100+ MOBILE SOLAR GENERATORS AUCTION

[Hedges]

This makes me feel a lot better! I suppose some of my anxiety stems from the fact that I'll only have 10 hours before I'm locked out of making any changes to the grid parameters, along with the difficulty I've had finding information about the configuration options. For all I know, there may not even be an "offgrid" setting on the -41 models... Hopefully, my utility will be okay with the CA Rule 21 setting being enabled!

Oh, and that link is exactly what I had been looking for, thank you! (I had found a similar link on SMA's blog to Off-Grid Tech Info, but that link was dead)

-40 and -41 should have "off grid" or maybe called "island". I think SMA support previously told me that could be used.
Sunny Island disconnects when grid is out of spec, so utility will never see what -41 does with Rule 21 or other.

Let us know if Rule 21 frequency-watts is already there or you have to update software.

I had at one point wanted to have some Sunny Boy wired straight to grid, and have a transfer switch move them onto Sunny Island when grid was down (because Sunny Island can manage twice as much AC coupled PV as can go through 56A relay in the 120V US market.) SI was ideal for European market at 220V. But, transfer of an inverter from one AC source to another needs 5 seconds "off" time so it doesn't get connected to an out of phase AC supply, could blow it up. Now that I have more Sunny Island than I need, 2s2p x 56A relay gives me 120/240V at 112A.

Save the .pdf files. I can't find things searching by topic on SMA's site. I use Google to search for the name of the document (found at bottom of it), get the link and then I can share it. Probably you had a link to the old rev which SMA took down. Searching for similar name should find new rev number.

 

[Obie]

Okay so I'm not as smart as you guys. Help me out here. I can't figure out how to run the equalization.

In menu 120 battery meters
submenu number 5
says battery charge up: equalize

In menu 520 operation battery
submenu 01 charge select manual
I click enter start, ok? yes, enter. Nothing happens.

 

[Consumerbot3418]

Okay so I'm not as smart as you guys. Help me out here. I can't figure out how to run the equalization.

In menu 120 battery meters
submenu number 5
says battery charge up: equalize

In menu 520 operation battery
submenu 01 charge select manual
I click enter start, ok? yes, enter. Nothing happens.

From the manual:

13.4.4 Manual Equalization ChargeThe parameter "520.01 ChrgSelMan" activates the manual equalization charge on the Sunny Island. If a generator is connected to the system, it is automatically started and stopped once the equalization charge is completed.Change to an equalization chargeIf the Sunny Island changes to equalization charge after a specific time of boost charging or full charging has elapsed, these times are completely considered for the equalization charge. More than 1% of the nominal battery capacity is dischargedIf more than 1% of the nominal battery capacity is discharged during an equalization charge, 50% of the time elapsed is considered for the next constant voltage phase.External charging deviceIf an external charger or charge controller is connected to the battery and the criteria for an equalization charge are fulfilled due to external charging, the Sunny Island treats this as if it had performed the equalization charge itself.Carrying out the equalization chargeAn equalization charge should be performed at least once a year. After long periods of time without charging, e. g. in the case of plants which are only operated seasonally, equalization charges should always be performed manually at the end or at the beginning of the season.

Like I said, all I had to do was start the generator from the SI menu, in order for it to start. If you watch the display at idle, you should see a message indicating battery charge mode: equal.

 

[Consumerbot3418]

-40 and -41 should have "off grid" or maybe called "island". I think SMA support previously told me that could be used.
Sunny Island disconnects when grid is out of spec, so utility will never see what -41 does with Rule 21 or other.

Let us know if Rule 21 frequency-watts is already there or you have to update software.

Be glad to share the info, once I get the system installed and see how it operates.

transfer of an inverter from one AC source to another needs 5 seconds "off" time so it doesn't get connected to an out of phase AC supply, could blow it up.

I saw that on page 137 of the Sunny Island SI4548_6048-US-TB_en-13 Technical Description. That would seem to apply to the generator/grid connection on AC2. I can't seem to find a similar warning in the Sunny Boy documents...

 

[Pyrofx]

Anyone inspected the current trailers up for auction.specificly Vegas? Description says they have 6048 on them, but my buddies had 5048s from kingman and vegas

 

[Hedges]

Of course you want the SI 6048 rather than SI 5048 for a given price.

