Adding Solar to 5th wheel

[WV Camper]

I have a Jayco 5th wheel that is "ready for solar". I have bought the go power 190 watt panel and charge controller and a 30A breaker. I will add an inverter eventually but right now I just want to get the solar to help charge my battery so I can run the onboard generator a bit less. What I need the battery to do for the present is get us through the night running a few LED lights, the fridge in propane mode, and the water pump for quick showers, etc. My current plan is to get a 100 AH AGM gel battery from Renogy.
My questions are:

• should the breaker be mounted near the battery? does distance matter?
• is there a bus bar I for the positive and/or negative sides I should use so there are not multiple wires connected to the battery?
• what questions do I not know enough to ask?

Thanks,

 

[sunshine_eggo]

I have a Jayco 5th wheel that is "ready for solar". I have bought the go power 190 watt panel and charge controller and a 30A breaker. I will add an inverter eventually but right now I just want to get the solar to help charge my battery so I can run the onboard generator a bit less. What I need the battery to do for the present is get us through the night running a few LED lights, the fridge in propane mode, and the water pump for quick showers, etc. My current plan is to get a 100 AH AGM gel battery from Renogy.

Only 50Ah of the 100Ah battery is usable capacity, but that should meet your stated needs.

My questions are:

• should the breaker be mounted near the battery? does distance matter?

As close as possible.

• is there a bus bar I for the positive and/or negative sides I should use so there are not multiple wires connected to the battery?

On such a small system, I wouldn't worry about it, but you can certainly go that route.

 

[MisterSandals]

My current plan is to get a 100 AH AGM gel battery from Renogy.

Just out of curiosity, are you replacing your 5th wheel battery(s) with this? My experience is that there should be quite a bit more battery than this on most standard 5th wheel trailers.

 

[WV Camper]

Just out of curiosity, are you replacing your 5th wheel battery(s) with this? My experience is that there should be quite a bit more battery than this on most standard 5th wheel trailers.

It came with a standard crappy "RV/Marine" battery so this will be an upgrade from that. I really don't want a 127 lb 200 AH AGM battery and I would go lithium if they would start my Onan generator.

 

[Browneye]

Yeah, if you're gonna stick with lead acid, for the price of your AGM, you can probably get pretty close to a pair of golf cart batteries. You'll get over 100Ah usable that way. They are pretty durable, I've been using them for the past 17 years on our motorhome. Just switched to lifepo4.

One 190W panel, if pointed directly at the sun, might get you 8-10A charging.
What kind of breaker? If it's a switching one it can be positioned near the controller for easy cutoff. But as mentioned, fuses and breakers for a circuit should go as close to the source - battery or bus - as possible.

It came with a standard crappy "RV/Marine" battery so this will be an upgrade from that. I really don't want a 127 lb 200 AH AGM battery and I would go lithium if they would start my Onan generator.

RV marine batteries are okay, they're just not really deep cycle and not very durable, and don't have much capacity.
I moved my generator - Onan Micro 4000 - to the chassis or starting batteries. You might consider just a starting battery for the generator on a trailer since you don't have a 'chassis' battery. Then build a lifepo pack or bank for your house loads.

There are at least a couple of new lithium bats out that have starting power. The problem there is relying on a pack that you're using for loads, and if it gets too low it won't be able to start the gen.

 

[WV Camper]

Yeah, if you're gonna stick with lead acid, for the price of your AGM, you can probably get pretty close to a pair of golf cart batteries. You'll get over 100Ah usable that way. They are pretty durable, I've been using them for the past 17 years on our motorhome. Just switched to lifepo4.

One 190W panel, if pointed directly at the sun, might get you 8-10A charging.
What kind of breaker? If it's a switching one it can be positioned near the controller for easy cutoff. But as mentioned, fuses and breakers for a circuit should go as close to the source - battery or bus - as possible.


RV marine batteries are okay, they're just not really deep cycle and not very durable, and don't have much capacity.
I moved my generator - Onan Micro 4000 - to the chassis or starting batteries. You might consider just a starting battery for the generator on a trailer since you don't have a 'chassis' battery. Then build a lifepo pack or bank for your house loads.

There are at least a couple of new lithium bats out that have starting power. The problem there is relying on a pack that you're using for loads, and if it gets too low it won't be able to start the gen.

Can you tell me what lithium batteries these are that have starting power?

thanks,

 

[Browneye]

Here's one:

Dual-purpose LiFePO4 starting and deep Cycle Battery in stock USA

Hey Guys, I want to update that Lilead Premium 12V 110Ah Lithium Batteries are in stock CA, USA now. Search dual purpose marine battery on amazon and you will find Lilead S110 battery. 1.We are looking for distributors \influencers to work with us to expand the business in USA. 2.We also...

diysolarforum.com

However, they are stupid-expensive. If it were me I wouldn't do it that way. I would build or buy a lifepo pack to suit your power needs, a solar array for daily charging, and a charger or inverter to match them as well, for shorepower or generator.

Then install a regular lead acid starting battery for the onan, with either a battery-to-battery maintainer, or it's own solar charger. That way it's always ready to go, can't get discharged off the house loads.

