to be run by my sparky. He is a clever guy as well and no...

I think you have mis-understood me - I didnt say EVE were resellers - I implied that resellers (ie, NOT EVE) are always a little less then EVE direct.

@Rocketman - you are right - a standalone AC battery charger in the Stern could move energy from the front battery bank to the rear battery bank in the same way the bow standalone AC Battery charger moves energy to the front battery bank from the rear battery bank. This transfer of energy can...

You think you got it bad - Murphy is my next door neighbor - not only that but I am an unlucky guy! now THAT is a combination.

As far as I can tell they only do the PMG on the 1B30E and the 1B50E. These gensets solve two problems for me - keep everything diesel and they are small. Its difficult to find a small diesel genset much less one that has a PMG built into it. Like others here, I want to keep my setup all...

Yes that is the only way EVE will do it. I have to organise the transport to a shipper, then I have to get a shipper to do all the paper work including the dangerous goods certificate. Its easier to buy from a reseller but a much better chance of getting decent cells from EVE direct.

FB groups and youtube channels - digital mermaid -

I like the Midnite 250A shunt trip breaker but I would have to import them - given this, I would like to find out if there is anything else on the market that can do the job reliably.

Been reading as many Bussbar threads here as possible. I have read about Copper and Aluminum buss bars and the pros and cons of Al vs Cu. Thing is, even if one were to use Cu buss bar, it still should be plated with Tin, or interestingly, silver (Ag). There are good reasons for plating, and...

me too!!

Did you ever get the Scotty Installed ? - they are on V3 of the scotty now - the Scotty AI. It is very interesting - as you say, ground breaking.

So if i am understanding this correctly, if a load on the battery bank draws 250 amps from a battery bank made up of 280Ah cells, then each cell is drawing 250amps, and thus almost at the 1C rate for the cells?

thanks for the link - so best to stick noark I guess. I see the short circuit capacity on that is 100kA. I dont recognize that unit of measure ( i get it is 100,000 amps) - is it the same as the 20,000 AIC of a class T ? I dont know how xxx AIC correlates to xxx kA - is it the same thing but...

so will be a while before they are in the wild for the likes of us here.

Why for DC ?

OP here......sorry - been busy working on the boat. I will read through the new replies and answer them a bit later.

how are you thinking of setting up the switchgear to allow a 2 way power flow to/from the house? I am interested in how you do this.

So for high amps at 48vnom then we need the M3 series, double pole with high interrupt of 65 kA ? Its not the high volts we need, but rather the high amps and I need double pole as my boat is aluminum - special precautions with electrics on Aluminum boats

What I am trying to convey here is that the AC output of an inverter should not be used to be the AC source in of another upstream inverter. For example lets take a Victron Quattro Inverter. It has 2 AC inputs - either Grid and Genset or two gensets (dont see why it couldn't be 2 AC inputs - an...

any chance of a drawing of your setup ? I would like to study it closer and possibly adapt some ideas from it

exactly what I am doing on my 42ft'er

yes the 1000ah Winston's are 41Kg each !!! I was initially going to pony up for them at the inflated price but they dont actually fit so had to fall back to the blue cells. My boat is a special one (hahaha, dont all boat owners think their boat is special in some way). It is a so called...

is cork any good as a compressible separator ? Has anyone tried it ?

Hi RC, Thank you for the informative post. Could you tell me in English what you just said :-) I'll take a stab but please tell me if I am interpreting correctly. I think what you are saying is that the YR1035 is not a very sophisticated measurement and that the much higher end instrument is...

The Victron MPII 5kVA has a 70 amp charger on board - how does this equate to power draw from the AC side? By this I mean how many kW/Amps is the MPII pulling from the AC side to provide 70 amps of DC charging ?

That is interesting - i wonder what the life span of something like this is?

I am interested in measuring cells so that I can batch cells together for making 48vnom batteries - batteries will be in parallel connected to a bussbar. I am looking at importing a large number of cells so that I can test them all and keep the best cells and sell the rest. I need to "Match...

deleted post. Its been a long long day of reading. Need to rest before going any further with all this. It is critical to get this right.

