Edit post time limits?

Vanhalo

Solar Enthusiast
It needs to be greater than 10 minutes.
I do not know what the standard is.
All I know is I have never experienced an edit timeout while I was restructuring my post.
 

b.james

Solar Enthusiast
Yes this always turns out to be a PITA. I was caught today by the 20 minutes . Sometimes it takes a day or so to find pictures to attach and I edit my posts many times to correct spelling and errors . We all make them and who wants to look like a dunce?

Whats the reasoning behind any time limit anyway? So what if a post is changed a week later . Having bad info left on there is more damaging isn't it?
 

coachgeo

Poor Mans Expedition camper build
Yes I just disabled it today. And the reasoning is that if someone "liked" or responded to a comment, then it is changed, it can throw off the conversation. Some people can use it in a bad way. But this group is friendly and I think we will be fine disabling it, so its done :)
Thank you "maybe???" appears that it is back. though I do not know the time limit. Found an error I want to fix in my own post..... but there is no option to edit it. would clean up MY thread a little too. (could remove un-needed post)

Being a Moderator and Admin of various forums have always encouraged "self moderating". sometimes it takes a nudge or two lol but overall it has worked. But; can't do that if you can't edit YOUR OWN post.
 

Will Prowse

Admin
Staff member
Moderator
Thank you "maybe???" appears that it is back. though I do not know the time limit. Found an error I want to fix in my own post..... but there is no option to edit it. would clean up MY thread a little too. (could remove un-needed post)

Being a Moderator and Admin of various forums have always encouraged "self moderating". sometimes it takes a nudge or two lol but overall it has worked. But; can't do that if you can't edit YOUR OWN post.
Yeah we tried that but we keep running into the same problems. People editing their post after the fact during arguments. It's driving me nuts, so we are for sure keeping a "time limit" for editing now. You have 10 hours to edit posts. I really didn't want to have to do that, but the "reports" that people were posting were driving the mods and myself crazy. Sorry about that. Really a bummer.
 

Vanhalo

Solar Enthusiast
Yeah we tried that but we keep running into the same problems. People editing their post after the fact during arguments. It's driving me nuts, so we are for sure keeping a "time limit" for editing now. You have 10 hours to edit posts. I really didn't want to have to do that, but the "reports" that people were posting were driving the mods and myself crazy. Sorry about that. Really a bummer.

10 hours seems reasonable.
 

coachgeo

Poor Mans Expedition camper build
isn't editing your post after you realize you said something that should not have been said, or said in a way that your now realizing was taking completely different than intended... so you re-write if for better clarity.....are those not all a good thing? (aka..... self moderate).

Never had much problem with that in the 20+ years been moderating. Typically just Let it run for a while..... usually gave (and other times suggested) folk self moderate. At times just closed the thread. Once things died down.... just deleted the post that clouded the intended topic of the thread then re-opened it. Seemed to work majority of the time.

Longest run on a forum moderated; where kept to that pattern, (nearly 15yr run); went from nothing to the largest English speaking forum about the subject on the web (and still is)

if your going to time limit I'd suggest couple days or week. Suggest so cause after posting something..... a member may not even get back to the discussion for 24-48 hours..... job, family, honey do's etc. makes 10hours only minutes of day lol. Example.... just realized my error... and that was a many weeks ago.

but that being said...... know your pain, personal time, and commitment to running a discussion board can be thankless and tiring... so will throw out much thanks to Will for doing so. And of course for sharing your expertise as well.

Will also much kudo's for keeping a good balance of offering expertise as an enthusiast and not turning responses into a sell sell sell product pitch.
 
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Steve_S

Offgrid Cabineer, N.E. Ontario, Canada
Source: https://www.artofmanliness.com/articles/37-conversation-rules-for-gentleman-from-1875/
As true today as it was way back when... Applies to everyone, not just men.

