Am I missing something here?

[quantum`]

Anybody knows of anything more or less reliable than any other for RSS, I'd welcome any insight.

Since most of us are required to have per-panel RSD, might as well include panel-by-panel monitoring with it. I'm looking for a good one myself, anything but TIGO.

Problem with TIGO "optimizers" is on cloudy days they perform very poorly. There's a thread around here somewhere.

 

[CaySol]

Screen shot is pretty weird shows 100 amps from each battery with a different voltage than the battery in the graph with only 118w. Maybe the battery details are just out of date compared to graph, either that or its a different battery from top to bottom.

Looks pretty obvious skimandans is limiting to 12k sell and EG4 seems to have no answer as to why yet. They tried to say his array couldn't do it so he forced discharge the battery along with solar and still limited to 12kw. Seems like a firmware bug or some obscure interaction between settings.

There are settings that conflict. I’m assuming that is his problem as they got it to export the 16kw. Which would rule out a firmware bug as they are running the same firmware.
The system voltage for the bank doesn’t match the individual voltages in that view for me as well. Minor thing as the BMS controls over and under volt protection and charging.

 

[SunDave]

The confusion is that the top screenshot seems to be EG4s internal testing on their hardware to replicate the issue, and the others are of the system in question. If you look at their wording carefully, it says:

We have verified that your system configuration is correct, and testing has confirmed that the FlexBOSS21 is capable of selling back up to 16kW. However, it appears that the expectation of consistently achieving the full 16,380W from your arrays is based on VMP/IMP testing conditions.

In other words. It says they have internally tested the Flexboss to 16kW export as the screenshot shows. It does not say they tested his unit to that spec. That is why they suggested the battery discharge test. They also didn't say they tested it with the Gridboss in the mix. They they said it was because his panels were not outputting enough, which I believe was debunked by the battery discharge/sell test.

 

[jharrell]

Since most of us are required to have per-panel RSD, might as well include panel-by-panel monitoring with it. I'm looking for a good one myself, anything but TIGO.

Problem with TIGO "optimizers" is on cloudy days they perform very poorly. There's a thread around here somewhere.

Seems like the only game in town, their TS4-A-S does monitoring without optimization and is slightly cheaper I have a feeling it just the optimizer without optimization turned on but identical hardware. Would be nice to have just a good reliable remote monitoring RSD.

Pretty good comparison here between Tigo O and S with shading:

 

[jharrell]

They also didn't say they tested it with the Gridboss in the mix. They they said it was because his panels were not outputting enough, which I believe was debunked by the battery discharge/sell test.

Right I wouldn't be surprised if the grid sell setting is not syncing properly between gridboss and flexboss, I know he upped the setting from 12kw to 16kw, do you do this on the gridboss or flex boss and which ones in charge? I think the Gridboss becomes master and must write the setting to the flexboss (hopefully) firmware definitely becomes more complicated with each device running their own controller all synced up.

 

[CaySol]

Right I wouldn't be surprised if the grid sell setting is not syncing properly between gridboss and flexboss, I know he upped the setting from 12kw to 16kw, do you do this on the gridboss or flex boss and which ones in charge? I think the Gridboss becomes master and must write the setting to the flexboss (hopefully) firmware definitely becomes more complicated with each device running their own controller all synced up.

This isn’t how it works. Master inverter controls most. Gridboss just opens and closes relays.

 

[jharrell]

This isn’t how it works. Master inverter controls most. Gridboss just opens and closes relays.

And monitors sell current...

 

[CaySol]

And monitors sell current...

View attachment 283538

Yeah. So instead of connecting CTs to the inverter you connect the gridboss.

 

[jharrell]

Yeah. So instead of connecting CTs to the inverter you connect the gridboss.

So it's not the boss of the grid? Obviously the firmwares of both are involved and it specifically states they may not operate properly if not updated. Who knows what bugs lurk in the interaction between the two, this guy had his gridboss shutdown the whole system at 21kw passthrough, EG4 ended up giving him a new firmware for the gridboss itself to fix the issue:

Thread 'Gridboss with Flexboss not handling 21kW pass-through'

Jan 8, 2025

New Member, first post.

I installed a Gridboss, Flexboss and two PowerPro batteries on new years eve. No PV yet, running in backup mode. There is a 200A disconnect between grid and Gridboss. Whole house load panel is powered from Backed up Loads output on the Gridboss.



For the first week, all was good. Charged batteries, disconnected grid, house was powered by batteries/inverter. Tested 5 ton HVAC (heat pump) while running water heater. LED lights flickered, but everything worked. Turned the grid back on, and batteries charged. All good.

Something happened, and the...