No, not wasted or any sunk cost issues. I need 48v on my boat as going for an all electric galley and I have 2 x 48v motors to run as an electric boat. I do know there are panels out there that run at higher higher voltages - just none to be found where I am located and shipping panels in would...

I had emails with a lady at the Winston factory. They are still quoting $1 per aH. I would have thought this would have reduced somewhat - but nope - still $1 per aH. What sort of pricing did you get ?

Looking for EV cells and wondering what brands are favored at this time? I see Hithum mentioned here and there but know little of them. Are they a reasonable EV quality cell?

yes the charge source *Should* never charge over 3.45v. However seeing as how Murphy is my next door neighbor and I am an unlucky guy, I wouldnt like to trust that. If and its a very BIG IF, the charger does let the volts go over 3.45 then ..."pop" goes your expensive blue parts.

So why would monitiroing temps of cells be important ? When a cell is monitored for temperature would it just serve as an indicator of how the cell is performing? I came across this snippet from a guy who knows his stuff and this is what he is doing..... "I will add now temp sensors to each...

Is Nickel plating preferred over Tin Plating when plating Cu Bussbar ?

quite right Yabert, quite right. Smaller panels = more panels which as you point out, equals more wires management more pints of failure etc. It looks to me one either goes for high $$$ CIGS panels OR use a DC optimiser - if for no other reason then to be able to get a single panel on a single...

I plan to install as many cells as will fit.

Tim, you and I are on boats - we have different issues then those building battery systems for thier house or hunting cabin etc. My battery system will be the heart beat of my whole boat - how well it all works out is dependent on the batteries - I am willing to do every little thing I can to...

Yes that is true - finding a quality Inverter at that 96v is difficult _ i have found only one, but its a good one https://www.selectronic.com.au/sppro/models.htm There are some very nice features in this inverter. I am interested in the 7.5kW version - note it is 7.5 KILOWATT - > not VA as...

As I have not actually built out my batteries yet I am still getting a grip on every aspect that goes into building a *SAFE* battery. What I am wondering about at the moment is how to build out the battery with some way of attaching balancing charger leads to a cell while its still in the pack...

This might be an interesting board for a cell temp monitoring project..... https://a2delectronics.ca/projects/

Hmmm. Brass as a busbar ??

I have been in communication with EVE for supply of EV cells and he gave me the following prices. Not sure that MB30 are EV cells though? I was told the EVE 304aH or the Catl 306aH are the EV cells. Still this pricing is useful to have.

Right. I understand that part then. So if a total battery pack is setup as 1 x 16s 280Ah cells + another 1 x 16s 280 Ah cells (to be clear, so 2 x 16s of 280Ah cells -16s2p?) then a total of a 200 amp draw on that total combined battery would be 100 amps across each of the 16s sets in the total...

2 x 48v motors mounted to the hull. 48v it is then. All planned from the start. Was not going to go solar but changed my mind and want to install panels as mentioned above. So Solar has to fit into the 48v system.

Those Miasole Panels look quite nice. The high voltage versions are outputting 67-68v and 8a. That 8 amps is quite nice for a high voltage panel as most of what I have looked at in HV panels have a voltage of up to 75v but only 3.5-4 amps - I dont care how many volts come in - I just want as...

What features do you see that Samle has that the other 2 do not have? I am interested in 48v and Samlex are a bit sparse at that voltage. the highest rated Inverter is only 2800w and I dont see anything about being able to parallel the 48 v inverter with another. 2800w is a bit limiting.

These are straight from EVE - so we can assume decent quality ? Or the same crap shoot ? EVE may just be dumping the not so great cells onto small buyers like us - even direct. I have no way to know, just wary of the Chinese battery market.

Winstons are out. CALB's - not sure if they will fit or not. Who are Keheng? That leaves CATL and EVE. Rept any good for EV?

Yes technically there are some good reasons to go 96v ; 1/ less amps being taken out of the batteries for the same workload at the motor - I am guessing this can only be good for the cells ? 2/ Using the same cable used at 48v would result in less voltage drop and not as much heat in the...

