2x Sol-Ark 15K's + HomeGrid Stacks

[niktak11]

Yes Insurance covered all of it but only after I provided extra justification to show the panels that didn't have visible holes in them were still compromised. Additionally it would have been more expensive to just replace with previous panels as they were out of stock.

Other people I know didn't have as much trouble with their insurance company. I have Travelers and they were great for the house but not so on solar panels. I will be moving away from them because of my experience with them covering the damage. I had to do way too much work to justify the replacement.

Did your insurance company know about the panels beforehand?

 

[Hedges]

I asked CSAA about my ground mount panels. Not covered, but they offered a rider that cost something like 50% or 100% of my homeowner's policy so I declined. (the panels 20 years ago were maybe 25% or less of house replacement value.) Since then panels have declined 90% and I had no losses, so self-insuring turned out to be the way to go.

I would presume mounted on roof they would have covered under the policy, but probably increased premium for greater value of "improvements."

I did ask if the ground-mount panels would be considered "personal property", which the standard policy covers to about 50% of house value (excluding things like furs, jewelry, other high value items unless listed.) Nope, not covered as personal property as I'd hoped.

 

[niktak11]

I asked CSAA about my ground mount panels. Not covered, but they offered a rider that cost something like 50% or 100% of my homeowner's policy so I declined. (the panels 20 years ago were maybe 25% or less of house replacement value.) Since then panels have declined 90% and I had no losses, so self-insuring turned out to be the way to go.

I would presume mounted on roof they would have covered under the policy, but probably increased premium for greater value of "improvements."

I did ask if the ground-mount panels would be considered "personal property", which the standard policy covers to about 50% of house value (excluding things like furs, jewelry, other high value items unless listed.) Nope, not covered as personal property as I'd hoped.

Sounds like I better invest in some SPDs

 

[Hedges]

I don't know that insurance would ever cover electronics damaged by surges. Hopefully cover fire damage.
Surge damage can be cumulative. If connected to grid, have surge arrestors. Qualifying grid power through an inverter should protect your downstream loads from brownouts.

PV array, I think surge less likely unless lightning is common. That can couple in.

Midnight has what look like good surge arrestors, with lights to indicate "protecting" and "failed".
I got an industrial surge arrestor as new old stock. Some of my SMA inverters have MOV on PV inputs. I've bought a bunch to make my own for the inverters that don't (but not protecting anything sitting on my shelf!)

 

[niktak11]

I don't know that insurance would ever cover electronics damaged by surges. Hopefully cover fire damage.
Surge damage can be cumulative. If connected to grid, have surge arrestors. Qualifying grid power through an inverter should protect your downstream loads from brownouts.

PV array, I think surge less likely unless lightning is common. That can couple in.

Midnight has what look like good surge arrestors, with lights to indicate "protecting" and "failed".
I got an industrial surge arrestor as new old stock. Some of my SMA inverters have MOV on PV inputs. I've bought a bunch to make my own for the inverters that don't (but not protecting anything sitting on my shelf!)

I was thinking more along the lines of an indirect lightning strike. Although damage from a wildfire is probably the most likely problem where I live.

 

[2TrevorJ]

Any luck with viewing data via the app?

They walked me through setting it up. It was obviously very beta at the time. I tried to crank it up again later and the credentials they gave me would no longer work so I quit pursuing it.

Just like the desktop program the android app is just gee whiz info...not really necessary with how fire & forget the system normally is. Fun to look at though.

Thanks for the encouragement. Just trying to share real world performance of a larger system that other people might be able to use to help design their setup.

 

[palehorse]

Did your insurance company know about the panels beforehand?

Yes I called them to ensure they were covered. But technically they count towards "other structures" coverage. You just need to make sure if your shop/barn/outbuilding etc all get damaged, that the cost of the solar panel replacements and those structures doesn't go over your limit. Often the cost of panel replacements is more than just a small shop itself. But each person has to determine that. I would recommend extra coverage for "other structures".

Edit - Mine are on my shop roof so that is why its under other structures. Not sure how it would be categorized if it was on your house roof or ground mount.