37 Conversation Rules for Gentlemen from 1875
illustration victorian gentlemen talking in coats and top hats

Editor’s note: The excerpt below comes from a book published in 1875: A Gentleman’s Guide to Etiquette by Cecil B. Hartley. Hartley’s rules may be over 100 years old, but they’re just as true today as they ever were. There are some real gems here — some of which truly gave me a chuckle.
  1. 1. Even if convinced that your opponent is utterly wrong, yield gracefully, decline further discussion, or dexterously turn the conversation, but do not obstinately defend your own opinion until you become angry…Many there are who, giving their opinion, not as an opinion but as a law, will defend their position by such phrases, as: “Well, if I were president, or governor, I would,” — and while by the warmth of their argument they prove that they are utterly unable to govern their own temper, they will endeavor to persuade you that they are perfectly competent to take charge of the government of the nation.​
  2. 2. Retain, if you will, a fixed political opinion, yet do not parade it upon all occasions, and, above all, do not endeavor to force others to agree with you. Listen calmly to their ideas upon the same subjects, and if you cannot agree, differ politely, and while your opponent may set you down as a bad politician, let him be obliged to admit that you are a gentleman.
  3. 3. Never interrupt anyone who is speaking; it is quite rude to officiously supply a name or date about which another hesitates, unless you are asked to do so. Another gross breach of etiquette is to anticipate the point of a story which another person is reciting, or to take it from his lips to finish it in your own language. Some persons plead as an excuse for this breach of etiquette, that the reciter was spoiling a good story by a bad manner, but this does not mend the matter. It is surely rude to give a man to understand that you do not consider him capable of finishing an anecdote that he has commenced.​
  4. 4. It is ill-bred to put on an air of weariness during a long speech from another person, and quite as rude to look at a watch, read a letter, flirt the leaves of a book, or in any other action show that you are tired of the speaker or his subject.​
  5. 5. In a general conversation, never speak when another person is speaking, and never try by raising your own voice to drown that of another. Never assume an air of haughtiness, or speak in a dictatorial manner; let your conversation be always amiable and frank, free from every affectation.​
  6. 6. Never, unless you are requested to do so, speak of your own business or profession in society; to confine your conversation entirely to the subject or pursuit which is your own specialty is low-bred and vulgar. Make the subject for conversation suit the company in which you are placed. Joyous, light conversation will be at times as much out of place as a sermon would be at a dancing party. Let your conversation be grave or gay as suits the time or place.​
  7. 7. In a dispute, if you cannot reconcile the parties, withdraw from them. You will surely make one enemy, perhaps two, by taking either side, in an argument when the speakers have lost their temper.​
  8. 8. Never, during a general conversation, endeavor to concentrate the attention wholly upon yourself. It is quite as rude to enter into conversation with one of a group, and endeavor to draw him out of the circle of general conversation to talk with you alone.​
  9. 9. A man of real intelligence and cultivated mind is generally modest. He may feel when in everyday society, that in intellectual acquirements he is above those around him; but he will not seek to make his companions feel their inferiority, nor try to display this advantage over them. He will discuss with frank simplicity the topics started by others, and endeavor to avoid starting such as they will not feel inclined to discuss. All that he says will be marked by politeness and deference to the feelings and opinions of others.​
  10. 10. It is as great an accomplishment to listen with an air of interest and attention, as it is to speak well. To be a good listener is as indispensable as to be a good talker, and it is in the character of listener that you can most readily detect the man who is accustomed to good society.​
  11. 11. Never listen to the conversation of two persons who have thus withdrawn from a group. If they are so near you that you cannot avoid hearing them, you may, with perfect propriety, change your seat.​
  12. 12. Make your own share in conversation as modest and brief as is consistent with the subject under consideration, and avoid long speeches and tedious stories. If, however, another, particularly an old man, tells a long story, or one that is not new to you, listen respectfully until he has finished, before you speak again.​
 

