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calculating amps? VOC? VMP? VMPP?which one.

Jamie.sanders

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I am trying to calculate my solar panels amperage, I understand the formula, but I'm not sure which voltage to use?
VOC? VMP? VMPP? these are all close, but I need to be accurate.

or is IMPP the Amperage, my panels say: Max power current (IMPP) 9.93a

Thanks in advance.
 
The symbol 'I' stands for current as in amperes. You want to chose wire to handle the ISC amperes. That is the short circuit amperes.
 
Please keep in mind that the Imp is a "test" value, performed in a test chamber at exact temperature and artificial sunlight. Don't expect more than 85% of rated amperage under routine conditions. So, if the placard says 9.93A then expect to actually see no more than 7.9-8.9A. The voltage though will be close.

You need to be accurate for what purpose, to make sure the maximal Voc is not exceeded, or to determine if your output will successfully power your load?
 
Please keep in mind that the Imp is a "test" value, performed in a test chamber at exact temperature and artificial sunlight. Don't expect more than 85% of rated amperage under routine conditions. So, if the placard says 9.93A then expect to actually see no more than 7.9-8.9A. The voltage though will be close.

You need to be accurate for what purpose, to make sure the maximal Voc is not exceeded, or to determine if your output will successfully power your load?
not exceeding max VOC
 
not exceeding max VOC
OK, that's really important. Please keep in mind that voltage can vary greatly, depending on the temperature, and the time of the day. I've seen my array going from 124V to 87V in one day.

What's very important is the the voltage will go up as the temperature goes down. So, in winter, the Voc will be higher than summer. Midnight offers this "string calculator" to determine what your max Voc is going to be. Plug your panel values into the calculator, along with your potentially coldest winter lows. What's the voltage max for the unit you are working with?
 
OK, that's really important. Please keep in mind that voltage can vary greatly, depending on the temperature, and the time of the day. I've seen my array going from 124V to 87V in one day.

What's very important is the the voltage will go up as the temperature goes down. So, in winter, the Voc will be higher than summer. Midnight offers this "string calculator" to determine what your max Voc is going to be. Plug your panel values into the calculator, along with your potentially coldest winter lows. What's the voltage max for the unit you are working with?
I shopping for a CC now, I have 12, 440 watt panels, and 6, 12 volt batteries (or 24, 3.2 volt cells) I would like to run 2 or even 3 charge controllers
for redundancy, so if I goes out, I still have power.
I plan on running 3 groups (with 3 charge controllers) of 4 panels wired in series/parallel.
if im doing this right I get
12 panels in 3 groups of 4 in series/parallel for 82 Volts and 22.7 amps and 1760 watts or there about?
 
I have 12, 440 watt panels.
I plan on running 3 groups (with 3 charge controllers) of 4 panels wired in series/parallel.

12 panels in 3 groups of 4 in series/parallel for 82 Volts and 22.7 amps and 1760 watts or there about?
4 440W panels is 1760W. But since you have not shown the specs for the panels we can't confirm the volts and amps. If the Voc of one panel is 41V then yes, in 2S2P it will be 82V. And if the Isc for one panel is 11.35A then in 2S2P it will be 22.7A.

With that Voc you will want a SCC that supports 100 max input volts. If your system voltage is 12V then you will want a 100/140 (100 max input volts/150 output battery amps). If your system voltage is 24V then you will want a 100/70. Good luck finding such SCC. They probably don't exist. For that much wattage you really need to have a 24V system at a minimum. And you're likely going to need a SCC with a higher max input voltage to get one that supports that many output amps.
 
4 440W panels is 1760W. But since you have not shown the specs for the panels we can't confirm the volts and amps. If the Voc of one panel is 41V then yes, in 2S2P it will be 82V. And if the Isc for one panel is 11.35A then in 2S2P it will be 22.7A.

With that Voc you will want a SCC that supports 100 max input volts. If your system voltage is 12V then you will want a 100/140 (100 max input volts/150 output battery amps). If your system voltage is 24V then you will want a 100/70. Good luck finding such SCC. They probably don't exist. For that much wattage you really need to have a 24V system at a minimum. And you're likely going to need a SCC with a higher max input voltage to get one that supports that many output amps.
Thank you for the information, and YES I am running a 24 volt system.
the specs on the panels are.
VOC 49.62V
VMP 40.99V
ISC 11.35A
IMP 10.74A

thanks
 
OK, with a Voc of 49.62V and the panels in 2S2P you need a SCC with a max input voltage of at least 120V. Voc goes up in temperature. The output battery current will be about 70A with a 24V system and 1760W of panels. I think you'll find a few SCC with a max input voltage of 150V that also support 70A output battery current.
 
