Can Solar & Wind Fix Everything (e.g., Climate Change) with a battery break-through?

wattmatters

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BTW, if you read it don't freak out ... for example I'm sure references to "Austrailia" refer to the federal government which is not on board with the program whereas every state and territory is, probably some changes coming in the upcoming elections.
Don't hold your breath for a change of government, nor for a dramatic shift in policy if there is a change.

Just to give you some idea of how idiotic the Australian presence at COP26 is, the official Australian booth is sponsored by one of Australia's biggest oil and gas companies, Santos.
 

summit

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We will see how China handles this, as there seems to have a lot of will, from top-down authority as well as from common people, and certainly the know how and resources. China's biggest hurdle/challenge is the massive population, every mouth wants to be fed and every body likes comfort, and deservedly so. Hopefully our wasteful lifestyle import can be tempered. Solar & wind plus storage can support a certain populous at a certain lifestyle. Homo sapiens are just out of balance and Mother is spanking us
 

Porch

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Something like that.

The problem with hatchet entertainment-news jobs like that is there's no real investigation as to if any of them, like Bezos, have carbon offsets to make their air travel carbon neutral. If they're personally paying to have their jet's carbon footprint removed or using green fuels then that's far better than your average family flying somewhere for vacation.

Also, at COP26, Bezos pledged $2B. That's in addition to the $10 Billion in the Earth Fund. It's more than I've committed so I won't begrudge him an airplane ride. He went there and ponied up.
Sort of sounds like
 

Hedges

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The problem with hatchet entertainment-news jobs like that is there's no real investigation as to if any of them, like Bezos, have carbon offsets to make their air travel carbon neutral. If they're personally paying to have their jet's carbon footprint removed or using green fuels then that's far better than your average family flying somewhere for vacation.

It's like governor of California or mayor of Oakland issuing a mandate to wear masks indoors regardless of vaccination status.
Then immediately going to a party maskless.
And declaring, "It's OK, everyone here is vaccinated."

Remember the time U.S. automobile CEOs flew by private jet to Washington with their hands out for a federal bailout?
They were told leave, come back by car.

The example these obscenely rich guys show is worth more than any agreement made, such as 1st world doing without and paying money while (formerly) 3rd world expands coal-powered generation.

The rest of us have been meeting by Zoom.
The climate conference could have been held by Zoom, except for those who could attend in person traveling by electric rail.

"Carbon Offsets"
Meaning what, he bought power generation credits from the PV panels I have in my yard?
He paid to have trees planted somewhere (after the bookkeeping was complete, they were cut down by locals)?
As it said, (partially) renewable fuels. Meaning palm oil, from a plantation grown where rainforests were burned down to get the agricultural land?

To the extent these guys built companies providing home delivery of products (with less emissions that you driving to the mall), making cars that run on renewable energy, computers and data centers which are more efficient, that is their contribution.
 

svetz

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Loved this video from @Supervstech, thought they did a good job on it.

One of the things that struck me as odd in the COP26 stuff I've read is the lack of anything decrying Climate Change as hoax. There was plenty of arguing and disagreement that made me think the 1.5C line wouldn't hold, but not because people weren't believing. Pity Russia & China didn't make it.

[green fuels/carbon offsets] Sort of sounds like indulgence...
Green fuels are sustainable, so it seems like a reasonable way to go about it to me. But, to each their own.

[using green fuels] ... It's like governor ...issuing a mandate to wear masks ... Then immediately going to a party maskless.
I differ in opinion on that. One is sustainable and carbon neutral. The other is hypocrisy. Sure, takes more money to be green on your private jet, but takes money to have a private jet too. No crime in being rich and I'd only think them hypocritical if they weren't green in the process.
 
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Hedges

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The fuel they used in their jets to fly to a conference about climate change wasn't sustainable, green fuel. It was a blend, partly good old fossil fuel.

I don't think any aircraft are run 100% on sustainable fuel.


It can be blended up to 50%


So they're only being half as wasteful.
Betcha there isn't enough sustainable fuel to blend 50% with all jet fuel. They used some, reducing what could be used in other, fully loaded flights.
If so, all told, their impact on fossil fuel consumption and CO2 emission was identical to if they flew their private jets with 100% fossil fuel.
 

svetz

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Was looking for some information on Methane and found the graphic
to the right in a CSR.

Interesting that while CO2 is going up, we've actually reduced CH4 by
nearly 10%. Most of that has been from landfills and tightening up
the fossil fuel sectors.

