EG4 18KPV and Others Programming

[SoTxUser]

I wanted to throw out a few ideas for changes or additions to the programming of the 18KPV and probably the FlexBoss, 6000XP, 12000XP and others.
I believe in enhancing hardware via programming. It can separate an average product from a superior product.

I will do a post for each idea. I welcome feedback or an explanation of anything that I might have not understood correctly. In addition, I will be very brief in each post. Clarification can always be added later if needed.

Thank you for the opportunity.

@EG4SoftwareTeam @EG4TechSolutionsTeam @SignatureSolarSupport

 

[SoTxUser]

Item #1: Menu: AC Charge. Item: AC Charge Based On

One of the choices is Time+SOC/Volt. When I tested this option it was charging the batteries if either the time was met or the SOC was met.
I think it would serve the users better if this was treated as an "and" in the logic. IOW, when the required time AND the SOC is met the system should go into charge mode.

 

[SoTxUser]

Item #2: Menu: Force Discharge. Item: Force Discharge Power (kw)

This parameter should control the power being fed to the grid. It's doing this but it's also limiting the power coming from the batteries to that same power level. Doing that can create big problems.

If you set this menu to feed a small amount of power to the grid and if your house load jumps up and either you have little to no solar the system will draw power from the grid. No matter what the state of the batteries is... they could be at 100%.

This menu action results in the opposite intent. You want to feed the grid but instead you are using grid power.
Because this happens to me during ultra peak rates it's a deal breaker in my case.

The system should control the grid feed to the stated value and draw needed extra power from first solar and then battery and only if that does not meet the demand... draw from gird.

 

[SoTxUser]

Item #3: Menu: Battery Backup Mode
*** I consider this a "it would be nice to have" item ***

We have 3 time slots on this menu but only one PV Charge Power level and one PV Charge Priority Stop value. It would be nice to a power level and stop charging value for each time slot. In my case, what I want to do early or late in the day is very different to what I would like to do in the middle of the day or before my Peak rate periods.

This feature add would also be nice to have in many of the other menus for example the AC Charge (different time slots can charge at different rates) and Force Discharge - each time slot has it's own grid feed rate.

 

[SoTxUser]

Item #4: Weather Optimize

At the Charge Time slot specified the system switches to grid power regardless of the state of charge of the batteries. Last night my system went into grid mode when my battery bank was at 73% SOC.

This action is forcing us to use the smallest charging window possible in order to limit grid use. Correcting this issue would allow us to have a larger charging window (like all night long) but only switch to AC charging if the SOC is below the specified value that is set based on next day weather conditions.

Note: As far as I know you must have AC Change Based set to Time in order for Weather Optimize to work. I think it best for this function to disregard the AC Charge Based on setting when Optimize kicks in.

 

[EZPZ]

Item #2: Menu: Force Discharge. Item: Force Discharge Power (kw)

This parameter should control the power being fed to the grid. It's doing this but it's also limiting the power coming from the batteries to that same power level. Doing that can create big problems.

If you set this menu to feed a small amount of power to the grid and if your house load jumps up and either you have little to no solar the system will draw power from the grid. No matter what the state of the batteries is... they could be at 100%.

This menu action results in the opposite intent. You want to feed the grid but instead you are using grid power.
Because this happens to me during ultra peak rates it's a deal breaker in my case.

The system should control the grid feed to the stated value and draw needed extra power from first solar and then battery and only if that does not meet the demand... draw from gird.

I have been trying to get EG4 to add some functionality for over a year…..I started a thread about it a while ago….not one of them was added/changed. Even what I would call the simple ones like 4 lines of code on the website not even a firmware change.

This won’t work for me. It will need to be a new value. This is battery forced discharge not forced grid backfeed. I use forced battery discharge to run my battery down at a set rate. So say 8hrs at 3kw would drop my batteries to 50%. Overnight my loads are pretty constant like 500w-1000w so forcing the battery to dump 3kw will do just that. I know exactly how much the battery will run down with this setting. So if tomorrow is a nice day here in TX I can run my battery down overnight so it can suck up those free floating photons tomorrow.

I do like the idea of forced grid backfeed however.

It would also be nice to have a limit on the amount of power the grid can supply. Isn’t the ultimate goal to be offgrid, now what if you can have a setting to limit power from the grid, including to 0? You can test very often how much power you would actually need offgrid, whether that be more pv and/or batteries etc and could effectively ween yourself off the grid…

I don’t use AC charge at all, so the whole weather optimize has no use for me.

 

[Daferris]

I must be missing something... I just use self consume mode. The rate i get paid for power exported 24/7 is only $0.046 not worth the hassle of selling anything more than excess power after the batteries are full and no other place for the PV production to go.

 

[EZPZ]

I must be missing something... I just use self consume mode. The rate i get paid for power exported 24/7 is only $0.046 not worth the hassle of selling anything more than excess power after the batteries are full and no other place for the PV production to go.

It’s really dependent on your setup. Mine has changed a bit with a ton more battery than when I started and also ac coupling. Also I am over paneled, so for example I want last charge enabled with a time setting so I could max out the pv from the panels at peak luminosity instead of clipping. So I have to manually change that setting twice a day to accomplish it.
But pretty shortly I will go completely off grid so all my requests won’t matter. It just would have been a lot easier prepping to get to this point.
I guess EG4 have their priorities so that’s understandable - no doubt they have been busy changing code for the fb/gb release.