Steve_S

Offgrid Cabineer, N.E. Ontario, Canada
Continued from above due to posting limit
  • 13. Speak of yourself but little. Your friends will find out your virtues without forcing you to tell them, and you may feel confident that it is equally unnecessary to expose your faults yourself.
  • 14. If you submit to flattery, you must also submit to the imputation of folly and self-conceit.
  • 15. In speaking of your friends, do not compare them, one with another. Speak of the merits of each one, but do not try to heighten the virtues of one by contrasting them with the vices of another.
  • 16. Avoid, in conversation all subjects which can injure the absent. A gentleman will never calumniate or listen to calumny.
  • 17. The wittiest man becomes tedious and ill-bred when he endeavors to engross entirely the attention of the company in which he should take a more modest part.
  • 18. Avoid set phrases, and use quotations but rarely. They sometimes make a very piquant addition to conversation, but when they become a constant habit, they are exceedingly tedious, and in bad taste.
  • 19. Avoid pedantry; it is a mark, not of intelligence, but stupidity.
  • 20. Speak your own language correctly; at the same time do not be too great a stickler for formal correctness of phrases.
  • 21. Never notice it if others make mistakes in language. To notice by word or look such errors in those around you is excessively ill-bred.
  • 22. If you are a professional or scientific man, avoid the use of technical terms. They are in bad taste, because many will not understand them. If, however, you unconsciously use such a term or phrase, do not then commit the still greater error of explaining its meaning. No one will thank you for thus implying their ignorance.
  • 23. In conversing with a foreigner who speaks imperfect English, listen with strict attention, yet do not supply a word, or phrase, if he hesitates. Above all, do not by a word or gesture show impatience if he makes pauses or blunders. If you understand his language, say so when you first speak to him; this is not making a display of your own knowledge, but is a kindness, as a foreigner will be pleased to hear and speak his own language when in a strange country.
  • 24. Be careful in society never to play the part of buffoon, for you will soon become known as the “funny” man of the party, and no character is so perilous to your dignity as a gentleman. You lay yourself open to both censure and bad ridicule, and you may feel sure that, for every person who laughs with you, two are laughing at you, and for one who admires you, two will watch your antics with secret contempt.
  • 25. Avoid boasting. To speak of your money, connections, or the luxuries at your command is in very bad taste. It is quite as ill-bred to boast of your intimacy with distinguished people. If their names occur naturally in the course of conversation, it is very well; but to be constantly quoting, “my friend, Gov. C,” or, “my intimate friend, the president,” is pompous and in bad taste.
  • 26. While refusing the part of jester yourself, do not, by stiff manners, or cold, contemptuous looks, endeavor to check the innocent mirth of others. It is in excessively bad taste to drag in a grave subject of conversation when pleasant, bantering talk is going on around you. Join in pleasantly and forget your graver thoughts for the time, and you will win more popularity than if you chill the merry circle or turn their innocent gayety to grave discussions.
  • 27. When thrown into the society of literary people, do not question them about their works. To speak in terms of admiration of any work to the author is in bad taste; but you may give pleasure, if, by a quotation from their writings, or a happy reference to them, you prove that you have read and appreciated them.
  • 28. It is extremely rude and pedantic, when engaged in general conversation, to make quotations in a foreign language.
  • 29. To use phrases which admit of a double meaning, is ungentlemanly.
  • 30. If you find you are becoming angry in a conversation, either turn to another subject or keep silence. You may utter, in the heat of passion, words which you would never use in a calmer moment, and which you would bitterly repent when they were once said.
  • 31. “Never talk of ropes to a man whose father was hanged” is a vulgar but popular proverb. Avoid carefully subjects which may be construed into personalities, and keep a strict reserve upon family matters. Avoid, if you can, seeing the skeleton in your friend’s closet, but if it is paraded for your special benefit, regard it as a sacred confidence, and never betray your knowledge to a third party.
  • 32. If you have traveled, although you will endeavor to improve your mind in such travel, do not be constantly speaking of your journeyings. Nothing is more tiresome than a man who commences every phrase with, When I was in Paris,” or, “In Italy I saw…”
  • 33. When asking questions about persons who are not known to you, in a drawing-room, avoid using adjectives; or you may enquire of a mother, “Who is that awkward, ugly girl?” and be answered, “Sir, that is my daughter.”
  • 34. Avoid gossip; in a woman it is detestable, but in a man it is utterly despicable.
  • 35. Do not officiously offer assistance or advice in general society. Nobody will thank you for it.
  • 36. Avoid flattery. A delicate compliment is permissible in conversation, but flattery is broad, coarse, and to sensible people, disgusting. If you flatter your superiors, they will distrust you, thinking you have some selfish end; if you flatter ladies, they will despise you, thinking you have no other conversation.
  • 37. A lady of sense will feel more complimented if you converse with her upon instructive, high subjects, than if you address to her only the language of compliment. In the latter case she will conclude that you consider her incapable of discussing higher subjects, and you cannot expect her to be pleased at being considered merely a silly, vain person, who must be flattered into good humor.
 

Dzl

Perpetual Newbie & Unofficial Forum Librarian
Staff member
Moderator
Is it just me or did we lose the ability to edit posts again? I can't edit any of my posts, even posts <1 day old.
 