• slowroller
• Replies: 119
• Forum: All-in-One Systems

• 

 

[CaySol]

So it's not the boss of the grid? Obviously the firmwares of both are involved and it specifically states they may not operate properly if not updated. Who knows what bugs lurk in the interaction between the two, this guy had his gridboss shutdown the whole system at 21kw passthrough, EG4 ended up giving him a new firmware for the gridboss itself to fix the issue:

Thread 'Gridboss with Flexboss not handling 21kW pass-through'

Jan 8, 2025

New Member, first post.

I installed a Gridboss, Flexboss and two PowerPro batteries on new years eve. No PV yet, running in backup mode. There is a 200A disconnect between grid and Gridboss. Whole house load panel is powered from Backed up Loads output on the Gridboss.



For the first week, all was good. Charged batteries, disconnected grid, house was powered by batteries/inverter. Tested 5 ton HVAC (heat pump) while running water heater. LED lights flickered, but everything worked. Turned the grid back on, and batteries charged. All good.

Something happened, and the...

• slowroller
• Replies: 119
• Forum: All-in-One Systems

• 

For sure. Just saying that the gridboss has no settings to change that control output kw. Something is happening for sure. But would I say that this issue means that these devices shouldn’t have adoption? I wouldn’t.

After installing my system m and learning more, I would feel confident in trying to install a LF inverter like a Victron. Once everyone is honest about what they are providing and aware of what they are actually getting, I think this progress should continue.

 

[hogback]

This reminds me I need to refresh the firmware in my chainsaw.

 

[chill633]

Seems like the only game in town, their TS4-A-S does monitoring without optimization and is slightly cheaper I have a feeling it just the optimizer without optimization turned on but identical hardware. Would be nice to have just a good reliable remote monitoring RSD.

Pretty good comparison here between Tigo O and S with shading:

I saw that. I like her videos. But, I'm not concerned about shading. My use case is I have (planned) one string of 12 panels spread over two different, adjacent roof planes, one with 5 panels and one with 7. That's how my roof is shaped and I won't have enough MPPTs to turn that into two separate strings. I want optimization for that string so one plane isn't constantly gimping the other depending on the sun's position.

I have one other string of 12 planned for my roof, and that really wouldn't benefit from optimization but requires RSD. The other strings will be on a carport and also not require optimization -- nor RSD because my local AHJ doesn't consider that a "building" for the purposes of NEC 690.12. If I was just dealing with RSD then I'd be going with APSmart devices. EG4's built-in RSD initiator is APSmart.

 

[chill633]

This reminds me I need to refresh the firmware in my chainsaw.

Elon, is that you?

 

[jharrell]

For sure. Just saying that the gridboss has no settings to change that control output kw. Something is happening for sure. But would I say that this issue means that these devices shouldn’t have adoption? I wouldn’t.

Not saying that at all, I would expect a new complicated multi device ESS made over seas to have some firmware issues initally and hopefully the hardware is up to spec so that any issues just involve firmware updates. For me I can't really wait any longer and am not one for early adoption so looks like I am doing a Sol-Ark 15k, also because the solar installer I am working with uses them and can support them. Was tempted to get a Gridboss / Flexboss but I have no need to have a separate MID or any plans to parallel in the future. I am sure the firmware issues will be worked out looks like a good product over all wish they officially published the surge rating on the inverter, hope to see some test with various loads as people get them.

 

[jharrell]

This reminds me I need to refresh the firmware in my chainsaw.

Funny my chainsaw does have firmware (with HF inverter motor drive) and so do the batteries with their own BMSs unfortunately (maybe fortunately?) not updatable...

Its a beast though for my use, great tool like the rest of my reds:

 

[CaySol]

Not saying that at all, I would expect a new complicated multi device ESS made over seas to have some firmware issues initally and hopefully the hardware is up to spec so that any issues just involve firmware updates. For me I can't really wait any longer and am not one for early adoption so looks like I am doing a Sol-Ark 15k, also because the solar installer I am working with uses them and can support them. Was tempted to get a Gridboss / Flexboss but I have no need to have a separate MID or any plans to parallel in the future. I am sure the firmware issues will be worked out looks like a good product over all wish they officially published the surge rating on the inverter, hope to see some test with various loads as people get them.

I was looking at the sol ark 15k initially too, but the reviews of the eg4 inverters that are luxpower seemed to be solid so I took it on. I am ok with being an early adopter though, so I am more forgiving than some with minor things.

I don’t have PV yet but the system can run my whole house without any issues and I am pleased so far.

 

[Zwy]

This reminds me I need to refresh the firmware in my chainsaw.

Don't forget to chant, "I'm a beta, not an alpha" or it won't download properly.

