280ah cells

Gazoo

Dumb Dumb
Just got a text from Fedex with a delivery date of 10/19. Anyone else in the first group buy get a shipping notice?
I'm psyched!!!!!!!!
Dave
Yes, just received my notice too. It may be a week or so before I can get to balancing them but I will surely inspect the cells.
My delivery date is scheduled for 10/16.... :p
 

Michael B Caro

Solar Addict
The cells I ordered shipped to me are due to be delivered UPS by 2:30pm on Friday.

Also, I just ordered 4 of the Lishen cells to be shipped to Craig by air freight, that I will be paying for myself. He should have then in 15 days or so and has agreed to test them for me so that we will all have a good idea of how Lishen stacks up.
 

Michael B Caro

Solar Addict
Ok, I think I have messaged everyone that I had promised to get back on with a quote that asked for one during the Chinese Holiday. Now the prices are posted and if anyone asks for a quote I can give them a price immediately instead of the back and forth with the other system. If I missed anyone, just let me know.

I am getting a LOT of requests for cells shipped fast out of what I ordered to have on hand. So much so that I will not be able to do much more of that until everyone gets their cells and makes sure there were none damaged in shipping.

I will be ordering a larger stock to keep on hand now....much larger.... to be able to oblige those that need them fast.
Also, I got some prices on having them sent air fright and they are not as terrible as I thought they would be.....not cheap for sure but not quite as bad as I thought.
 

Prefersdirt

Solar Enthusiast
Your post had me check. Mine left CA on the 13th. Supposed to be delivered this coming Monday (Oct 19). Well, going to be a while before I can get to them now. (I FINALLY get to go work at refilling the freezer).

Time to figure out what else I need to order. Watch the general discussion for those threads. :)
 

Dzl

Unoffical Forum Librarian
Staff member
Moderator
Congrats on the first group buy beginning to trickle in, I hope all continues to go well, I know its been a lot of work for you, Michael, and a lot of collective anticipation for everyone involved. Glad its going smooth so far. If someone could post a few pics of the packaging and product when they get a chance I know many folks would appreciate that.
 

Gazoo

Dumb Dumb
I would like photos of the buss bars please. Thank you... :) Happy yours were received in good shape.
 

Michael B Caro

Solar Addict
Delivered to my son's house and he took the pictures for me. He didnt see the bus bars and screws but will look for them and take pics of them when he gets home.
He said all the boxes looked like they were in great shape.
I am happy with everything except that the capacity was printed on the label and not written by hand. So I am guessing that they are all labeled 280ah and that makes me question if they really tested each one for capacity. I will address that when they get into work for the day.
 

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Gazoo

Dumb Dumb
I am happy with everything except that the capacity was printed on the label and not written by hand.
I am not surprised. Capacity testing adds to cost. It will be interesting to know what they say about it. If they didn't capacity test each cell I won't be disappointed at all. Hopefully the IR measurements and voltages will be close to each other. I also hope the buss bars are decent.

They did write the Voltage and IR on the cells and that's great. Looking forward to getting mine. They are being delivered to a friends house tomorrow. I live in a fairly large apartment complex and I did not want them delivered here. I will get them over the weekend, inspect them and report back.

It's going to take me some time to get everything and build the pack. So far I have grub screws, nuts and some blue Loctite...lol. And the Riden power supply I told you about. Planning on parallel top balancing next week. Then I need to get the BMS and fuse for the battery ordered and make the fixture.

Thanks again for everything.
 
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Michael B Caro

Solar Addict
I am not surprised. Capacity testing adds to cost. It will be interesting to know what they say about it. If they didn't capacity test each cell I won't be disappointed at all. Hopefully the IR measurements and voltages will be close to each other. I also hope the buss bars are decent.

They did write the Voltage and IR on the cells and that's great. Looking forward to getting mine. They are being delivered to a friends house tomorrow. I live in a fairly large apartment complex and I did not want them delivered here. I will get them over the weekend, inspect them and report back.

It's going to take me some time to get everything and build the pack. So far I have grub screws, nuts and some blue Loctite...lol. And the Riden power supply I told you about. Planning on parallel top balancing next week. Then I need to get the BMS and fuse for the battery ordered and make the fixture.

Thanks again for everything.
I understand what you are saying about the capacity testing, but if there were not going to do it they should have just said they wouldn't do it. Perhaps they did but just labeled them all as 280ah even if they were over that and did not ship anything under that. I don't really know yet.

I will see if my son will get all four cells out of that box for me and take pics of all of the labels so we can see how well matched they are.
 

Dzl

Unoffical Forum Librarian
Staff member
Moderator
I am not surprised. Capacity testing adds to cost. It will be interesting to know what they say about it. If they didn't capacity test each cell I won't be disappointed at all. Hopefully the IR measurements and voltages will be close to each other. I also hope the buss bars are decent.

They did write the Voltage and IR on the cells and that's great. Looking forward to getting mine. They are being delivered to a friends house tomorrow. I live in a fairly large apartment complex and I did not want them delivered here. I will get them over the weekend, inspect them and report back.

It's going to take me some time to get everything and build the pack. So far I have grub screws, nuts and some blue Loctite...lol. And the Riden power supply I told you about. Planning on parallel top balancing next week. Then I need to get the BMS and fuse for the battery ordered and make the fixture.