But if you can get a steep discount buying SI 5048 that would be the better deal. They seem to be the same product other than cooling or a slight efficiency difference. Both deliver the same surge and short-term power, but the power vs. ambient temperature of SI 5048 is lower for continuous and intermediate timeframe.

e.g.

SI-6048 SI-5048
5750W 5000W continuous at 25C
7000W 6500W for 30 minutes at 25C
8400W 8400W for 1 minute at 25C
11000W 11000W for 3 seconds at 25C

The other difference I'm aware of is SI 5048 has dual battery lug for two 2/0 cable (but I think I remember I couldn't get that size to fit).
SI 6048 has single lug for one 3/0 cable.

It appears they can run the same firmware. You can have different models on different phases, and firmware update of the master is pushed to the slaves.

 

[Anit767]

A quick follow-up on my trailer, and a question at the end for anyone else trying to use the trailer during outages. We had some nice weather recently, so I took the opportunity to check out the batteries. All were a bit low, but even, with the top of the plate showing. 10 gallons of distilled water later, they're all topped off. Every single cell was between 2.05-2.08V, vast majority at 2.6 or 2.7V--quite happy! After a 3 hour equalization run, I pulled about 16kWh out, and the SoC landed at 60%, so it looks like most of the capacity is there. Lucky me!

Without doing enough research, I purchased an entire DIY solar kit (8.76kW system with 7.7 Sunny Boy), and then I came across @Hedges post describing the poor interaction between his Sunny Island and Sunny Boy, with relays banging on and off, unless the Sunny Boy was placed in "off-grid" mode.

Now it looks like I've dug a hole for myself. It looks like I have the following two options, neither of which is attractive:

• Run the Sunny Boy in Grid-Tie mode. In an outage scenario, it will support the Sunny Island, which will charge the battery, then kick Sunny Boy offline completely when the battery is topped off, without smoothly dialing back the power output
• Install the Sunny Boy in Off-Grid mode, at the cost of being held hostage to being dependent on Sunny Island to handle any backfeed into the grid for net metering. I'd like to be able to keep the trailer intact, and be able to move it, so I really don't want to do this.

I had gone with the Sunny Boy specifically because I expected SMA equipment to play well together, so this a pretty big disappointment. Can only blame myself for failing to confirm compatibility ahead of purchase, though!

I'm now seriously considering a different inverter that will more smoothly handle supporting the Sunny Island in an outage... perhaps one that doesn't require a GridGuard code to switch between on/off grid? Since I haven't even taken delivery of the system yet, or applied for interconnection with the utility, I still have some time to weigh options. I'm curious to know if anybody else has already implemented an AC-coupled system to support the Sunny Islands when the trailer is being used as an emergency generator?

I was planning to go with Sunny boy / Sunny island just for the ac coupling feature. Can you recommend a string inverter that supports ac coupling? If Victron will do it, that’s probably my first choice. They seem to have great support.

 

[Hedges]

I was planning to go with Sunny boy / Sunny island just for the ac coupling feature. Can you recommend a string inverter that supports ac coupling? If Victron will do it, that’s probably my first choice. They seem to have great support.

Does Victron make an AC coupled PV string inverter? I thought they only had DC coupled SCC or maybe hybrid.
I do find web pages talking about using Victron battery inverters for AC coupling to other brand PV string inverters.

Sunny Island works well. For a new permitted on-grid system you might need their latest models. For off-grid the older models should be good. I haven't used other brands, but you want one that does frequency-watts.

Sunny Boy models that work:

https://files.sma.de/downloads/SB-OffGrid-TI-US-en-22.pdf

 

[Consumerbot3418]

-40 and -41 should have "off grid" or maybe called "island". I think SMA support previously told me that could be used.
Sunny Island disconnects when grid is out of spec, so utility will never see what -41 does with Rule 21 or other.

Let us know if Rule 21 frequency-watts is already there or you have to update software.

It's a bit embarrassing to revive this zombie thread over a year later (!!), but here I am, finally having gotten around to installing my AC-coupled 7.7 Sunny Boy (and corresponding 8.8kw PV), and can therefore finally answer the question.

