16s Chevy Volt 64v battery BMS and Inverter.
- Thread starter mikaj
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64V? Wouldn't this be closer to a 58.4V (~3.65V/cell) nominal battery? Assuming 4.2V/cell peak, 16 * 4.2 = 67.2V.
Limiting that chemistry to 4.05V peak (about 80% SoC) results in extended cycle life. 16*4.05V = 64.8V. Delightfully, this is the typical peak voltage for a 48V lead-acid equalization charge and many 48V inverters should operate at this level. My Victron Quattro has a published voltage limit of 66V.
I'm building a 14S Energi-based LMO/NMC battery and had considered 16S, but 14S is just way easier.
Limiting that chemistry to 4.05V peak (about 80% SoC) results in extended cycle life. 16*4.05V = 64.8V. Delightfully, this is the typical peak voltage for a 48V lead-acid equalization charge and many 48V inverters should operate at this level. My Victron Quattro has a published voltage limit of 66V.
I'm building a 14S Energi-based LMO/NMC battery and had considered 16S, but 14S is just way easier.
I have been told That the Victron Quattro is the only 48v inverter that can handle that high voltage reliably. Was hoping there might be a cheaper reliable option. The other option is to break down the submodules into smaller 12s groups, but would rather not cut the bus bars and keep 16s.
Thanks for the reply
https://watts247.com/product/pip-3048lv-mk/ can to 64V.
"cheap" and "reliable" are often mutually exclusive.
Victron and that level of hardware is what you buy and EXPECT long and reliable service. The cheap stuff is what you buy and HOPE is reliable.
"cheap" and "reliable" are often mutually exclusive.
Victron and that level of hardware is what you buy and EXPECT long and reliable service. The cheap stuff is what you buy and HOPE is reliable.
Just because that battery CAN go to 64v, doesn't mean you HAVE to charge it to 64v. This is what snoobler was saying. Even with the 3.2v cells, many people aren't charging them to their full 3.65v capacity.
Cheap 4-life
My body is 2.63 trillion volts, .07v per cell
Reliable brand inverter is what I use for my 16s Chevy volt batteries. It’s the newer better reliable version tho. I’m using reliable because it will rarely get used. I use grid tie inverters powered from the batteries 24/7
I had to look up reliable inverters, I thought this was the funniest response to my post. Then realized that reliable is a brand. I thought you were poking fun at my comment looking for a cheap inverter. is it programable? does it shut off at 61v for high voltage shut off?
Thanks for the help.
I suppose the Quattro 48v 3000w inverter would likely have the lowest standby draw at 25w. Are you happy with your Quattro? Would it work well also with a 12s chevy volt battery? I plan to charge to 4.07v or so and discharge to no less than 3.5v per cell.
Cheap 4-life
My body is 2.63 trillion volts, .07v per cell
You can get them from 12v to 120v dc
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No. I'm thrilled with it. I'm guessing you haven't priced them...
12S is marginal, but the Quattro can handle down to 38V.
Snoobler: Did you finish up this battery, and if so, how is it working? I'm very interested in your thoughts on the subject of charging 16s to a lower voltage threshold. About a year or so ago I read a very detailed Samsung white paper on the topic of NMC batteries, but for the life of me I cannot find it now. My vague recollection was that a high portion of the energy of those prismatic cells was in the upper voltage range, like over 4.1 volts. But, I could simply be not remembering correctly.
I have a lot of 8s and 16s batteries, and am waffling back and forth on removing 1 or 2 cells, and making them 14s. Or, just leaving them as is and not charge all the way up. I also remember that Battery Hookup used to say that the BMW cells in particular contained their energy at the top end of the charge profile. I don't have the BMW cells, but wonder if this applies to other SDI cells as well. It seems to be the consensus that a lower charge level will increase lifespan, which is a good thing.
People on this forum discuss things like cutting buss bars and modifying modules. I can see how that would be pretty easy to do if your are working with nickle strips, but not as easy to cut into something like an automotive module. I also have some 12s modules, so the same idea can be applied, but in that case, using a couple spare modules to increase the cell count to 14-16.
Just like to know your thoughts. Thanks in advance!
A lot of the outback inverters can work with and also charge up to 68 volts. These would work well with 16s 4.1 volts each. These BMWs do not charge much more than 4.1. some models 4.15 others 4.1. I'm wondering if they need compression or not because the project car that I'm trying to put them in has wide air gaps between all the cells for cooling.
If removed from plastic boxes it will require compression otherwise you will have problems.
Good luck
I'm thinking I'll have to 3D print some spacers to go between them that will still let the air flow through. Or else make a strong aluminum sleeve to slide the cell into. Have you seen examples of these BMW cells having problems because there was no compression?
Yes i have with packs that had manufacturers defects.
So it was the lack of compression that caused the problem or the manufacturer defects that caused the problem? Can you recommend any good threads that have lots of info on these BMW modules? I have 12 cell modules and I also have the 16 cell modules. 50khw total. Plenty enough to motivate me to learn the rules with them.
Not much is known besides company employees and whatever people dig out from junk yards. Can you post one of the exposed battery cells and i will try to research employees resources on the portal. If you can provide year and model that will be nice and for what market is EV designed. If you have enough space you can use battery box it comes with and you can implement coolant plates for heating and cooling you can use outside radiator with fan only. For heating you can source aftermarket PTC coolant heater . It will be over kill for stationary energy storage system...but if you have already battery box it will not be very difficult to reverse engineer . Thermoelectric cooling is already doing well and it is sufficient for stationary battery. Changing order with bus terminals and braking down modules to make it work for your off grid battery voltage is not the problem. You can also make bridge that will open and brake down ( example 48+V system when charging to 24+ V system ) . You should also take one single cell out and preform cell charging and discharging scenario and Voltage idle threshold when charged to full and drops to saturated voltage. This will be your max per cell voltage that you will use and by doing it you will also figure out absorption time and amperage cut out. One off grid battery setup i have done for customer with BMW modules where with Victron MPPT absorption 5 hours or 0.5 A whatever kicks in first it will go to float. And rebulk if voltage drops 1 V from float mode for more than one minute. There is no need to recharge 50 KWh battery couple times a day unless you have extreme energy use per day. Scenario is quite difficult to make without all the things you already have available or considering to buy and complete custom project.
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