Supervstech

Administrator
Staff member
Moderator
Is it just me or did we lose the ability to edit posts again? I can't edit any of my posts, even posts <1 day old.
The problem lies when a begrudged member gets in a tissy about some argument, and edits their posts DESTROYING several threads.

Make no mistake.
Everything posted on this forum belongs to Will.
Removing or otherwise destroying content posted damages the forum, and steals content from Will.

Will has made it so no moderator can edit any post but their own, and set a limit on member editing of their posts.
 

Dzl

Perpetual Newbie & Unofficial Forum Librarian
Staff member
Moderator
The problem lies when a begrudged member gets in a tissy about some argument, and edits their posts DESTROYING several threads.

Hmm, I suppose I see where you/he is coming from, it is fustrating when people do that, but to me it seems like a fairly heavy handed response that very likely does more damage than it prevents. Realistically, how many users posting valuable content were getting upset and deleting there content, compared with the number of people editing their content for legitimate reasons.

I have got a lot of value out of the continually updated posts on this forum and elsewhere, and I frequently edit my posts to update the information, add links, correct myself, or clarify a point. Its frustrating to lose this ability, even moreso if the reason is because

Make no mistake.
Everything posted on this forum belongs to Will.
Removing or otherwise destroying content posted damages the forum, and steals content from Will.

I'm quite dissapointed by this perspective, and I disagree with it in spirit and on technical grounds. I have got a lot of value from Will's videos and content, I respect what he does, purchased his book moreso to support his future content and show my appreciation than for the book itself. And I very much appreciate him creating, promoting, and hosting this forum, and recognize his right to run it as he sees fit.

That said, the value of this forum for me, and I supect for most here, is the community, Will is a valuable part of that, as are the moderators, and I appreciate what y'all do and provide, but the dozens of regular posters and hundreds of occasional posters sharing information, exchanging ideas, helping eachother, teaching and learning and sharing is what makes this community special.

I do not consider other members posts and comments to be Will's and I do not consider my own posts to be Will's. And editing or even deleting content is not 'stealing' anything from him (though deleting content out of spite is immature, and does negatively effect the community). This is a community made up of individuals, and its a community that has value because of the collection of individuals. Will has some right of use to our content as the host of this forum (per the terms of service), and I suspect most of us are happy granting that access in return for all the value we all get from this forum.

But the idea that everything on this forum 'belongs' to Will, or that deleting one's own content is 'stealing content' from Will, leaves a very sour taste in mouth. It runs afoul of the spirit of community, and collaboration, and sharing that I have always associated with this forum.

I recognize people purposefully deleting content maliciously is a problem, but the concern should be that it harms the community and we lose valuable information, not that it might theoretically deprive Will of revenue or content. And the fix shouldn't be a bigger problem than the problem it fixes.

Maybe a long, but limited timeframe of a week or two would be a good compromise. If a significant amount of members posting valuable content are getting angry and deleting content maliciously within 1 or 2 weeks of posting, there is probably a much bigger problem than edit time limits. A long edit limit like that would still allow editing for most legitimate reasons for a reasonable amount of time but prevent people from retroactively deleting all their posts.
 
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Supervstech

Administrator
Staff member
Moderator
Hmm, I suppose I see where you/he is coming from, it is fustrating when people do that, but to me it seems like a fairly heavy handed response that very likely does more damage than it prevents. Realistically, how many users posting valuable content were getting upset and deleting there content, compared with the number of people editing their content for legitimate reasons.

I have got a lot of value out of the continually updated posts on this forum and elsewhere, and I frequently edit my posts to update the information, add links, correct myself, or clarify a point. Its frustrating to lose this ability, even moreso if the reason is because



I'm quite dissapointed by this perspective, and I disagree with it in spirit and on technical grounds. I have got a lot of value from Will's videos and content, I respect what he does, purchased his book moreso to support his future content and show my appreciation than for the book itself. And I very much appreciate him creating, promoting, and hosting this forum, and recognize his right to run it as he sees fit.

That said, the value of this forum for me, and I supect for most here, is the community, Will is a valuable part of that, as are the moderators, and I appreciate what y'all do and provide, but the dozens of regular posters and hundreds of occasional posters sharing information, exchanging ideas, helping eachother, teaching and learning and sharing is what makes this community special.