With a Voc of 49.6V, you should forget completely about getting a cheaper 40A controller with a 100V limit. Just two panels in series would be too close to 100V to measure, and a single frosty morning will bump up the voltage significantly past 100V.

With 12 panels, I'd wire them in series to get 3S4P. Running at 123Vmp will duplicate what I am running right now, but you'll need a 200V controller for that. I have a Midnight200 controllers, though you might also want to look at Epever's 8420AN, or 10420AN.

Wired 3S, one string will be producing a theoretical maximum of 440W X 3 panels/25V charging =52.8A. I wouldn't expect ever seeing more than 90% of nameplate, so call that 47-48A. So, one 10420 controller could handle two strings.

At these power levels, you might seriously reconsider switching to 48V. That would cut your amperage values in half while maintaining the same power levels. (440W X 12 panels)/50Vcharging = 105.6A max (90A in the real-world).

I see you have 12V batteries. If you get two more of them, you can wire them into a 4S2P battery bank. What's the amphour capacity of them? Assuming they are 100Ah, and they would like to be charged 1/8thC, then you'd get (100Ah X 2 strings)/8 =25A. Even expecting only 85% of nameplate output, you only need (25A X 50V charging)/85% = 1470W of panels. So, this means your battery bank is too small for the power levels you are talking about. Only one of the 3S strings would be enough to keep that battery charged.

So, this looks like it's shaping up into a poorly designed system, with far too small battery and far too large solar input. I'd stop buying stuff now, and wait till you have a more concrete plan on creating a top rate system. BTW, you haven't even mentioned yet what it is you want to power. An itemized list of what you want to run should have been the first thing you did, and then design from there.
 
With 12 panels, I'd wire them in series to get 3S4P.
FYI - The OP stated in post #6 that they wanted 3 separate groups of panels with 3 separate charge controllers, four panels each.
 
FYI - The OP stated in post #6 that they wanted 3 separate groups of panels with 3 separate charge controllers, four panels each.
What I'm trying to attempt here is to design something functional that the OP can afford. If you look at what the OP stated in post #8, the Voc of his panels are 49.6V, so four in series would be 198V. It would not even have to go down to freezing on a cool morning for the temperature to bump the voltage above 200V. There are controllers that can handle voltages that high, but we are talking now about getting into the 800-1100$ range for one controller, and I don't think that's realistically what the OP is looking for.
1634829375859.png
 
The OP stated they wanted the 4 panels in 2S2P, not 4S.
 
The OP stated they wanted the 4 panels in 2S2P, not 4S.
Yes, I see what you are trying to say now, but I still don't really think this is an optimum strategy. Yes, I agree redundancy is important, but is three controllers necessary when two would be just fine? We are not talking about lives at stake, are we? Although 82V is OK, that's a lot of amps through wire, and it just makes sense to me to bump up the voltage while cutting the amperage. There's significantly less voltage drop at 123V as compared to 82V.

With one parallel string at 82V, that's ~35A at the battery, or 70A for the 2S2P configuration. If you need to buy a more expensive controller to account for 70A it just makes sense to me to order the more expensive controller that can run at higher voltage. Otherwise, you'd need to buy and individual controller for every single string.

3S4P will still allow for 2-fold redundancy. You can just divide things into 3S2P and 3S2P. This however does not address the issue of over amperage for a too small battery. Whats the size of these 12V batteries?
 
With one parallel string at 82V, that's ~35A at the battery, or 70A for the 2S2P configuration. If you need to buy a more expensive controller to account for 70A it just makes sense to me to order the more expensive controller that can run at higher voltage. Otherwise, you'd need to buy and individual controller for every single string.
The output amps to the battery are the panel wattage divided by the system voltage. The panel voltage and amperage are irrelevant to that calculation. The OP has a 24V system. These are 440W panels. 3 panels is 1320W. 4 is 1760W. 3 will be 55A to the battery whether the panels are in 3P or 3S. 4 will be 70A no matter how the panels are arranged. Of course the arrangement affects the max input voltage and the choice of controller.