1636310569146.png
The amount of "fugitive" vs. "vented" is interesting. Seems like the
vented is something we should be able to get a handle on.

I did see something regarding biosolids (microbes in the dirt) that can
eat the methane and convert it into CO2 before it escapes a landfill.
1636310253847.png
 

svetz

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While methane is a potent greenhouse gas, it is also destroyed quickly in the atmosphere through chemical reactions. Carbon Dioxide is, more or less, a permanent problem, but methane only lasts for around a decade before being broken down by natural processes.
Couldn't respond in the other thread as it would be off-topic.

But, from post #9 methane is a bigger contributor than CO2 by 375% at its 2019 concentrations. Methane has a half-life of 9.1 years, so it's not like everything we release today is gone within a decade (e.g., the 800 MMT in 1990 accounted for 200 MMT 20 years later). Unfortunately, it breaks down into CO2 which can be sequestered by natural processes (although the half-life is very long).

Half-life is relatively unimportant when you're putting in more than comes out. E.g., you put 10 drops in and one leaks out... you still have a buildup of 9 drops. So, as long as we're emitting it'll be adding to the surface temperature and we'll always be emitting some. From the graphs above, looks like some of that (~100 MMT) is low-hanging fruit.
 

svetz

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... grass pulls the methane from the air, Joel Salatin...
Do you have a better link? Never seen anything about that (there are aticles that methane kills grass though).
That link lists an author, but i couldn't find anything about grass pulling methane from the air.

Everything I see (ref) is the usual yada yada:
Grasslands absorb and release carbon dioxide (CO2), emit methane (CH4) from grazing livestock, and emit nitrous oxide (N2O) from soils.
BTW, the same reference does say managed grasslands are better (even if the overall net is positive).
 

summit

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Was looking for some information on Methane and found the graphic
to the right in a CSR.
View attachment 71621
thanks for posting this, didn't appreciate that non-Energy sector has a sizable contribution. CH4 mitigation does seem like a low hanging fruit. Is livestock methane accounted for as Enteric Fermentation ?
 

svetz

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CH4 mitigation does seem like a low hanging fruit.
I was surprised too! I can see why they're going after it.

Ran across this satellite methane map which was sort
of surprising.

What surprised me is some states (e.g., North Dakota)
have no-venting laws, CA reports very low emissions
(but looks pretty high), Colorado is beautifully divided
by the mountain range, etc.
1637072202695.png

Is livestock methane accounted for as Enteric Fermentation ?
Technically it's any anaerobic fermentation by bacteria, but that chart splits out some, such as rice, landfills, composting, and wastewater treatment.
So, as I read it that 200 MMT from last year is primarily burps and farts from livestock.

Another benefit of fake meat is that less livestock means less livestock food production which means less fertilizer, which means less N2O (which is even a more powerful GHG than CH4 and has a century-long half-life).
 

NwCali

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Everyone misses reality...

Even if man made climate change is leading us to disaster the concept that the Government could, or would be able to manage it is downright crazy talk. If anything the Government will spend massive amounts of non renewable resources and make the problem worse far sooner than if they had not been allowed to use "global warming" as a election/control move (by the voters).

I've only given money to one "politician" ever. John Huntsman. If we'd elected "leaders" like him (if he'd stayed true to his word) then maybe we'd had a chance.

Try and live your life "right" and try to teach others to do the same. Try to remind people to vote with morals (and not their pocket book/sex life).

My belief is that something will happen (outside of climate change) that will reduce the population size (considerably) and that will either end us or do what Government won't do (reduce the human population size).

One example, Congress is paying a LOT of money for poor families to have MORE kids atm. Citizenship no longer required to get that money. How is this a good thing for "climate change"?
 

svetz

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Everyone misses reality...the concept that the Government could, or would be able to manage it is downright crazy talk....
And yet they're are doing things to reduce GHGs, see 117th Congress & Solar/Storage/Energy

Not crazy IMO... Government can accomplish a lot, especially when it works together: Send a man to the Moon, Eliminate CFC production (thus saving the planet once already in the 70s), Ensure safe drinking water standards, Created a highway system, created social security program, protected many wilderness areas, established FEMA for fast response to disasters, reduce pollution, established a national & reliable energy grid, etc.
 