 

[Hedges]

I had thought ground-mount arrays ought to come under "other structures" coverage, but CSAA didn't see it that way.
Panels themselves I don't think would usually exceed other structures - in my case, $280k for house, $28k other structures. Apparently a default 10%. (personal property is 75% of dwelling!)
Given mounting hardware already there, should be less work to just install replacement panels (similar size?) if you got hail damage.

I figured at least my inverters and electrical equipment were on a structure so arguably covered.

 

[palehorse]

Mine was 30k for replacement. Includes removal of old panels, recycling fee, new panels parts costs and labor. So I was still under my other structures coverage but if I had to replace the roof on my shop or other out buildings I would have been close to going over it.

 

[2TrevorJ]

Been a bit so here's an update:

Overall August numbers:
PV Production: 3009.7 kWh
Total Load: 3236.2 kWh
EV Charging: 439.3 kWh
Exported: 174.3 kWh
Grid used: 661.2 kWh
Aug billing period: imported 376 kWh ($83.67 total bill)
Overall September numbers:
PV Production: 2488.2 kWh
Total Load: 2411.7 kWh
EV Charging: 552.4 kWh
Exported: 339.9 kWh
Grid used: 478.5 kWh
Sep billing period: imported 101 kWh ($20.07 total bill (due to $25 credit from voting in the Coop's election))
Overall October numbers:
PV Production: 2186.1 kWh
Total Load: 1839.7 kWh
EV Charging: 539.7 kWh
Exported: 612.9 kWh
Grid used: 473.1 kWh
Oct billing period: exported 84 kWh (back to the normal/minimum $30.90 bill for grid connection)

Not too bad for 55 100° days over the summer (4th most in DFW history). HVAC was roughly 73.8% of my August daily house (non-EV) load if that tells you anything. Record was 79.6 kWh on 25 Aug just for climate control.

Still running the same old configuration - self consumption and batteries carrying me though except when charging the car(s) & I disable battery discharge via TOU. Still making the most of the "Excess Solar" function on the Emporia Vue/EV Charger when possible. Oh, and we picked up a second Leaf in mid-Oct for my high schooler son; a 2019 Plus (62 kWh) w/19k miles for $19k.

No issues/failures or anything. Just truckin' along!

Since comissioning:
PV Production: 23877.0 kWh
Total Load: 19084.4 kWh
Exported: 5543.8 kWh
Grid used: 2709.9 kWh

 

[Tpilgeram]

After 1-1/2 years of planning I'm roughly a week and half into my new setup. 2x15Ks - 57.6 kWh of HomeGrid Stacks - 20.4 kW of REC's w/ Tigo TS4-A-O Optimizers and Cloud Connect Advanced (CCA) - Bypass/Transfer Switch - MicroAir Easystarts on my 3.5 & 4-ton AC units. Big house draws are pretty much all gas (other than the oven and my daughter's Nissan Leaf) so I have quite a bit of power to spare right now, but July & August should be close if my math holds out. So far this has handled everything I've thrown at it with zero compromises. There's actually a screen shot from this morning with me charging the batteries, the car, and exporting all at once. ? The only disappointment so far has been the lack of 600A charge limit from the Homegrids when they prominently advertise 300A for each stack. Most of the time the BMS is calling for 200-240A (total). Super conservative at <= 0.2C. That said, I've barely ever run into the charge limit and started exporting on PV. I was at 100% yesterday at 17:15, 79% at dawn this morning, and was topped back off and exporting by 10:40. ? Now, before anyone mentions it...yes this was an expensive endeavor that doesn't make a whole lot of sense if all you're after is ROI. That's not my focus. Feel free to ask any questions about the system/performance/behavior.

I have the exact same issue with my HomeGrid Stack’d. BMS limits to 20 amps per module nearly all the time. Your 2 sets of 6 gives you 240. I only have 4 modules and am limited to 80 amps charge by the BMS vs the 300 they promise. HomeGrid service has been absolutely useless at solving the issue. Very frustrating to be lied to about the battery capability. I can overage and use voltage manual mode to charge at the limits. I am also using a Sol-Ark 15k.

