diy solar

diy solar

Ah/Wh and runtime doesn't add up

SubnetMask

New Member
Joined
Dec 6, 2021
Messages
27
I've got my really small experimental setup that has two 100w solar panels wired in series, connected to a Renogy Rover 40w MPPT charge controller, with a 35Ah Duracell deep cycle sealed/AGM battery, and the load on it consists of two PoE IP cameras, a really small switch, a wireless bridge and a passive PoE injector to send power to the cameras. According to the Renogy, at night, with the cameras IR on (highest power draw), the load is about 18.5w/1.5A. Watt Hours is a new concept to me, but I've always 'understood' a batteries Ah capacity to mean that, for example, a 7Ah battery can run a 1A load for 7 hours (assuming full to dead as a doornail). So given that, assuming only 30Ah of the batteries 35Ah is really available for use, then the 1.5A load should be able to run for about 20 hours. Injecting Watt Hours, the battery, again assuming 30 out of 35 Ah as being usable, should be around 360Wh based on 12v. Calculating the load based on Watt Hours comes out to 19.45, which is more or less the same as my Ah 'calculation'. Of course this is a really simple setup with only one battery - when you start putting batteries in series, that's when I really get lost because my understanding was when you put batteries in parallel, you increase capacity while keeping voltage the same, and in series, you increase voltage but don't gain capacity - adding in Watt hours seems to toss that thought on its head because two 35Ah batteries in parallel is 70Ah @ 12v = 840Wh, but the same batteries in series would be 35Ah @ 24v = 840Wh ?.

Now, after that essay, part of this is I'm trying to figure out why my setup isn't running as long as expected... Assuming a full day of good sun where the panels charge the battery up to full fairly quickly (The kind of sunlight I had when I was load testing them with an inverter and they had no issue cranking out over 200w, so whatever the battery needed to come to a full charge, it was going to get), assuming they end up fully on battery around 5pm, based on calculations, they should be able to run fully on battery until like 1pm the next day (19-20 hours), but they consistently shut down before 5am, even if the day before was super clear with lots of sun. So, assuming 12 hours of runtime on battery, and assuming the entire 12 hours is at the highest load, with IR on, the setup is using around 222Wh on battery. It is generally cold out here right now, but even before the temps dropped, it was about the same.

Am I missing something? Do I have it all wrong? Or might there be something not quite right in my setup that is leaving usable capacity on the table?
 
Well for one, lead acid is only around 50% usable capacity IIRC. Running them lower will wreck them, so they are typically shut down to prevent damage.
 
>35Ah Duracell deep cycle sealed/AGM battery

I'm not a LA battery guru, but it is my understanding that LA only offers 50-60% usable of total capacity. In your case that would be roughly 18-21A total.

You mention load of 1.5A, and runtime of ~12 hours. 12 x 1.5A = 18A. That seems pretty close to me.

W.r.t. series vs. parallel, adding a battery in either case adds "capacity" as proven by your simple V=IR math homework above. The form of that capacity is slightly different, obviously. If your consuming device is voltage agnostic (uncommon but good gedankenexperiment), then it would use half the amps when running at 24V as it does running on 12v.

Water can sometimes be used as a more intuitive analog to electrical behavior for beginners. So the example is like this: you have 1 gallon of water feeding, via gravity, out of a spigot, and you add a second gallon of water. You can add the second gallon next to the first with a second spigot (i.e. in parallel), such that the water pressure (i.e. voltage) is constant but you get 2x the flow (i.e. moving current), or you can attach the second gallon on top of the first such that gravity pushes the water out of the spigot with 2x force (i.e. higher voltage). In both cases you (1) have doubled your water capacity (i.e. total available current) and (2) get double the amount of water, but the delivery behavior of that water is different.
 
I've never been able to pull anywhere close to full capacity out of an AGM battery. My guess is that your battery capacity is the main issue. It appears that you have everything else figured out precisely and your math checks out. What is the voltage of your battery at 5am when everything shuts down?
 
I know that generally speaking, you won't get 'full capacity' out of a battery, but only 50% is crazy (Batteries should be sold advertising USABLE capacity)... if a battery legit only can give you 50% (or less), that seems like massive false advertising. The thing is when I ran a capacity test with a LVC of I THINK 10.6v using one of the cheapo PWM 'charge controllers' that Will did a review on (using it just for the LVC), I got 29.3 Ah/354Wh out of it. PXL_20211009_232513194.jpg
 
LA battery capacity:
Interesting read, but in this particular case, my capacity test was done at a very similar draw (within half an amp or so, and not intentionally) of this particular load.
I've never been able to pull anywhere close to full capacity out of an AGM battery. My guess is that your battery capacity is the main issue. It appears that you have everything else figured out precisely and your math checks out. What is the voltage of your battery at 5am when everything shuts down?
The Renogy is set to a LVC of 11.6v. The problem is the info out there is pretty generic, and most seems to be related to 'regular' lead acid batteries. This one is a deep cycle AGM, which is meant to be brought to low state of charge regularly. One chart I found indicated that taking that particular deep cycle battery down to 0% SOC would give it roughly a 550-600 cycle life (which at that rate, is just under two years assuming daily 100% to 0% cycles). But would that apply to THIS PARTICULAR deep cycle battery? I don't know. The problem is batteries like this, while they have a max charge voltage based on use (this battery has a different max charge voltage for cycling vs floating listed clearly on the label), they don't have a recommended minimum/cutoff voltage. And from the charts I've seen, a lot of which seem to not agree, what to believe with regards to max discharge voltage?
 
Back
Top