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120v or 12v pump for lake draw/pressure tank setup?

Finally, if building fresh now, build WITH future thinking, it IS expensive to upgrade after the fact. Build whatever system with a Solid Foundation that addresses future expansion/growth is the best $$ insurance you can give yourself. Everyone ALWAYS underestimate their usage by a minimum of 25% and sometimes worse and within 12 months they are grumbling, upgrading and not telling anyone because they are embarrassed for not engaging in Critical Thinking from the start.

Sorry to put it that Bluntly but I've been at this too long and seen far too many run around that same mulberry bush, over & over & over again, there's a frickin MOAT around that ruddy bush now.

Sorry to put it that Bluntly but I've been at this too long and seen far too many run around that same mulberry bush, over & over & over again, there's a frickin MOAT around that ruddy bush now.

@Steve_S I totally agree with you and I will check out your setup! I'm currently planning a full Victron system and might ask for your expert input once I get the diagram figured out.

I figured I was correct on the submersible pump and lake rule.

I've ran into a snag with my pump situation though. Short term I probably won't get to installing my main solar setup to at least the fall and even then I may wait till next year. Need some water before then.

The grundfos 120v 1/3hp jet pump I found looks perfect....however from my calculations it will still draw a TON of power from the inverter/batteries. The I ( n) rating is 6.6a and the I(start) is 22 at 120vac. So ~750w running vs ~2600w start. I was only thinking of using a single or dual battery and inverter setup down by the lake until I get my big setup in place. I'm not sure even 2 12v batteries in parallel or series on a 24v system will handle that kind of draw throughout the day?

So I was looking at the aquatec 12V or 24v pumps as a temporary measure. Does anyone know if they will handle a pressure tank? Or would I basically run it on demand anytime we want to fire up the shower or do dishes?
 
Couple of things, some which you probably clued into by now... Solar Supplies and bits are a PITA right now for many reasons and many are playing profiteering games as a result. I just had to buy Terminals for battery packs... $22 in the US but the lowest of $45 here.... EA PIECE no less. So I suggest get your plan and do very careful and cautious shopping if you're going to collect all the pieces over summer for a Fall Install.

I honestly cannot guide you on 12/24V pumps to Pressure Tanks. If was just a regular Holding Tank that's one thing but a pressure tank is another beast for loads etc. Some of our fellow Cabineers do that and use a 12/24V pump at the tank to create positive pressure when needed, so it's not just gravity. This may be an option to explore for a temp solution.

2600W Surge seems a bit high (been a longtime since I have used a non soft-start pump) but it is only a short 22A draw so you will need a 120V/20A circuit for it. 12V @ 250A can deliver 120V/3000W BUT do you want to buy that for temp and then bigger better & more $ later again ? Possibly try a cheaper "Car Inverter" that has a minimum 3000W rating. Have a quicky look at the link below for 3000W+ that you can buy in town. I have a 3000W one shown there that I used for a Temporary thing and was pulling up to 2000W without problem (note was connected directly to truck battery)

 
Oh, you have been exactly there and made an analysis of the water?
No. But beaver and deer are everywhere…
I’ve had a couple water-related illnesses including giardia and I’m more than sorta outdoorsy. Proceed at your own peril. Unaware doesn’t equal not existing.
it will still draw a TON of power from the inverter/batteries. The I ( n) rating is 6.6a and the I(start) is 22 at 120vac. So ~750w running vs ~2600w start
What I’ve been using for four years (except winter an inside 20gal) is one of those 250gal tote tanks. Spring water mostly. I still bleach when it’s warm. (Mine’s on a purpose-built trailer.) A gasoline pump is (or used to be) under $200. Fill reservoir periodically.
looking at the aquatec 12V or 24v pumps as a temporary measure. Does anyone know if they will handle a pressure tank?
I like the flojet internally pressure balance pumps. I did use a 1-gal bladder tank with my original setup 20+ years ago. But the 12V ‘quiet quad’ pump doesn’t require it- it runs with no surge.
Pump from the reservoir tank close to camp and it will do fine.
Or would I basically run it on demand anytime we want to fire up the shower or do dishes?
The “balanced” pumps I’ve used have a no-pulse/surge feature so they run on demand. I have mine switched by a 30- minute timer, but you could wire it to a switch, too.
Yes, on demand.

Distance from lake is an issue. Flojet will lift 26’ but not so well on suction side. However, the resistance of pipe/tube/hose over 25-ish feet even horizontal starts to make it inefficient.

That is the idea of the reservoir: no resistance over distance. Plus the opportunity to chlorinate the water, you can “trailer” other water if desired, and rainwater collection is possible ( a couple summers back it didn’t rain a lot like normal but when it did every week or whatever I could collect over a hundred gallons in one thunderstorm. Probably could have done more but it was just a makeshift setup off a nearby old metal roof. I didn’t tow for water for months.)
 
No. But beaver and deer are everywhere…
I’ve had a couple water-related illnesses including giardia and I’m more than sorta outdoorsy. Proceed at your own peril. Unaware doesn’t equal not existing.

What I’ve been using for four years (except winter an inside 20gal) is one of those 250gal tote tanks. Spring water mostly. I still bleach when it’s warm. (Mine’s on a purpose-built trailer.) A gasoline pump is (or used to be) under $200. Fill reservoir periodically.