 

[2TrevorJ]

I have the exact same issue with my HomeGrid Stack’d. BMS limits to 20 amps per module nearly all the time. Your 2 sets of 6 gives you 240. I only have 4 modules and am limited to 80 amps charge by the BMS vs the 300 they promise. HomeGrid service has been absolutely useless at solving the issue. Very frustrating to be lied to about the battery capability. I can overage and use voltage manual mode to charge at the limits. I am also using a Sol-Ark 15k.

Are you running the latest firmware? I would also recommend you cycle them for a bit if you haven't already. Just run the house off them at night. I noticed mine became less conservative with cycles. The attached is yesterday's charge curve. Poor production day so I spent all day under 82% SOC but you can see it was calling for 600A charge all day.

Also keep in mind that below 17C, above 89% and below 41% you'll likely never see the BMS call for 300A per stack. I'm guessing that low battery temperature might be your issue there in Michigan.

 

[Tpilgeram]

Are you running the latest firmware? I would also recommend you cycle them for a bit if you haven't already. Just run the house off them at night. I noticed mine became less conservative with cycles. The attached is yesterday's charge curve. Poor production day so I spent all day under 82% SOC but you can see it was calling for 600A charge all day.

Also keep in mind that below 17C, above 89% and below 41% you'll likely never see the BMS call for 300A per stack. I'm guessing that low battery temperature might be your issue there in Michigan.

Thanks! Yes. I’ve let them cycle every night for the last 2 months. The HomeGrid service techs on the phone claim that the temps I was running (10C ish at the time) should not be causing the limit. I don’t believe them and asked for the curves, but they have not provided them yet.

 

[2TrevorJ]

Thanks! Yes. I’ve let them cycle every night for the last 2 months. The HomeGrid service techs on the phone claim that the temps I was running (10C ish at the time) should not be causing the limit. I don’t believe them and asked for the curves, but they have not provided them yet.

They provided the attached mid-Feb last year. SOC wise it doesn't jive with what I've recorded. Temp-wise it's close (although I've never been over 44C).

Not like I would ever see 1C. Hell, their highest stressed stacks (2 or 3 slabs) don't exceed 0.9C charging so I don't get why the documentation shows 1.0C.

 

[Tpilgeram]

They provided the attached mid-Feb last year. SOC wise it doesn't jive with what I've recorded. Temp-wise it's close (although I've never been over 44C).

Not like I would ever see 1C. Hell, their highest stressed stacks (2 or 3 slabs) don't exceed 0.9C charging so I don't get why the documentation shows 1.0C.

Good graph. Battery in the garage and not seeing 17 C batt temp here in Michigan until the end of a sunny day charge event when the SOC is too high for a faster charge anyway. You can see the charge current limit is always 80A which matches the .2C. Thanks.

 

[2TrevorJ]

Just hit 30 MWh!


The last 8 days have been bonkers. 765.1 kWh produced and 344.2 exported! 95.6 kWh on average per day.

 

[1201]

Just hit 30 MWh!

View attachment 198454
The last 8 days have been bonkers. 765.1 kWh produced and 344.2 exported! 95.6 kWh on average per day.

thats fantastic. congrats. what do you figure your payback time to be, on this system?

 

[2TrevorJ]

thats fantastic. congrats. what do you figure your payback time to be, on this system?

~14 years I'm betting at normal annual power cost inflation. By then it will likely be time for a replacement/upgrade and i probably won't get much of any "free" power out of it. As I said though...money was not my primary concern. Very happy with my setup!

 

[2TrevorJ]

Hit 40 mWh production yesterday!

The HomeGrid battery setup has provided 12.7 mWh since commissioning (discharging each night as necessary - focusing on self-sufficiency).