I guess its a "is the glass half full or half empty" type thing. I follow your logic on more cells having a better chance to even out glitches in the battery overall. But then again more cells = more chances of a cell going bad. I had not considered that if a big cell goes bad it takes the...

oops - my bad - 48vnom MPII. The AC in is 230v - Single phase, the max input from a normal residential mains connection is 60amps here. So 60amps x 230v = 13,800 watts from the grid. I am not sure how AC input amps correlate to DC output amps. Is it as simple as 70amps x 48v = 3360w dc going...

2 things - 1/ the diesel tank is no longer needed - so its empty and water tight - but no water gets to the tank anyway. 2/ Are you on a boat by any chance ? Your location is interesting and probably involves a boat. Could be wrong though.

This is the same board - it is mounted in a 3D printed holder and has 2 Thermistors on the top right interface. Nothing extra required in way of parts to connect the 10kohm thermistors to the interface connection points on the board. I am not sure how this Thermistor would be attached to the...

so thinking all this through, is there a case to be made for 2P setups no matter the voltage or ampacity of the battery? As pointed out, if a large 280Ah cell goes bad it will take out the entire battery. If that same 280Ah cell is in a 2P pair and one cell goes bad, the battery still maintains...

Given the latest data suggests that charging up to 3.4v max can result in more cycles from the batteries (life span) is it feasible to use 17 3.2v cells in series for a 48vnom setup using a Victron Inverter ? Victron can accept up to 66v. 17 x 3.4v = 57.8v, 18 x 3.4v = 61.2v. If we charge up to...

Than Thanks for the info. Definitely getting a much better understanding of the issues surrounding the paralleling of cells.

thanks Steve S for the info.

I am not in the USA - but thanks anyway

Hmmm that would be a great invention indeed. But back to the issue at hand. So it seems it comes down to high voltage panels, OR panels in series/parallel config and live with the shading losses OR install Tigo optimisers or micro inverters. Anybody got any other ideas ?

There are losses in this approach as well - seems to be no easy way right now if one wants to charge 48vnom batteries.

Yes, in the end I decided to pay the slight premium and buy from thier local stock which has reduced in pricing along with the general price drop. They have a choice of LF304 or the 280K - I am going with the LF304 for 100 cells and will get another 200 from EVE later on.

Maybe he fell overboard and drowned? He was in Greece, so maybe a bit too much Ouzo ?

Is the T2Pro compatible with the software, "Thermal Camera Redux" ? Advantage of T2Pro is that it reads temps up to 550c

Ahhhh, "You Rock" - that means something similar to enjoying yourself in a coffee shop in Amsterdam. :-0

yes agree with that assessment - with NMC you have to be on top of your game - no chances with that chemistry - nice power density though for sure. As you say, any chemistry needs to be treated with utmost respect. But NMC is a bridge too far for me. I am nervous enough about LFP and would...

Thanks for the replies - whether I need it or not I dont know but if I do need it and dont put it in then its a *MAJOR* hassle to put it in later. On the other hand if I do put it in and dont really need it or use it then no harm done, it would simply be redundant. I have seen this setup...

I think the main takeaway about the pricing is that it is from EVE direct - I have had pricing from them before and they have always been a little more expensive then the "reseller" crowd. I have far more confidence buying from EVE direct then a "reseller". However it is not as easy to buy from...

It helps immensely - thanks curious. Where do you feel the optimal place for a temp sensor on the cell, is?

So BB use small cylindrical cells in parallel. Never heard of a BB battery going bad. Not saying it doesn't happen, just that it seems any issues with BB are far and few between. However they have real engineering behind them. It does show however that many small cells in parallel does work.

Have read read many posts here re paralleling cells. Not seen anything really in depth about it though. I get that a group of cells that are paralleled all have the same voltage and that you lose visibility on each individual cell. What I am trying to figure out is what is the practical limit...

Do you feel the computer fans are blowing enough CFM over the batteries ? I was looking at this.... https://acinfinity.com/hydroponics-growers/cloudline-h4-inline-fan-with-speed-controller-for-fungiculture-ip-65-rated-4-inch/#product-description it is IP 65 rated which is the big thing...