Hedges

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... Promote destruction of rainforests to grow biofuels, built public transit that costs more per ride than what the riders earn in a day at their job, subsidize ethanol fuel so it is profitable to consume more BTU of fossil fuel than the ethanol produced ...
 

HRTKD

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... Promote destruction of rainforests to grow biofuels, built public transit that costs more per ride than what the riders earn in a day at their job, subsidize ethanol fuel so it is profitable to consume more BTU of fossil fuel than the ethanol produced ...

Don't forget to add Daylight Savings Time to that list.
 

summit

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let's keep in mind that, at least in the US, the "gov't" is elected by us, and thus WE hold the key. In fact, "we have met the enemy, it is us".

The Draw Down book mentions methane from cattle can be reduced up to 80% with some seaweed/kelp mix in the feed. That's a huge reduction.
 

NwCali

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Created a highway system
Instead of promoting a national rail system for the masses, which is far far far more environmentally friendly and would have killed far far far less of the citizens....

Sent a person to the moon... Yet 40 years later we still struggle with doing just that and we've no figured out how to make micro environments work, either socially of from a biological perspective...

"created social security program" I rely on the VA for "health care". What a joke. Not only is it very expensive but its a failure. I tweaked my knee about 4 months ago and the only way I've been "seen" by them in via "teleheath" over a month ago. Anyone who's anyone knows you have to actually have hands on to diagnose a knee injury. This is only my most recent failure of "socialized ran government" "healthcare"... back in 2008 I was covered under "government" "workers comp" and broke/fractured 19+ bones. 8 months into it they kicked me off, no payout of any kind, and said I was 100%. The Government appointed Lawyer (you can't hire one in their system and have to use their lawyer) didn't even respond and the Judge sided with the Government (ironic he's a part of the same Government, isn't it?).

Someone else mentioned the biofuel thing, I can second that. What a nightmare that was/is.

As far as CFC are concerned. Getting it right once means? One of the downside to this though was people who used over the counter asthma inhalers were forced to get prescription ones after this at ten times the cost. For the same product...and can't just pick one up when needed.

"safe drinking water standards" Guess this is why we don't read about large areas having substanard drinking water? Also why we don't read about how Congress is trying to spend massive amounts of $ to fix local problems with drinking water? I could use this example as to exactly why we do it wrong. Maybe cities should not be so large as to have the need for massive water/sewage systems and maybe one way to have this is for the citizen to ALWAYS bear the cost of all of these systems (including the highways one, or subsidizing fuel, or, medical care, or, retirement). I'd argue the debt fueled the outrageous waste we have in our country. When a person can have a $10,000 fridge filled with nothing but icecream and their a "public" servant... I work daily at the moment to provide myself a water system that will provide myself and my farm water year round using no electricity (outside of what it takes to make/install it). Imagine if society thought like that versus "let the government handle it" at all cost...

"established a national & reliable energy grid" I guess I might as well talk about this one also (I've done so on this forum already). Locally we loose power a LOT due to poorly maintained power lines. I've watched them burn on the road many times, people even still driving under them. I can point out areas that clearly need maintained (and have done so) to the Government and yet those areas are not maintained. A "fix" would be to move the hardest part to maintain over one valley where most of it actually already is (this would remove it from above the State route as well) and in the long run would be far cheaper and less hazardous (by far). So, what has the "federal" government (or even local) done to help "fix" this problem? Worse yet I've driven then some areas before, during, and after, that HAVE burnt and looked at how poorly citizens maintain these areas. Dead long grass running right up to wooden fences that run right up to their homes....for miles and miles. Government doesn't help here, nor do the actual citizens. Which brings me back to my start. Its..hopeless. One part of me wonders if deep down inside people think "let it burn, the Government will rebuild it for me for free!".

Keep on believing what you want....No idea why I wrote this, reality won't change it for you.
 

svetz

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Instead of promoting a national rail system...
Well, they caused the rail system to be built too. As to the rest, most of the problems are local implementations (e.g., water quality, poor grid maintenance). Not like those in charge of them didn't know what was going on...they were just bad managers in that they couldn't find the $ to fix it but were happy to keep getting their bonuses and wait for a federal bailout.

...Its..hopeless....
Disagree. The science seems good, seems like we have a lot of the solutions in hand already to get the job done, more and more are realizing it is real and starting to work together, and there are a lot of plan Bs in the wings in case we can't. Future looks bright to me.

....No idea why I wrote this...
Possibly looking for a little hope?
 
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