I do not consider other members posts and comments to be Will's and I do not consider my own posts to be Will's. And editing or even deleting content is not 'stealing' anything from him (though deleting content out of spite is immature, and does negatively effect the community). This is a community made up of individuals, and its a community that has value because of the collection of individuals. Will has some right of use to our content as the host of this forum (per the terms of service), and I suspect most of us are happy granting that access in return for all the value we all get from this forum.

But the idea that everything on this forum 'belongs' to Will, or that deleting one's own content is 'stealing content' from Will, leaves a very sour taste in mouth. It runs afoul of the spirit of community, and collaboration, and sharing that I have always associated with this forum.

I recognize people purposefully deleting content maliciously is a problem, but the concern should be that it harms the community and we lose valuable information, not that it might theoretically deprive Will of revenue or content. And the fix shouldn't be a bigger problem than the problem it fixes.
I don’t think of it as stealing revenue.
In fact, Will does not profit from this forum other than the exposure to his products, etc...
No, the content on this forum being Will’s means the value of the content in information.

Destroying that content is despicable and needs protection so the entire current and future membership can benefit from the postings.
 

BiduleOhm

Electronics Sorcerer
Any content posted by a member on a forum belongs to said member, and that's by law (at least in the EU, pretty sure it is too in the US).

Also if someone delete his content I don't see how it can do a lot of damage as it's only his content, not all the content of the forum.

And how often it happens?

Also, anyone can save a web page (I often do it when i find a great ressource and it's pretty much the only one I could find, don't want to visit the site in a few months to find is has closed...) and anyone can archive web pages on the wayback machine and it'll be accessible to anyone in the future.

Not being able to edit our own posts is a real PITA, especially for long term projects threads.
 

Will Prowse

Admin
Staff member
Moderator
Is it just me or did we lose the ability to edit posts again? I can't edit any of my posts, even posts <1 day old.
Yes it is disabled for good now. One of our members got in an argument with other members, was angry, and edited his old posts with porn. It took me over an hour to selectively delete all of them. I will never let that happen again. Tired of this problem happening over and over.

Yeah, I follow the same rules as everyone here. I keep my coupon codes and links to products in the corporate section. I don't post affiliate links here either. I do have my "diy solar blueprints" in the menu and that's it. I think it's fair considering how much free info is on that site. At this point, I am not trying to make any more money. The world needs this forum and I don't mind losing money hosting it. The other options available are a joke and filled to the rim with ads (google search solar forum to see what I mean). They are also extremely strict and you cant post any products, of any kind. Or the owners post affiliate links everywhere. I hate it.
 

Will Prowse

Admin
Staff member
Moderator
I am not going to go to court because a member wants to edit their past posts and post porn. It is ridiculous. I am not going to deal with it.

Also, seeing full-grown men complain and argue about what battery chemistry is best, drives me nuts. We have members here that cannot be trusted. They are emotional and weak, and we need to keep them in check.

If you see someone acting like an idiot, call them out on it. I will leave those posts up. I think we need to keep each other in check to keep this forum helpful for others. Mods cannot "enforce" every single post.
 

Supervstech

Administrator
Staff member
Moderator
Any content posted by a member on a forum belongs to said member, and that's by law (at least in the EU, pretty sure it is too in the US).

Also if someone delete his content I don't see how it can do a lot of damage as it's only his content, not all the content of the forum.

And how often it happens?

Also, anyone can save a web page (I often do it when i find a great ressource and it's pretty much the only one I could find, don't want to visit the site in a few months to find is has closed...) and anyone can archive web pages on the wayback machine and it'll be accessible to anyone in the future.

Not being able to edit our own posts is a real PITA, especially for long term projects threads.
On several other forums I moderate, members can request for moderators to edit posts, or threads.
Be sure and report ANY thread needing editing, and Will will get it done.

Here, the integrity of the post is maintained by the original member that posted it. Only Will himself can edit other members posts.
 

Will Prowse

Admin
Staff member
Moderator
I am considering letting certain individuals that have a consistent post behavior to be able to edit their own posts.

If someone has 1000+ posts with good behavior, I wouldn't have a problem enabling their editing rights.
 

BiduleOhm

Electronics Sorcerer
On several other forums I moderate, members can request for moderators to edit posts, or threads.
Be sure and report ANY thread needing editing, and Will will get it done.

That seems like a lot of work for the mods but I'm ok with that.
 
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