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All in one recomendations? (requirements in thread)

topnotchit

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May 17, 2021
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Been looking at so many all-in-one systems, my eyes are crossed. I thought I might try putting some requirements here, and see if the community has suggestions of inverters that match my needs. Thank you in advance for your help. I labeled the requirements with numbers if you need clarity on a specific option.

GOAL: power my Tiny Home's 100A panel with solar, battery, and utility.
  1. Needs to be UL listed for Grid Tie net metering (my utility coop has $2K payment for a net metered system)
  2. My current load is <6,000w, so a 6k-8k inverter
  3. 100A AC line input from the utility
  4. The Tiny Home's 100A panel is split phase
  5. PV 10S2P 5000W 17A array
  6. 48V 300H Lithium Batteries
  7. SBU capable, Auto switching or utility augmented/supplemented, if possible
  8. This is a full cabin, so need "real life" surge capability for refrigerator, mini split AC, coffee maker, toaster, microwave, Oven/range, (Water Heater is propane)
  9. WIFI Capable

I have looked in the LVX6048, LV6548, SPH6000TL-BL-US, Signeer. I think i am more confused now more then before :). Any insights or suggestion would greatly be appreciated.
 
A friend of mine is has similar requirements and he settled on this Sol Ark. At a glance it appears to line up well without your input and output capacities.
 
1. That's dumb, it seems ridiculous to have a $2000 bill to allow your PV.

2/3. I've never seen any hybrid inverter with a 100 amp pass through/transfer relay. You're using less than 6,000 watts, that is 50 amps even if it was all on one phase.
Most of the hybrid inverter I've looked into include 60 amp transfer relays.

5. Does it need an integrated MPPT? Do you already have a charge controller or to couple with an existing grid tie inverter?

7. What is SBU?

8. So a high frequency inverter is out, the Outback Skybox won't work for you. But, the Outback Radian line might. The Schneider XW series would work, but you'd need a separate charge controller.

Are these UL listed?
LVX6048, LV6548, SPH6000TL-BL-US, Signeer. I haven't checked, but I have my doubts.
 
1. That's dumb, it seems ridiculous to have a $2000 bill to allow your PV.

2/3. I've never seen any hybrid inverter with a 100 amp pass through/transfer relay. You're using less than 6,000 watts, that is 50 amps even if it was all on one phase.
Most of the hybrid inverter I've looked into include 60 amp transfer relays.

5. Does it need an integrated MPPT? Do you already have a charge controller or to couple with an existing grid tie inverter?

7. What is SBU?

8. So a high frequency inverter is out, the Outback Skybox won't work for you. But, the Outback Radian line might. The Schneider XW series would work, but you'd need a separate charge controller.

Are these UL listed?
LVX6048, LV6548, SPH6000TL-BL-US, Signeer. I haven't checked, but I have my doubts.
1) sorry for the confusion. No, the utility company will give me a $2k check to hook up the meter to the utility as net metering. If I do an of grid only, I won't get the cash. So feeding the grid is critical, even if it is only 1kw a year.

2/3). Yes, it's is a100amp panel, but we don't actually consume anywhere close. 6-8kw is plenty. So a 60amp pass through would be fine

5). No, it doesn't need to be integrated. I am very open to separate inverter and charge controller. All new, so I don't own it yet. The utility had to approve the inverter to back feed, this I am looking for recommendations before I purchase
7) SBU =solar, battery, utility
8) great info, low frequency required because of surge?
Thank you
 
1) sorry for the confusion. No, the utility company will give me a $2k check to hook up the meter to the utility as net metering. If I do an of grid only, I won't get the cash. So feeding the grid is critical, even if it is only 1kw a year.

2/3). Yes, it's is a100amp panel, but we don't actually consume anywhere close. 6-8kw is plenty. So a 60amp pass through would be fine

5). No, it doesn't need to be integrated. I am very open to separate inverter and charge controller. All new, so I don't own it yet. The utility had to approve the inverter to back feed, this I am looking for recommendations before I purchase
7) SBU =solar, battery, utility
8) great info, low frequency required because of surge?
Thank you
I am kinda partial to the MPP LV6548. I just installed my second one to have each one providing L1 or L2 in the panel. (I have 240V Trane HVAC).
They just got their UL cert also, and can transfer between Grid, Solar, and Battery by itself. The price and flexibility/reliability/value for the money were my main concern. MPP is also from Taiwan, not China.

