Anyone have the EG4 12K BTU mini split (120VAC only, not solar hybrid)

[Subdood]

Hey all, was wondering if anyone on here has the EG4 12K BTU mini split (non solar hybrid unit). If so, could you tell me your experience with the installation went and how has it been doing for you for heating and AC. Thanks.

 

[altenergy21]

Not sure the difference between the two, maybe one doesn't have a "hybrid inverter" with UPS, allowing blending of power from solar and wall power input. Just got a note that it's changed from R410 to R32 refrigerant. This should boost efficiency considerably.
And maybe no hardware change is required for going to the new refrigerant.

 

[Subdood]

Thanks. Are you saying the EG4 12K BTU non solar unit runs on R32 instead of R410? I'm not looking at the hybrid solar version.

There's so many brands out there, I don't know which ones are the best. I read somewhere on here that the EG4 units are Deye's but don't know anything about those either. This particular unit has a SEER2 rating of 28.5, which I've not seen on any other 12K mini split. I'm just curious as to its quality and reliability compared to say a Mr Cool, Pioneer, Mitsubishi, Daikin, etc. The diy aspect with the precharged line sets appeal to me. I think we could install it, but if need be, I have a coworker who used to run an hvac company and could help as well.

I want a mini split that runs off 120VAC, and this one looks like it'd fit my needs (500 sq ft living room/kitchen area, with 8ft ceilings). I'm looking at something to take the load off our old AC split unit, and 12KW electric heat, and to be able to run off my 120V inverter in case of grid outages. Don't want a noisy window AC or an inefficient space heater.

 

[RDuke]

I have the hybrid 12k, but ran it on utility only for months. It likely behaves about the same. Power draw for heating is a little higher than cooling, at least so far. The only thing I find a little annoying about heat mode is that the bottom few inches will accumulate ice as there is no defrost. Power draw in heat can go over 1000 watts. So far my cooling has only gotten to 940 watts but that is when it is hot and sunny. It will settle down to around 400 watts when it gets closer to the set point and it is not so hot in the evenings. The remote is goofy so I only use my phone and the automation part of the app is pretty nice. You would not have any problems running this from an inverter I would think.

 

[egilbe2003]

I have one set up in the nose of my gooseneck cargo trailer. It was a lot easier to install than I thought it would be. Most I've seen it pull from my inverter was 900ish watts, but it usually pulls around 480 to 600 or so. I had been running it off my chargeverter while I finished connecting my solar panels. It easily runs off the battery, too. My wife says it gets too cold at 69F, so I have it set to 74F.

 

[SplitUniverse]

unless you are "stuck on a brand" there are other options out there for "non solar" minisplits.
Some of them with a outstanding reputation and a long service track.

 

[Farm Boy]

Hey all, was wondering if anyone on here has the EG4 12K BTU mini split (non solar hybrid unit). If so, could you tell me your experience with the installation went and how has it been doing for you for heating and AC. Thanks.

Your asking about the 12k but I have the same in the 9k. It went together nice and every thing was their. The inside unit seems much bigger than I thought it would be sense I have other splits up. For instance I have a CH 18k and the eg4 9k is same if not bigger( balkier). Mine came with the easy no fuss line set so I did not need to any vac or testing of the lines witch was very nice. It;s a 29seer. Hooked up running cold set at 72 when it was using between 450 on low end to 750Watts to run according to my Schneider 6848 pro on the meter. The 12k is surly going to be more. When I bought mine nothing was said on the web site but now I notice in order for the 5yr warranty they require a professional guy hook up if I read it right. Hope this helps.

 

[Madcodger]

I have a 12K EG4 mini-split, installed a couple of months ago in my 16x22 off grid office. Works very well but I have used it only for cooling thus far. I had a 9K at a previous property and it worked fine, but I used it primarily for cooling as well. Extremely quiet, and most of the time uses only about 200-300w. I think the most I've ever seen it draw is 650W, for maybe 5-10 min. Installation is easy if you are handy and directions, indoor template, etc., are much improved over the original 9K I installed. I did it all myself but a second person to help lift the indoor unit would have been better (my upper body strength at 60-plus isn't what it ws even 5 years ago, but I got it).