I'm pretty sure that Rule 21 was an option during initial setup, but I ended up selecting "SMA Island Mode", since I'll be using Sunny Boy strictly with Sunny Island, and most likely will never backfeed the public utility. After configuration, I immediately installed the firmware updates, so now I can't confirm with 100% certainty that Rule 21 was there prior to updating. Attached a screenshot indicating the country standard selection on the current firmware, for what it's worth.

I've been run the house for 1 week completely off-grid (DC Solar Trailer w/ SB7.7), and pleasantly surprised at just how smoothly everything seems to run. As the battery reaches its full state, Sunny Island ramps up the frequency to dial back the output of the Sunny Boy. Battery stays topped off, and as loads are added, SB ramps up its output to match, with SI buffering during ramp-up and ramp-down.

 

[Hedges]

Sounds good, glad it works well.

I think mine have always operated smoothly in off-grid island mode.

I'm presently using 5000US in backup mode. Works part of the time, and periodically looses the "off-grid" signal from Sunny Island then disconnects for frequency above 60.5 Hz. I'd like to fix that, but I don't even know what that signal on RS-485 looks like. I can trigger a scope on other communications (from a monitoring device), but have never triggered while transitioning from on-grid to off-grid mode. It is annoying, hear the inverters drop off line with relay clack, later reconnect. Unnecessary cycles and wear.

It would at first glance seem that off-grid settings of PV inverter should be fine behind Sunny Island. SMA America made videos saying to configure -40/-41 that way. Support told me to configure 10000TL-US that way due to firmware bug affecting "backup" mode.

But, manual's instructions from SMA Germany say to use "backup" when behind Sunny Island on grid. Do they know something we don't, and that SMA America does not? @Elexide posted that Sunny Island is notorious for having grid relay stick shut. If that happened, you would have Sunny Boy configured for off-grid and connected to the grid. While not as bad as an off-grid battery inverter feeding the grid (would keep operating for any load under maximum), having no anti-islanding and wide parameters could mean continuing to backfeed grid, hazard for lineman.

By using "backup" mode, if Sunny Island knows its relays are stuck, it can not only stop generating AC but also not send the "offgrid" signal to Sunny Boy, so Sunny Boy performs UL-1741 anti-islanding and safely shuts off. (I guess an off-grid system with generator, if relay sticks, would backfeed generator from PV but at least not electrocute anyone.)

SI6048-US F605 Failure, TransfNotOpen

After about a year and a half my slave inverter in a 2 phase configuration has died. What was interesting is that it died in a strange way: AC1 and AC2 were bridged, so since grid power was still up, I didn't notice immediately that the inverter had failed. What was also interesting is that I...

diysolarforum.com

 

[Consumerbot3418]

Sounds good, glad it works well.

I think mine have always operated smoothly in off-grid island mode.

I'm presently using 5000US in backup mode. Works part of the time, and periodically looses the "off-grid" signal from Sunny Island then disconnects for frequency above 60.5 Hz. I'd like to fix that, but I don't even know what that signal on RS-485 looks like. I can trigger a scope on other communications (from a monitoring device), but have never triggered while transitioning from on-grid to off-grid mode. It is annoying, hear the inverters drop off line with relay clack, later reconnect. Unnecessary cycles and wear.

It would at first glance seem that off-grid settings of PV inverter should be fine behind Sunny Island. SMA America made videos saying to configure -40/-41 that way. Support told me to configure 10000TL-US that way due to firmware bug affecting "backup" mode.

But, manual's instructions from SMA Germany say to use "backup" when behind Sunny Island on grid. Do they know something we don't, and that SMA America does not? @Elexide posted that Sunny Island is notorious for having grid relay stick shut. If that happened, you would have Sunny Boy configured for off-grid and connected to the grid. While not as bad as an off-grid battery inverter feeding the grid (would keep operating for any load under maximum), having no anti-islanding and wide parameters could mean continuing to backfeed grid, hazard for lineman.

By using "backup" mode, if Sunny Island knows its relays are stuck, it can not only stop generating AC but also not send the "offgrid" signal to Sunny Boy, so Sunny Boy performs UL-1741 anti-islanding and safely shuts off. (I guess an off-grid system with generator, if relay sticks, would backfeed generator from PV but at least not electrocute anyone.)