Thanks again for everything.
I understand what you are saying about the capacity testing, but if there were not going to do it they should have just said they wouldn't do it. Perhaps they did but just labeled them all as 280ah even if they were over that and did not ship anything under that. I don't really know yet.

I will see if my son will get all four cells out of that box for me and take pics of all of the labels so we can see how well matched they are.

I would only fault them for the lack of capacity testing, if they explicitly stated or otherwise implied that the cells would be individually capacity tested. While many people erroneously assume resellers are doing this, I am not aware of any who are confirmed to actually do this. If however you were given assurance they would be capacity tested, I hope you followup with the reseller to see what the explanation is. Its possible that they believe or can verify that capacity testing is done upstream of them by the wholesaler, middleman, or manufacturer they buy from. As an example I know with CALB cells for instance (which seem a little more legit, less wild-westy, even on the grey market) even legit grey market cells--should come with the actual capacity handwritten on each cell and/or in a cell testing and report page included with the cells (one example from @HighTechLab). Its possible they misunderstood the meaning, and do some sort of randomized testing on a subset of cells but don't individually test, or its possible they just dropped the ball or misled you. In either case, I don't think lack of capacity testing is a dealbreaker, but honesty/clarity is important. I look forward to hearing what you find out. Not to put the burden on you, but I think with these group buys, you are in a position to help improve the transparency, clarity, and integrity we all crave from these resellers (and in fact I think you have already begun to make a meaningful impact in this regard).
 

Gazoo

Dumb Dumb
I understand what you are saying about the capacity testing, but if there were not going to do it they should have just said they wouldn't do it. Perhaps they did but just labeled them all as 280ah even if they were over that and did not ship anything under that. I don't really know yet.
I understand your view. At this point the only way to know for sure is to capacity test them ourselves.....regardless of what they told you or will tell you. Capacity testing and matching cells costs money and could have added around $15.00 to each cell from what I have read. I only know of one, maybe two that received a cell that didn't live up to the capacity. It doesn't matter to me whether they capacity tested or not, but I understand the reasons it matters to you.

I am going to wait until I have everything hooked up and capacity test with a load hooked up to whatever inverter I decide on. Some capacity test each cell before hooking them up is series and that's not a bad idea. I am confident enough to skip that step based on all the great reports regarding these cells.
 
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Gazoo

Dumb Dumb
Its possible they misunderstood the meaning,
I thought about that too. I had that experience chatting back and forth with Billion regarding the IR mismatch of the Lishen cells. These were the 200 amp cells with studs mounted, not the 277 amp cells. In the end all was well and I was refunded and committed to this group buy. The point is words can and do get lost in the translation.
 
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Dzl

Unoffical Forum Librarian
Staff member
Moderator
I understand your view. At this point the only way to know for sure is to capacity test them ourselves.....regardless of what they told you or will tell you. Capacity testing and matching cells costs money and could have added around $15.00 to each cell from what I have read. I only know of one, maybe two that received a cell that didn't live up to the capacity. It doesn't matter to me whether they capacity tested or not, but I understand the reasons it matters to you.

I am going to wait until I have everything hooked up and capacity test with a load hooked up to whatever inverter I decide on. Some capacity test each cell before hooking them up is series and that's not a bad idea. I am confident enough to skip that step based on all the great reports regarding these cells.

The below is speculation, on a subject I have at best a shaky understanding of:

I wonder if the purpose of capacity testing is as much for the purpose of matching as it is for verification of rated capacity.

I agree with you that by now, its a fairly safe assumption that 280 EVE cells will meet or modestly exceed that nominal capacity, or if they do not will be within a few Ah of the nominal rating.

But I suspect that the larger benefit of pre-shipment capacity testing (in theory) is as much for the purpose of matching capacity between cells as it is for verifying the cells meet nominal capacity.

My thinking is that much like people generally don't recommend mixing batteries of different capacities, if cells differ in actual capacity, not only could usable capacity be bottlenecked by the lowest capacity cell, but cell wear over time would be different, and the cell that begins life with the lowest tested capacity will wear/lose capacity faster than the rest as it is getting stressed a little harder each charge/discharge.

The question I would pose and may be worth exploring is whether it would be preferable to receive 4 cells that test to 277Ah, or 3 x cells that test to 287Ah and one that tests to 280Ah. Put differently, what is more important, absolute capacity, or difference between individual cell capacities?


Though this is on topic theoretically, it may be irrelevant for this discussion, as in order for pre-shipment capacity testing to allow matching, it would need to be done in large enough volume to allow matching, and then further narrowed down by IR matching (or vice versa). It could not be done like the IR and Voltage testing/matching, where the seller just tests a batch of cells before shipping. Large batches would need to be tested and binned/grouped, the larger the better. It is my understanding that this is the process that would normally be performed by the manufacturer for non-grey market cells, but I am unaware if any grey market seller does or does not get anywhere close to this in practice, I expect not.
 

ArthurEld

Solar Addict
The thing about the testing that I don't get is that everyone says you can't trust the testing.
You have to verify anyway. If you come up with different numbers do you think you could demand a refund? I guess there is some value in it. I wouldn't be surprised if there is a list in one of my boxes with test results. I guess I could report it here if I come up with different numbers.
If everyone reported that a seller did accurate testing then everyone would buy from that seller. I haven't seen any of that kind of reporting.
The numbers I care about are the ones I come up with.
 
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