Works great with the Lishen 272ah cells. I have grid tie SMA in my other house, and will be replacing those with a non-grid tie solution using more MPP LV6548's.

There are China made ripoffs of these, so to be sure, you need to get them from mppsolar.com or watts247.com (Ian from Watts is a US based distributor.

I am sure Sol-Ark is also a great all in one hybrid solution, but it costs a lot more for very similar funtionality as two LV6548's, in MY opinion.
 
1) sorry for the confusion. No, the utility company will give me a $2k check to hook up the meter to the utility as net metering. If I do an of grid only, I won't get the cash. So feeding the grid is critical, even if it is only 1kw a year.

2/3). Yes, it's is a100amp panel, but we don't actually consume anywhere close. 6-8kw is plenty. So a 60amp pass through would be fine

5). No, it doesn't need to be integrated. I am very open to separate inverter and charge controller. All new, so I don't own it yet. The utility had to approve the inverter to back feed, this I am looking for recommendations before I purchase
7) SBU =solar, battery, utility
8) great info, low frequency required because of surge?
Thank you
Just re-read your post on backfeeding your utility. MPP would not be an option then.
 
Oh, that is significantly better! They are paying you. I would take that deal. How's the net metering agreement otherwise?

For the surge, how often does the grid go down? Do you need to support the surge from your inverter? If you are grid tied, the momentary surge will be covered by the grid before any inverter can adjust.

When off grid or the grid is down, yes you need a low frequency inverter with a huge copper coil to provide the surge capacity.
A high frequency inverter is more efficient but doesn't have the surge capacity to start a large motor. Your mini split AC might have a variable speed compressor which likely has a much smaller surge. The fridge should be fine on a high frequency.

I have a Schneider XW and it would be perfect if I was DC coupled. But, with my existing AC coupled solar there are holes in the software. But, if you can DC couple it would work great.
It's not in the bargain bin that's for sure. Schneider, Outback, Victron, etc these are on the higher end.
 
It's not in the bargain bin that's for sure. Schneider, Outback, Victron, etc these are on the higher end.
but the utility is forking over $2k. That should offset the extra expense easy. So it is only a momentary expense you get back when hooked up.
 
So far very low. I have not pushed them yet, as I am still building the array. Maybe @ 1 amp per unit. Hovers between 28 and 48 watts.
 
LV6548 would not work for me because my PV voltage is much higher than 250VDC.

You also need two of them for split phase, even though their website lists them as "The LV6548 is the latest members to our 120V/240V SPLIT PHASE inverter family". There's tha little asterisk again. Split-phase CAPABLE ... if you buy at least two, LoL.

If you have time-of-day pricing and utility, battery, and PV, the Skybox and the Sol-Ark are looking like the best choices to me.
 
LV6548 would not work for me because my PV voltage is much higher than 250VDC.

You also need two of them for split phase, even though their website lists them as "The LV6548 is the latest members to our 120V/240V SPLIT PHASE inverter family". There's tha little asterisk again. Split-phase CAPABLE ... if you buy at least two, LoL.

If you have time-of-day pricing and utility, battery, and PV, the Skybox and the Sol-Ark are looking like the best choices to me.
Yeah, I have two of the LV6548's, but two LV6548's at 13KW are still about half the price of one 9KW Sol-Ark, and the Sol-Ark is a rebranded made in China Deye Inverter. I am sure Sol-Ark fiddles with it a bit though.
The MPP are made in Taiwan.
If you want grid tie though, I would not use MPP. I think Outback, SMA, and Schneider are a better fit for that.
 
Yeah, I have two of the LV6548's, but two LV6548's at 13KW are still about half the price of one 9KW Sol-Ark, and the Sol-Ark is a rebranded made in China Deye Inverter. I am sure Sol-Ark fiddles with it a bit though.
The MPP are made in Taiwan.
If you want grid tie though, I would not use MPP. I think Outback, SMA, and Schneider are a better fit for that.
From what I've read here, the DEYE is a re-branded Sol-Ark. The latter did the design, and the Chinese mfr got the rights to distribute outside the US(?).

Anyway, what do you think about the LV6548? Dos it have the same feature set as the Sol-Ark? Things like time-of-day modes, zero-out meter? I'm on a ToD rate, and I want to connect a bank of LiFePO4 batteries. I could live with feeding just 120VAC to protected loads when power goes out.
 