Given all of this, using only 2 SCC would mean 6 440W panels. That’s 2640W. At 24V that’s 110A to the battery.
 
thanks for the input, doing my calculations I can go 2S3P (6 panels) which would be
at 24 volts

6 Panels total 2640 watts
VOC99.24
Rated PV array 32.22 Amps
Battery Charging 91.7A

I can use one Midnight Solar Classic 150-SL to handle everything

then the same setup on my other 6 panels, I think? does this sound correct? is there a better option? still learning.
 

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6 Panels total 2640 watts
VOC99.24
Rated PV array 32.22 Amps
Battery Charging 91.7A
2640W / 24V is 110A to the battery. As I stated in my last reply, the volts and Amos of the array do not determine the amps to the battery.
 
With a Voc of 49.6V, you should forget completely about getting a cheaper 40A controller with a 100V limit. Just two panels in series would be too close to 100V to measure, and a single frosty morning will bump up the voltage significantly past 100V.

With 12 panels, I'd wire them in series to get 3S4P. Running at 123Vmp will duplicate what I am running right now, but you'll need a 200V controller for that. I have a Midnight200 controllers, though you might also want to look at Epever's 8420AN, or 10420AN.

Wired 3S, one string will be producing a theoretical maximum of 440W X 3 panels/25V charging =52.8A. I wouldn't expect ever seeing more than 90% of nameplate, so call that 47-48A. So, one 10420 controller could handle two strings.

At these power levels, you might seriously reconsider switching to 48V. That would cut your amperage values in half while maintaining the same power levels. (440W X 12 panels)/50Vcharging = 105.6A max (90A in the real-world).

I see you have 12V batteries. If you get two more of them, you can wire them into a 4S2P battery bank. What's the amphour capacity of them? Assuming they are 100Ah, and they would like to be charged 1/8thC, then you'd get (100Ah X 2 strings)/8 =25A. Even expecting only 85% of nameplate output, you only need (25A X 50V charging)/85% = 1470W of panels. So, this means your battery bank is too small for the power levels you are talking about. Only one of the 3S strings would be enough to keep that battery charged.

So, this looks like it's shaping up into a poorly designed system, with far too small battery and far too large solar input. I'd stop buying stuff now, and wait till you have a more concrete plan on creating a top rate system. BTW, you haven't even mentioned yet what it is you want to power. An itemized list of what you want to run should have been the first thing you did, and then design from there.
I have 6 12v 280AH batteries
 
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Yes, I see what you are trying to say now, but I still don't really think this is an optimum strategy. Yes, I agree redundancy is important, but is three controllers necessary when two would be just fine? We are not talking about lives at stake, are we? Although 82V is OK, that's a lot of amps through wire, and it just makes sense to me to bump up the voltage while cutting the amperage. There's significantly less voltage drop at 123V as compared to 82V.

With one parallel string at 82V, that's ~35A at the battery, or 70A for the 2S2P configuration. If you need to buy a more expensive controller to account for 70A it just makes sense to me to order the more expensive controller that can run at higher voltage. Otherwise, you'd need to buy and individual controller for every single string.

3S4P will still allow for 2-fold redundancy. You can just divide things into 3S2P and 3S2P. This however does not address the issue of over amperage for a too small battery. Whats the size of these 12V batteries?
I have 6 12v 280ah batteries, that’s batteries not cells
 
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I have 6 12v 280ah batteries, that’s batteries not cells
Oh, that's far higher than what I am used to. With a bank that big you'd want (280Ah X 3 strings)/8 = 105A. To get that I'd say you needed 105A X 25Vcharging X 1.175fudgefactor = 3085W of panels. If as you say above, you want to use 6 panels in a 2S3P wiring scheme you would be maxing out 1 Midnight150 controller. It has an amp limit of 94A while running at 24V. Those 2640W/25V = 105A, but assuming 85% efficiency you'd actually get about 90A in the real-world. That's a little higher than 1/10th C, so you close to the best amperage for charging that bank. What are those panels dimensions? The rotating pole mount I designed and built can hold 6 grid-tie panels in the landscape orientation. That might be perfect for your application? Are these panels the standard 39" grid-tie width? A ten foot unistrut array frame can accomidate three 39" width panels.
1634866928624.png
 

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