 

[Zwy]

Funny my chainsaw does have firmware (with HF inverter motor drive) and so do the batteries with their own BMSs unfortunately (maybe fortunately?) not updatable...

Its a beast though for my use, great tool like the rest of my reds:

View attachment 283546

I own a lot of red tools. The quality is starting a decline and I think the decline is steepening. I've owned the red stuff for over 30 years now. I'm not impressed lately. The batteries are great and the Fuel brushless is great too. The rest of the tool sucks, doesn't matter what tool. I even posted bad reviews on Milwaukee's website on an impact 2 weeks old and they deleted it. So I kept posting and they finally emailed me about fixing the problem.

I use the drills everyday. I own several. Lately one has decided it won't change rotation when pushing the switch from side to side. It has to have a hard bang against something hard to finally reverse direction. I really like getting climbed up on something in a tough spot and have the drill decide to act up. I already replaced one chuck, most worthless piece of crap I ever saw Milwaukee put on a drill. Tried the tighten, then loosen one click, tried every trick out there. The chucks still loosen up or slip. Of course Milwaukee has a fix for the slip, the "3-FLAT SECURE-GRIP™ prevents bit from slipping in chuck" but the chuck still loosens. The 3 flat bits are only very common sizes like 1/4", 5/16", 3/8". etc.

Driver impacts have problems with the bit sticking in the chuck. The die grinder chuck has the opposite problem the drills have, the bit/collet get stuck. Many more issues on all of the lineup.

I've been a faithful customer for over 30 years. I don't think it will be much longer. If you think the quality is great, you must have owned some real garbage in the past. I make my living using tools, Milwaukee is becoming the tools of weekend warriors. Kind of like some inverters which brought about this thread.

I'll run your chainsaw against my gas Stihl MS462 with a 26" bar anyday.

 

[quantum`]

The shading test above took no account of cloudy days. This is where TIGO optimizers fail. And I live in Seattle. Maybe their RSD+monitor device doesn't have this problem, but we'll need to see some proof.

 

[jharrell]

I've been a faithful customer for over 30 years. I don't think it will be much longer. If you think the quality is great, you must have owned some real garbage in the past. I make my living using tools, Milwaukee is becoming the tools of weekend warriors. Kind of like some inverters which brought about this thread.

I'll run your chainsaw against my gas Stihl MS462 with a 26" bar anyday.

Well I came from Ryobi just being a weekend warrior, same parent company TTI, honestly been very happy with all of it, pretty much got rid of all my air tools and runs my yard equipment too. So whats a good brand now days if not Milwaukee for a pro?

I just need a saw for my few acres and its great, keeping up with a 462 is a tall order for that saw but they do have a dual battery that keeps up with a 441:

 

[Zwy]

I have to laugh, the gas saw is sawing farther down the trunk/branch which gets larger the farther right he goes, while the trunk/branch gets smaller the more the electric goes to the left.

Yes, the current lineup of Milwaukee would be a step up from Ryobi and others like Harbor Freight. The current red tools are a step down from tools of the past sold for construction applications and daily use.

 

[42OhmsPA]

I consider anything that is Fuel to be towards the top, if not at the top.
It pains to say it but I do agree quality/durability has slipped a bit over the years.
I'm to invested in the battery platform to jump to something else. I have had to take apart one of my 8AH HO batteries and manually balance it.

My M18 Fuel drill definitely doesn't perform like new after ~4 years of moderate above your average home owner abuse.

At work my maintenance guys were burning through non Fuel drills before I took over the department and started replacing with Fuel. They thought it was Christmas day when I got them the Mid Torque 1/2", it's paid for itself in the time it has saved.

Makita is probably the best of the best depending who you ask.

Really it's a lot like the GM, RAM, Ford debate.

 

[timselectric]

Also a Milwaukee subscriber for many many years.
And sadly agree that quality is not what it used to be.
FYI, I have, and still use daily, every 28v tool offered. They will probably outlast me.
But I'm lucky to get a year out of the new stuff.

 

[going_commando]

I got sick of throwing away Milwaukee tools and batteries away, so now when they die they get replaced by Makita tools. I still have quite a few Milwaukee tools, but fewer and fewer every year as they just keep dying.

 

[Crowz]

I want to get a Milwaukee chainsaw but every time I get ready to buy one I think about how well the Oregon electric corded chainsaw does at handling anything I need to do and just never go thru with buying one. I know most will jump on it being corded as a good reason to get the other saw but I either plug into the generator which is out for the other electric saws we have or I use the delta 2 power station which runs it great.

Also the Oregon corded saw has the auto sharpener which for me is a game changer. Love that feature.