In March I actually chose to forego 1:1 Net Metering (w/ no month-to-month rollover or cash value) for the ability to actually get paid a bit for export and be able to roll over credit. With that I focused harder on cutting import and through 30 Jun I imported just 261 kWh out of 5928 kWh of load (95.6% self-sufficient) and accumulated over $160 in credit (that I'm already dipping into a bit in July).

Again, this a 4130 sq ft two-story suburban home with two 62 kWh Nissan Leafs and two central AC units (but natural gas for just about everything else possible outside of the oven).

All-Time Peak Records:
-- PV Production 23.7 kW
-- PV Charging 21.0 kW (407A @ 51.7V)
-- Grid Charging 27.3kW (530A @ 51.6V)
-- Export 21 kW
-- Load 16.9 kW (that's just natural load; I've never intentionally tried to push it)
-- PV Daily Production 118.9 kWh

No issues outside the new Sol-Ark monitoring platform's growing pains (glad I have Solar Assistant)...like a Swiss clock otherwise for the complete system!

 

[Nobodybusiness]

View attachment 226511
Hit 40 mWh production yesterday!

The HomeGrid battery setup has provided 12.7 mWh since commissioning (discharging each night as necessary - focusing on self-sufficiency).

In March I actually chose to forego 1:1 Net Metering (w/ no month-to-month rollover or cash value) for the ability to actually get paid a bit for export and be able to roll over credit. With that I focused harder on cutting import and through 30 Jun I imported just 261 kWh out of 5928 kWh of load (95.6% self-sufficient) and accumulated over $160 in credit (that I'm already dipping into a bit in July).

Again, this a 4130 sq ft two-story suburban home with two 62 kWh Nissan Leafs and two central AC units (but natural gas for just about everything else possible outside of the oven).

All-Time Peak Records:
-- PV Production 23.7 kW
-- PV Charging 21.0 kW (407A @ 51.7V)
-- Grid Charging 27.3kW (530A @ 51.6V)
-- Export 21 kW
-- Load 16.9 kW (that's just natural load; I've never intentionally tried to push it)
-- PV Daily Production 118.9 kWh

No issues outside the new Sol-Ark monitoring platform's growing pains (glad I have Solar Assistant)...like a Swiss clock otherwise for the complete system!

You definitely have more time on yours than me.

Hit 15 Mega Watt hours this month.

Glad to hear no issues.

 

[Shimmy]

Why are people excited about mWh production levels?! My 8kW array does that in about 2.2 seconds. The array is currently around 120MWh production.

 

[Nobodybusiness]

Why are people excited about mWh production levels?! My 8kW array does that in about 2.2 seconds. The array is currently around 120MWh production.

So you have generated 120,000 kWH with an 8kw array?

 

[Travis55]

Am I reading the specs right, do your two SolArk 15K's output 50A (battery), and 62.5A (PV) each for AC output?

It looks like you're running them split phase, so you'd have 50A (or 62.5A for PV) across each phase. Is that enough to run two A/C units like you mentioned and everything else?

 

[Nobodybusiness]

Am I reading the specs right, do your two SolArk 15K's output 50A (battery), and 62.5A (PV) each for AC output?

It looks like you're running them split phase, so you'd have 50A (or 62.5A for PV) across each phase. Is that enough to run two A/C units like you mentioned and everything else?

Runs entire all electric house.

 

[TechRider]

In March I actually chose to forego 1:1 Net Metering (w/ no month-to-month rollover or cash value) for the ability to actually get paid a bit for export and be able to roll over credit. With that I focused harder on cutting import and through 30 Jun I imported just 261 kWh out of 5928 kWh of load (95.6% self-sufficient) and accumulated over $160 in credit (that I'm already dipping into a bit in July).

No issues outside the new Sol-Ark monitoring platform's growing pains (glad I have Solar Assistant)...like a Swiss clock otherwise for the complete system!

Can you expand on the net metering comment? I don't quite get what you're saying but am interested.

I know what you mean about the sol-ark change over, they really fell on their face on that one. I accidentally capped my 15k at 12000W PV input. I like the fact that the data shouldn't go to China anymore but the bug is still out there.


For a 15k that should say 18000W.