All mini-splits use more power for most heating, in part because the delta temp you're trying to overcome is usually greater. If it's 90 outside and you want a 70 degree room. that's just a 20 degree difference. If it's 30 outside and you want the same indoor temperature, that's a 40 degree difference. And given that they just concentrate and move heat, there's less "raw material" in cold air, so they must work harder to capture it. I expect my unit to need 600-1000 watts for most heating requirements, and I doubt I'll use it at all below about 20, but we'll see. In vey cold climates like ours (Maine) I'd have a backup for these units. My Mitsubishis in other buildings don't require that, but they cost 2-3X more and are designed for -22F. These units just aren't built for that, but they're not at that price point, either.

Would I buy another one? Yes, I would. They're not as good as our Mitsubishis but I like them better than the Daikin mini-splits we had in yet another property. A decent value for a DIY unit if you don't want to deal with pumping out the lines, etc., required of most other mini-split installs.

 

[Subdood]

Your asking about the 12k but I have the same in the 9k. It went together nice and every thing was their. The inside unit seems much bigger than I thought it would be sense I have other splits up. For instance I have a CH 18k and the eg4 9k is same if not bigger( balkier). Mine came with the easy no fuss line set so I did not need to any vac or testing of the lines witch was very nice. It;s a 29seer. Hooked up running cold set at 72 when it was using between 450 on low end to 750Watts to run according to my Schneider 6848 pro on the meter. The 12k is surly going to be more. When I bought mine nothing was said on the web site but now I notice in order for the 5yr warranty they require a professional guy hook up if I read it right. Hope this helps.

Thanks for the reply, I appreciate it. Interesting about the warranty, I work at a local university with a guy who used to run his own HVAC company, he's a project manager now but helps manage the school HVAC systems, so I'm assuming he still has his license. He said he'd help me if I need it on the install, so I'm glad I have that option.

 

[Subdood]

I have a 12K EG4 mini-split, installed a couple of months ago in my 16x22 off grid office. Works very well but I have used it only for cooling thus far. I had a 9K at a previous property and it worked fine, but I used it primarily for cooling as well. Extremely quiet, and most of the time uses only about 200-300w. I think the most I've ever seen it draw is 650W, for maybe 5-10 min. Installation is easy if you are handy and directions, indoor template, etc., are much improved over the original 9K I installed. I did it all myself but a second person to help lift the indoor unit would have been better (my upper body strength at 60-plus isn't what it ws even 5 years ago, but I got it).

All mini-splits use more power for most heating, in part because the delta temp you're trying to overcome is usually greater. If it's 90 outside and you want a 70 degree room. that's just a 20 degree difference. If it's 30 outside and you want the same indoor temperature, that's a 40 degree difference. And given that they just concentrate and move heat, there's less "raw material" in cold air, so they must work harder to capture it. I expect my unit to need 600-1000 watts for most heating requirements, and I doubt I'll use it at all below about 20, but we'll see. In vey cold climates like ours (Maine) I'd have a backup for these units. My Mitsubishis in other buildings don't require that, but they cost 2-3X more and are designed for -22F. These units just aren't built for that, but they're not at that price point, either.

Would I buy another one? Yes, I would. They're not as good as our Mitsubishis but I like them better than the Daikin mini-splits we had in yet another property. A decent value for a DIY unit if you don't want to deal with pumping out the lines, etc., required of most other mini-split installs.

Thanks for you reply. We're in NE Kentucky so we don't get as cold you, we rarely get below zero, even tho we did get to -6 I think last winter. But last winter was an unusually long cold one, so we had to use the electric heat more. Every time that comes on, it's a 12KW power draw, so we obviously don't like it running a lot. We keep the t-stat around 64 in the winter, otherwise our monthly electric bill would be over $300.

We supplement it with a small space heater which draws 1.5KW or 700W depending on the setting, but we can only run it during the day with sufficient sunshine. We have a 10kWh battery which helps, but we obviously can't run the space heater when it's not shining for very long.

BTW the space I want to install the head in is in a single wide mobile home, it's the kitchen/living room area and is about 14 x 28 sf, with 8-9ft ceilings, and the home has decent insulation for a MH.