When I removed my house pack from the battery well in the RV, I put two regular starting batteries in parallel, and their own 100W solar panel and charge controller. Then added a dc-to-dc charger from the chassis batts to the house bats for when the engine is running.

Starting batteries:



230A lifepo4 pack, 55A converter/charger, and 600W inverter:

 

[Rednecktek]

Just out of curiosity, wouldn't a LiFe battery have enough oomph to start a little generator? If the generator needs more than the 100a a cheapie battery can provide, don't many of the 200Ah come with a 200a BMS?

Just thinking that the cost of a 100Ah AGM and a 100ah Chins/Ampertime/Zoon are about the same but you get twice the watt/hours out of the LiFe.

Or at that point are you best off to just roll your own with a 250 or 300a BMS for starting current? I can't imagine a little generator takes that many amps to fire up.

 

[Browneye]

Cranking amps for Onan microilite is 150+ amps.
I can’t imagine relying on a house battery to crank a generator without some kind of backup. A motorhome has the chassis/house isolator-combiner solenoid.
Like I say, I moved mine off the house for the lifepo upgrade, put it on the chassis /starting bank.
If my lfp gets low I can fire the gen and charge with 55A.

A “little generator” is 4kw, has a automotive type starter, just a bit smaller.

 

[Rednecktek]

Cranking amps for Onan microilite is 150+ amps.

Oh, I didn't realize it was that much oomph! So the only option would be a LiFe with a 200+a BMS on it?

 

[WV Camper]

I appreciate the discussion, my generator is an Onan 5500 LP.

 

[Browneye]

Which you likely run for any air conditioning off grid.

Check out Trik-L-start. Starting battery maintainer.
I didn’t know about them till after I installed a second solar charger for my starting batteries.

A SLA starter is about $120 and a couple of cables.

 

[chrisski]

IME, a single 100 ah AGM will not provide enough power overnight if you turn the heater on. The propane blower in my fifth wheel draws 8 amp at 12 volts and can run a lot during a cold night. I used 184 amps one night, of which I estimate at least 100 amps was from the blower motor.

If the heat was not on at all, a 100 ah battery with 50 ah useable would last overnight. The DC fridge pulled .77 amps when on.

Once you put an inverter in, I recommend a remote off switch since it pulls about .5 amps. That adds up to 12 amps a day or about 1/4th the useable power in the AGM. My 12 volt 2000 watt inverter pulled 1 amp an hour while on.

For an energy audit, this is what my RV pulled for amps whenI had a 12 volt system and now that I have 24 volt system:


Please note some of those things like the Charging the laptop, microwave, and K-CUp coffee maker are DC amp draws from the battery but powered off the inverter.

 

[12VoltInstalls]

RV marine batteries are okay, they're just not really deep cycle and not very durable, and don't have much capacity.

That’s not necessarily so.
There’s plenty of deep cycle marine batteries that are durable and have 50Ah (and more) of useable capacity.

 

[Browneye]

That’s not necessarily so.
There’s plenty of deep cycle marine batteries that are durable and have 50Ah (and more) of useable capacity.

That's not what he described:

It came with a standard crappy "RV/Marine" battery ...

 

[Browneye]

Maybe this would help. AGM to LFP conversion performance.

 

[Browneye]

I thought my LPG furnace was rated at about 7-8A, but no, when it's running it's more like 10-12A.

All my lightbulbs/fixtures were converted to LED, tube-TV replaced with an LED TV. Confirm a LPG Norco fridge is about a half amp. I imagine the waterheater board about the same.

For us the biggest draw is the furnace, and since adding the inverter - anything you plug into that with any wattage. It takes a lot of twelve-volts to make 120.

 

[WV Camper]

I thought my LPG furnace was rated at about 7-8A, but no, when it's running it's more like 10-12A.

All my lightbulbs/fixtures were converted to LED, tube-TV replaced with an LED TV. Confirm a LPG Norco fridge is about a half amp. I imagine the waterheater board about the same.

For us the biggest draw is the furnace, and since adding the inverter - anything you plug into that with any wattage. It takes a lot of twelve-volts to make 120.

Which you likely run for any air conditioning off grid.

Check out Trik-L-start. Starting battery maintainer.
I didn’t know about them till after I installed a second solar charger for my starting batteries.

A SLA starter is about $120 and a couple of cables.

Which you likely run for any air conditioning off grid.

Check out Trik-L-start. Starting battery maintainer.
I didn’t know about them till after I installed a second solar charger for my starting batteries.

A SLA starter is about $120 and a couple of cables.

Which you likely run for any air conditioning off grid.

Check out Trik-L-start. Starting battery maintainer.
I didn’t know about them till after I installed a second solar charger for my starting batteries.

A SLA starter is about $120 and a couple of cables.

The Trik-L-Start solves some problems for me. I can go with a 100A Lithium and a small starting battery at a cost I can manage! I believe it will then run the furnace too as Browneye pointed out.

 

[12VoltInstalls]

That's not what he described:

He didn’t describe anything but did state an opinion.

 

[WV Camper]

based on all the thoughts and ideas, my current thinking is to get a 100ah lithium battery and if it will start the generator then, super, I’m all done. If it won’t I’ll get a small SLA battery with the Trik-L-Start.