I like the flojet internally pressure balance pumps. I did use a 1-gal bladder tank with my original setup 20+ years ago. But the 12V ‘quiet quad’ pump doesn’t require it- it runs with no surge.
Pump from the reservoir tank close to camp and it will do fine.

The “balanced” pumps I’ve used have a no-pulse/surge feature so they run on demand. I have mine switched by a 30- minute timer, but you could wire it to a switch, too.
Yes, on demand.

Distance from lake is an issue. Flojet will lift 26’ but not so well on suction side. However, the resistance of pipe/tube/hose over 25-ish feet even horizontal starts to make it inefficient.

That is the idea of the reservoir: no resistance over distance. Plus the opportunity to chlorinate the water, you can “trailer” other water if desired, and rainwater collection is possible ( a couple summers back it didn’t rain a lot like normal but when it did every week or whatever I could collect over a hundred gallons in one thunderstorm. Probably could have done more but it was just a makeshift setup off a nearby old metal roof. I didn’t tow for water for months.)

I have a similar set up as yours except I have a 500 gallon water tank and two 115v flojet water pumps which is identical to the 12v version. I originally started out only using one. It was quiet and had adequate water flow, but I wanted more for my showers so I added a second one in parallel. I like my showers a lot more now but the downside is having two pumps means more than twice the noise.

SHURflo Industrial Pump - 198 GPH, 115 Volt, 1/2in, Model# 2088-594-154

 
Is the water system used year round? If not planned to be used below freezing I would suggest a simple external water setup. I'll add the only picture I have and write the details.
 

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The grey box is built out of plywood, the angled lid is actually a hinged door with a single 100w panel mounted to it. Inside the box the panel feeds a cheap pwm controller charging a 12v deep cycle battery. Located in the same box is a simple 12v rv pump wired directly to the battery with a fuse.

The box can be placed right at the waters edge or fairly close to the shoreline, we put it right on our dock where it receives the best possible sun throughout the season.

The inlet of the pump is 1/2 inch poly pipe with a foot valve to maintain prime. The outlet is also 1/2 inch poly pipe which is run uphill about 80ft to the cabin plumbing. This system can also be used with a pressure tank however we don't see the need. It would help to reduce cycles I guess and smooth out the pressure. System runs great for showering, dishes etc. Trouble free essentially and running for years now. For winter the pump gets antifreeze put through it and fuse taken out. Box just stays outside and maintains battery through the winter.
 
IF you have a bit of slope/head pressure to work with, get a 200 gallon or larger tank and fill it during the day, and gravity flow it to your point of use, 24/7. I've installed several systems using the Grundfos SQ Flex line of pumps, some with an array right by the well head, signal wires, 24 gauge, and their control box controls the pump from several hundred feet away. It had a 1000 gallon tank buried in a hillside, used year round at a high mountain cabin, about 25 pounds of pressure in that case, low but doable.

My own off grid house had a 625' deep well, and I was pumping 1.5 GPM using my main solar array, it pumped into a 1000 gallon tank buried in the floor of my shop, with a overflow line buried along with the supply line going to the house 75' away. I had a voltage controlled switch, set up to only pump water once my main 2000 pound forklift battery reached float voltage, then and only then would the pump start to fill the tank. When the tank reached full, a float switch shut the pump down. In the shop's bathroom, a separate 24 VDC pressure pump supplied 35 PSI water to my 80 gallon pressure tank. It was very nearly "city" style flow and pressure, unless you tried to water a lawn or something, for domestic use, cooking and bathing etc., the system worked trouble free for decades.

But the real reason I wanted to post here....is since I abandoned my first spring site on my new property, which was pumped by a Aqua-Tec SWP-4000, in a screened springbox, about 60' lower and 400' lineal to a 900 gallon tank in my hangar (got to keep the grass runway green of course) and had it's own 24 VDC 220 W array nearby. The pump would run whenver there was any brightness at all, could be quite cloudy even, it would just pump slower. Once the tank was full, a float valve would shut, and then the overflow would go out into some trees. Since I recently bought another chunk of ground below my main place, that turned out to have a 15 GPM spring (that hasn't wavered in the last 100 years I'm told!!) I promptly installed a Grundfos SQ Flex pump, a 1040 watt PV array, a 500 gallon holding tank at the spring's outlet, 2100' of 1" poly, buried uphill 300' higher, and a 2000 gallon at the top of my property to give me gravity flow water over the entire 70 acres, I NO LONGER NEED THE AQUATEC PUMP, AND IT'S FOR SALE! That was a long way to go to get my sales pitch in! It's in fine shape, used 3 seasons, and has the control box included. This is a diaphram pump, and it's good practice I'm told to replace the diaphram every few years, depending on use, parts are cheap and readily available, USA built and supported! But I have not felt the need so have not done so. Unless a buyer is quite close to Idaho, the two 110 watt panels that run it wouldn't be worth the shipping cost, I can add them to my "misc." solar gear pile. A quick look around and they seem to be currently priced at $560.00 for the pump, and $236.00 for the controller. call it $800.00. I am asking $450.00 for both. And I'll split the shipping from area code 83245 to the buyers, up to $25.00 anyway.

As an aside, now that my new place (16 years new) is grid tied, my 185' deep well has a basic 1/3 hp 240 AC Grundfos conventional well pump, which goes to a 120 gallon pressure. I figure my emergency water is the 900 gallon hangar tank, and now an additional 2000 gallon tank, plus the creek is within bucket hauling distance, if it gets real Armageddonish.
 

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