I know the mini split won't heat as well the closer you get to freezing, but I feel like it'd be a better option than running a space heater. And definitely better than a noisy window AC unit. I also wanted an HVAC option when the grid goes down, and I need a 120V unit as I have just a single phase 6500EX inverter.

I hear you about installing the head unit, I am almost 61, and don't have a lot of upper body strength, so I'd definitely need help.

 

[Subdood]

unless you are "stuck on a brand" there are other options out there for "non solar" minisplits.
Some of them with a outstanding reputation and a long service track.

No I'm not married to EG4 units, I've looked into Pioneer and Mr Cool to name a few. Any comments on those and what would be some other suggestions?

 

[Madcodger]

No I'm not married to EG4 units, I've looked into Pioneer and Mr Cool to name a few.

Look at the SEER2 and HSPF numbers. I went with EG4 in part because their numbers are very good, especially for a DIY unit. Mine has performed about like I expected.

 

[Subdood]

Look at the SEER2 and HSPF numbers. I went with EG4 in part because their numbers are very good, especially for a DIY unit. Mine has performed about like I expected.

Yeah the 12K EG4 has a SEER2 of 28.5, and HSPF2 of about 10, that seems pretty good to me.

Is it true that these high efficiency units qualify for a federal tax credit? I think they do.

 

[Farm Boy]

Yeah the 12K EG4 has a SEER2 of 28.5, and HSPF2 of about 10, that seems pretty good to me.

Is it true that these high efficiency units qualify for a federal tax credit? I think they do.

My first was a Pioneer. added a longer line set 25', they said it would be fine. After 5 yrs it seemed to be low and stopped heating well. Could not get any one to fix it. Have 2 CH units. 1-18 220v working great. ! more CH6k sitting in the shop as a spare. Then bought the eg4 9k when it was on sale it did come with the card board head template and wi-fi. Either model you buy the sealed simple line set is great. cost a little more but so much less hassle and peace of mind.

 

[TM48]

I've had a Pioneer 12k for about 7 years and a Cooper & Hunter for a year. Both work fine. I think all of this tier is made in the same factory. I bought the cheapest I could find delivered.

 

[SplitUniverse]

No I'm not married to EG4 units, I've looked into Pioneer and Mr Cool to name a few. Any comments on those and what would be some other suggestions?

If you can afford them I recommend the Mitsubishi, they might not have all the bells and whistles (their wireless integration lacks compared to some others, especially if trying to do a zoned thermostat with multiple units) of all the "fancy" stuff lately on the market but they have a Very Good track record and even if you have an issue the parts can be found on the shelf of your local supply house and you can have them next day worse case scenario, not to talk about their warranty (and I'm yet to hear about anyone being given the run around on that).

I've dealt with a few other brands and have not encountered major or consistent problems but none of them offer the peace of mind of Mitsubishi, at least for me.

And don't get taken off by the SEER, SEER2 or HSPF, those are all "seasonally adjusted" and not a reflection of the real efficiency of the equipment, they can be twicked to some degree because the testing protocols are not "hard set". The only unmovable indicator of a Heat Pumps performance is the COP, Coefficient of Performance. It's a little more tricky to understand because it's not a single number but a curve, actually more like "X dimensions" graphical element if you plot it completely (for outdoor temp, indoor temp, humidity, load percentage, etc) but it's usually given as a simple number for a preset outdoor and indoor temp/humidity at unit full load. Something above 4 is usually a very efficient piece of equipment, theoretically air to air heat pumps can achieve a COP of 5.

 

[Madcodger]

Is it true that these high efficiency units qualify for a federal tax credit? I think they do.

The changes to tax code have become so complex under the current administration, I'm hesitant to say (and not qualified to offer tax advice, anyway). Here's a link that might be of some help: https://www.energystar.gov/about/federal-tax-credits.

Personally, I ask my accountant whenever I'm thinking of making a tax-influenced decision. I don't trust the internet for that.