SI6048-US F605 Failure, TransfNotOpen

After about a year and a half my slave inverter in a 2 phase configuration has died. What was interesting is that it died in a strange way: AC1 and AC2 were bridged, so since grid power was still up, I didn't notice immediately that the inverter had failed. What was also interesting is that I...

diysolarforum.com

I’ve done a LOT of reading, and encountered your concerns about that relay elsewhere. It’s concerning to me as well, but to a lesser extent. As presently configured, I’d only have the possibility of backfeeding the generator, as you said. Others have suggested that, in that case, the generator frequency would increase, which ought to kick SB offline, in theory. I’d expect the generator to never kick in during daytime, anyhow, so unless the stars align, and that relay gets stuck while the generator is running on a sunny day, AND the combined loads of the house plus SI charging batteries don’t eat up that power, I suppose I’ll never find out what would happen in practice.

Obviously, if I configure for a grid backup, the story changes. My tentative plan is to turn off utility power completely, and just rely on the generator if there’s a long streak of cloudy days. The 100 gallons of diesel contain circa 1Mwh of energy, by my estimation. If I don’t burn through it with the generator, I’d have to figure out what to do with it before it spoils. My tractor doesn’t use that much fuel in a year, and I’m loathe to risk running it in my pickup, as I regrettably bought off-road diesel to fill that tank. So, burn it on cloudy winter days (nights) to run the heat pump, maintain the FLA batteries, and exercise the genset. The monthly utility availability charges saved would offset the expense of the first 5 gallons of diesel each month.

Before executing my plan, I’ll want to learn how long it will take to turn grid power back on in case the generator or sunny islands fail, and how steep the fees.

It’s unfortunate that I won’t be able to take advantage of net metering, but passing a state code inspection to qualify isn’t even remotely feasible. At least it saves me the concerns of frying a lineman!

 

[offgriddave]

Hey wow!

These are STILL available

I'm nearby one with no bids -4 hours away. (Do the bids come in at the last minute or something?)

I don't understand the specifications. No where is listed the capacity or ratings?

There's a 2014 and 2016 model. I'm asuming these are lead acid batteries? Are they dead now?

Is the market still flooded?

Can I use my 48v LifePho battery (58v) with the SMA's?

where's the specs? 240 split phase? how many watts solar? Crazy there are no details. Or I am lost at finding them.

Anyone care to pitch in the info?

 

[Supervstech]

Hey wow!

These are STILL available

I'm nearby one with no bids -4 hours away. (Do the bids come in at the last minute or something?)

I don't understand the specifications. No where is listed the capacity or ratings?

There's a 2014 and 2016 model. I'm asuming these are lead acid batteries? Are they dead now?

Is the market still flooded?

Can I use my 48v LifePho battery (58v) with the SMA's?

where's the specs? 240 split phase? how many watts solar? Crazy there are no details. Or I am lost at finding them.

Anyone care to pitch in the info?

What's the link for the auction?

 

[Consumerbot3418]

What's the link for the auction?

I guess he didn’t want anyone bidding against him. ?

 

[Consumerbot3418]

Hey wow!

These are STILL available

I'm nearby one with no bids -4 hours away. (Do the bids come in at the last minute or something?)

I don't understand the specifications. No where is listed the capacity or ratings?

There's a 2014 and 2016 model. I'm asuming these are lead acid batteries? Are they dead now?

Is the market still flooded?

Can I use my 48v LifePho battery (58v) with the SMA's?

where's the specs? 240 split phase? how many watts solar? Crazy there are no details. Or I am lost at finding them.

Anyone care to pitch in the info?

I don’t think the market is flooded anymore. Price on the sunny islands has gone up drastically.

Yes, with a firmware update and a compatible bms you can use a lifepo battery. Split phase 240, about 2000w PV onboard.