From what I've read here, the DEYE is a re-branded Sol-Ark. The latter did the design, and the Chinese mfr got the rights to distribute outside the US(?).

Anyway, what do you think about the LV6548? Dos it have the same feature set as the Sol-Ark? Things like time-of-day modes, zero-out meter? I'm on a ToD rate, and I want to connect a bank of LiFePO4 batteries. I could live with feeding just 120VAC to protected loads when power goes out.
Although they are UL Listed, the LV6548's are off-grid inverters. I am using them as primary AC, and the grid as backup. I have two of them, with one 6.5KW output per phase. I love the way they work during the day, by using Solar as main source and directly supplying the loads from the array, and any extra goes to the batteries.
At night, the batteries kick in to supply the loads. Grid is ONLY used when the batteries are out of juice, and although I tested it, I have not needed it yet.

I like the way this works way better than grid tie. Its just silly not to be able to use solar when the grid is down.

At my other house I am grid tied via vintage 2008 SMA inverters, and they work great, and VERY reliable, but I need the grid at night, and have no power during an outage. I will be replacing those with the new IP65 rated MPP LV6548WP inverters when they become available.

I looked at Sunny Island, Schneider, Outback, and Sol-Ark, but the price and complexity(Sol-Ark is not complex, but WAY too expensive for the output you get compared to MPP), and found the MPP's to be the best value. I did have an issue when I first set them up, but I think that was me wiring the AC wrong. But so far, they just work like the SMA's do. Reliable so far.
Since I have two Trane 3 ton units at the house, I will be adding another set of batteries to handle the evening load. (Each unit pulls around 2KW when running) so I will have 1120ah of Lifepo4 for the night and any outages. I also have a 20kw generator to use if things get real bad, already inserted into the AC side.

So for me, screw the power company! I would rather not need them, and do NOT want to sign any contracts for the pittance they allow for grid tie. And if they go down, I will not notice. Freedom!
 
Been looking at so many all-in-one systems, my eyes are crossed. I thought I might try putting some requirements here, and see if the community has suggestions of inverters that match my needs. Thank you in advance for your help. I labeled the requirements with numbers if you need clarity on a specific option.

GOAL: power my Tiny Home's 100A panel with solar, battery, and utility.
  1. Needs to be UL listed for Grid Tie net metering (my utility coop has $2K payment for a net metered system)
  2. My current load is <6,000w, so a 6k-8k inverter
  3. 100A AC line input from the utility
  4. The Tiny Home's 100A panel is split phase
  5. PV 10S2P 5000W 17A array
  6. 48V 300H Lithium Batteries
  7. SBU capable, Auto switching or utility augmented/supplemented, if possible
  8. This is a full cabin, so need "real life" surge capability for refrigerator, mini split AC, coffee maker, toaster, microwave, Oven/range, (Water Heater is propane)
  9. WIFI Capable

I have looked in the LVX6048, LV6548, SPH6000TL-BL-US, Signeer. I think i am more confused now more then before :). Any insights or suggestion would greatly be appreciated.
I started glancing after you said grid-tie. Sorry. I, too, went crossed-eyed looking for the right inverter UNTIL I discovered hos crucial being UL listed is. All my favorites went out the window. Even returned one unopened.

Anyway, I learned all-in-one means controller is in inverter. You are wanting a hybrid all-in-one. Hybrid is just fancy word meaning grid-tie. Make sure it is pass-through. Means can use will being charged. Simultaneously.
 
I started glancing after you said grid-tie. Sorry. I, too, went crossed-eyed looking for the right inverter UNTIL I discovered hos crucial being UL listed is. All my favorites went out the window. Even returned one unopened.

Anyway, I learned all-in-one means controller is in inverter. You are wanting a hybrid all-in-one. Hybrid is just fancy word meaning grid-tie. Make sure it is pass-through. Means can use will being charged. Simultaneously.
Btw, all your specs are very do-able. Im a fan of 48v also... just always use 12v's in series. Like I had said, make sure you specifically ask about pass-through or not. And be careful with inverters from China. They will say "yes UL listed" then have no clue how to prove, show documentation or not have UL stamp. They usually just dont answer.

Good luck. Wish I had an answer for you.im looking for exact thing you are for a tiny house - but completely off-grid. Propane frig and stove. I too like and have a mini-split. Gotta have my washing machine tho. LOL
 
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