 

[Plum Crazy Rob]

Warranty - EG4 Mini-Split - EG4 Electronics

EG4 MINI-SPLIT: Enjoy peace of mind with our 5-year warranty. Register within the first year for full coverage.

eg4electronics.com

(Scroll down to warranty)

They left out meth-heads


They added an exception now the DIY linesets (all they sell now) don't need pro install, and those of us with the old traditional style lines, I know a couple of people who had units replaced under warranty and they were never asked about who did the install.

I think their warranty is just CYA for some extreme circumstances

 

[Subdood]

If you can afford them I recommend the Mitsubishi, they might not have all the bells and whistles (their wireless integration lacks compared to some others, especially if trying to do a zoned thermostat with multiple units) of all the "fancy" stuff lately on the market but they have a Very Good track record and even if you have an issue the parts can be found on the shelf of your local supply house and you can have them next day worse case scenario, not to talk about their warranty (and I'm yet to hear about anyone being given the run around on that).

I've dealt with a few other brands and have not encountered major or consistent problems but none of them offer the peace of mind of Mitsubishi, at least for me.

And don't get taken off by the SEER, SEER2 or HSPF, those are all "seasonally adjusted" and not a reflection of the real efficiency of the equipment, they can be twicked to some degree because the testing protocols are not "hard set". The only unmovable indicator of a Heat Pumps performance is the COP, Coefficient of Performance. It's a little more tricky to understand because it's not a single number but a curve, actually more like "X dimensions" graphical element if you plot it completely (for outdoor temp, indoor temp, humidity, load percentage, etc) but it's usually given as a simple number for a preset outdoor and indoor temp/humidity at unit full load. Something above 4 is usually a very efficient piece of equipment, theoretically air to air heat pumps can achieve a COP of 5.

Is COP on the AHRI certifications?

 

[SplitUniverse]

For some units it is.
Usually it's available in the "technical manual". For Mitsubishi at least a "setpoint number" is available in the spec sheet.

 

[Farm Boy]

it needs the energy star to qualify.

 

[Subdood]

it needs the energy star to qualify.

It is Energy Star rated, so I guess it would qualify for the tax credit.

 

[Subdood]

For some units it is.
Usually it's available in the "technical manual". For Mitsubishi at least a "setpoint number" is available in the spec sheet.

I didn't see any info regarding that in the owner's manual or the spec sheet.

 

[SplitUniverse]

I didn't see any info regarding that in the owner's manual or the spec sheet.

Which unit are you looking at?

Here's the one for MSZ-FS12NA / MUZ-FS12NA Mitsubishi combo

https://www.acdirect.com/media/specs/Mitsubishi/M_SUBMITTAL_MSZ-FS12NA_MUZ-FS12NA_en.pdf?srsltid=AfmBOooUp8LfISCfhDsIFTTBT2CanCvK6FP5nyGAhaT2YPtPtnq3fXrd

look at page 2

For Mitsubishi there's more data points in the "technical manuals", if you can't find it for your specific model reach out to their support and they will send it to you.

And this is why if you can afford it you pay the extra dime for something like this unit, they will certify the units to perform at a certain level across multiple environmental conditions; the parts availability and longevity are just cream on the top.

 

[Subdood]

Which unit are you looking at?

Here's the one for MSZ-FS12NA / MUZ-FS12NA Mitsubishi combo

https://www.acdirect.com/media/specs/Mitsubishi/M_SUBMITTAL_MSZ-FS12NA_MUZ-FS12NA_en.pdf?srsltid=AfmBOooUp8LfISCfhDsIFTTBT2CanCvK6FP5nyGAhaT2YPtPtnq3fXrd

look at page 2

For Mitsubishi there's more data points in the "technical manuals", if you can't find it for your specific model reach out to their support and they will send it to you.

And this is why if you can afford it you pay the extra dime for something like this unit, they will certify the units to perform at a certain level across multiple environmental conditions; the parts availability and longevity are just cream on the top.

Sorry I was looking at the EG4 12K unit's specs, not the Mitsubishi. I didn't see any COP data, but maybe they would provide that if requested.

Thanks for posting the datasheet. I did look thru the Mitsu's specs and saw the COP data. At -5F it showed a value of about 2.4, which seems pretty good, but I don't know how that compares to other similarly related units.