 

[offgriddave]

Link to auction:

2013 SCT 20 Mobile Solar Generator From DC Solar consist of: 2 SMA Converters, Midnight Classic controller, 2 x 48v Batteries, and 10 Solar Panels, Vin: 4HXSC1620DC165906 (TIRES NEED AIR) (11555 OLD OREGON TRAIL REDDING, CA 96003) (10 TO 12 WEEKS FOR

2013 SCT 20 Mobile Solar Generator From DC Solar consist of: 2 SMA Converters, Midnight Classic controller, 2 x 48v Batteries, and 10 Solar Panels, Vin: 4HXSC1620DC165906 (TIRES NEED AIR) (11555 OLD OREGON TRAIL REDDING, CA 96003) (10 TO 12 WEEKS FOR TITLE DELIVERY)

cagp.industrialbid.com

 

[Consumerbot3418]

Link to auction:

2013 SCT 20 Mobile Solar Generator From DC Solar consist of: 2 SMA Converters, Midnight Classic controller, 2 x 48v Batteries, and 10 Solar Panels, Vin: 4HXSC1620DC165906 (TIRES NEED AIR) (11555 OLD OREGON TRAIL REDDING, CA 96003) (10 TO 12 WEEKS FOR

2013 SCT 20 Mobile Solar Generator From DC Solar consist of: 2 SMA Converters, Midnight Classic controller, 2 x 48v Batteries, and 10 Solar Panels, Vin: 4HXSC1620DC165906 (TIRES NEED AIR) (11555 OLD OREGON TRAIL REDDING, CA 96003) (10 TO 12 WEEKS FOR TITLE DELIVERY)

cagp.industrialbid.com

Thanks for the link.

Wow, I thought they’d liquidated them all already.

There’s a Facebook group called “DC Solar Auctioned Trailer Discovery” with lots of info, as well as in this forum.

I’d bid with the expectation that the batteries are shot, with a possibility (if not likelihood) that they can be rejuvenated. The one I got was actually in decent shape, but several years newer. It had less than 50 hours on the generator, and I ended up having an issue with corroded wiring that caused the solar charging to stop working. It was a simple fix for me, and apparently an odd case, since nobody else had seen it before.

I do find it odd that mine was bought through “bid industrial” via Cunningham, whereas your link is for “industrialbid.com”. I assume it’s not a scam site, but find it odd that nobody is talking about it on the Facebook group yet.

A quick check of the last completed auctions on Cunningham (bid industrial) shows the models with light towers went for $14-15k this summer. Make sure you account for that buyer’s premium, sales tax, and transportation if/when you bid. Good luck!

Oh, and yeah, as with most auctions, expect most of the activity towards the tail end.

 

[offgriddave]

I see these for sale at like U haul rental parking lots. The same type of lots that sell tiny barns. I never see them sell. I didn't know it was a ponzi scheme to rip of Warren Buffet. To me they don't really make sense technically. I want one because I won't have to deal with building codes. I have no idea what the sunny islands are? Is that the all in one inverters?

 

[Consumerbot3418]

I see these for sale at like U haul rental parking lots. The same type of lots that sell tiny barns. I never see them sell. I didn't know it was a ponzi scheme to rip of Warren Buffet. To me they don't really make sense technically. I want one because I won't have to deal with building codes. I have no idea what the sunny islands are? Is that the all in one inverters?

Basically an all in one off-grid power setup. Some guys are taking them apart, and running their cabin or small house off them. They are way under-paneled.

The appeal is having a turn-key off-grid setup. Sunny Islands are fantastic German engineered off-grid battery inverters. They do DC to AC to provide household electric from the two forklift batteries, and if you add AC coupled PV (such as grid tied inverters like sunny boy), they’ll charge the batteries from the excess. They don’t have any built in PV MPPT whatsoever. DC Solar uses a midnite solar classic 250 (custom made for DC Solar, lacking some specific features) to charge the batteries, but again, it’s severely under paneled. If you drain the batteries, it would take several (4-5) days of perfectly sunny weather to charge them again.

Oh, and I don’t think it was actually a ponzi, just outright fraud…

 

[Ralo]

My guess is that these leftover trailers didn't sell originally because of their condition. These are older models and likely have dead batteries. I bought two from one of the early auctions and the batteries on one of them was in poor condition. I'm still using them but the capacity is probably 50% on that trailer. I'm using them to power my fifthwheel after adding more panels and string inverters.