 

[EG4TechSolutionsTeam]

Item #1: Menu: AC Charge. Item: AC Charge Based On

One of the choices is Time+SOC/Volt. When I tested this option it was charging the batteries if either the time was met or the SOC was met.
I think it would serve the users better if this was treated as an "and" in the logic. IOW, when the required time AND the SOC is met the system should go into charge mode.

For this feature, the batteries will charge only when both the SOC or voltage reach the configured parameters, and it falls within the set time window.

Our team will review this feature further, but just to clarify, it is not based on time or SOC/voltage; it requires both time and SOC/voltage conditions to be met.

Item #2: Menu: Force Discharge. Item: Force Discharge Power (kw)

This parameter should control the power being fed to the grid. It's doing this but it's also limiting the power coming from the batteries to that same power level. Doing that can create big problems.

If you set this menu to feed a small amount of power to the grid and if your house load jumps up and either you have little to no solar the system will draw power from the grid. No matter what the state of the batteries is... they could be at 100%.

This menu action results in the opposite intent. You want to feed the grid but instead you are using grid power.
Because this happens to me during ultra peak rates it's a deal breaker in my case.

The system should control the grid feed to the stated value and draw needed extra power from first solar and then battery and only if that does not meet the demand... draw from gird.

Item #3: Menu: Battery Backup Mode
*** I consider this a "it would be nice to have" item ***

We have 3 time slots on this menu but only one PV Charge Power level and one PV Charge Priority Stop value. It would be nice to a power level and stop charging value for each time slot. In my case, what I want to do early or late in the day is very different to what I would like to do in the middle of the day or before my Peak rate periods.

This feature add would also be nice to have in many of the other menus for example the AC Charge (different time slots can charge at different rates) and Force Discharge - each time slot has it's own grid feed rate.

Thank you for sharing your feedback on these features! Will be passing this along to our team for review and future consideration.

Item #4: Weather Optimize

At the Charge Time slot specified the system switches to grid power regardless of the state of charge of the batteries. Last night my system went into grid mode when my battery bank was at 73% SOC.

This action is forcing us to use the smallest charging window possible in order to limit grid use. Correcting this issue would allow us to have a larger charging window (like all night long) but only switch to AC charging if the SOC is below the specified value that is set based on next day weather conditions.

Note: As far as I know you must have AC Change Based set to Time in order for Weather Optimize to work. I think it best for this function to disregard the AC Charge Based on setting when Optimize kicks in.

We will get our team to review this feature as well. Thank you for bringing this to our attention.

 

[SoTxUser]

I must be missing something... I just use self consume mode. The rate i get paid for power exported 24/7 is only $0.046 not worth the hassle of selling anything more than excess power after the batteries are full and no other place for the PV production to go.

Self Consume Mode is my main operating mode also but I am on a time of use billing plan. During 2 different times of 3 hours each during the day my electric bill is double the normal or off peak rate. There is also an early evening period of 3 hours where my rate is quadruple the normal rate. I have to take steps not to accidentally start using grid power during these periods.

By the same token my buy back rates increase a like amount during the peak and ultra peak periods. I have no interest in selling extra power to the grid but it's a better option than throwing power away.

Hope this helps,
tsp

 

[Daferris]

Self Consume Mode is my main operating mode also but I am on a time of use billing plan. During 2 different times of 3 hours each during the day my electric bill is double the normal or off peak rate. There is also an early evening period of 3 hours where my rate is quadruple the normal rate. I have to take steps not to accidentally start using grid power during these periods.

By the same token my buy back rates increase a like amount during the peak and ultra peak periods. I have no interest in selling extra power to the grid but it's a better option than throwing power away.

Hope this helps,
tsp

I'm on a time of use as well but the difference between the high and low rate is only about $0.10 per kWh.
So far since June when I started up the array I have never gotten below 38% SOC.
My GridBoss/FlexBoss seems to want to draw power from the grid at random times for just a minute or two. Usually it's only a couple of hundred watts. No clue why as I can have 80%+ battery and it will do it. Think it's just checking that the grid is still there. Last bill was $5.68 for 1.267 kWh this past month. Cheaper than running a generator this winter if there are too many cloudy days...

 

[SoTxUser]

For this feature, the batteries will charge only when both the SOC or voltage reach the configured parameters, and it falls within the set time window.

Our team will review this feature further, but just to clarify, it is not based on time or SOC/voltage; it requires both time and SOC/voltage conditions to be met.



Thank you for sharing your feedback on these features! Will be passing this along to our team for review and future consideration.


We will get our team to review this feature as well. Thank you for bringing this to our attention.

I may have not have fully explained the problem on request #1. I just tested it again. Conditions: batteries at 75% SOC, start AC charge SOC 25%, stop AC charging 35%, charge window set to 2300 to 2330 hours and charge via time/SOC selected. Current time 2304 hours.

While the system did not go into battery charging it did switch over to grid mode. I would think that it should only do that if charging is required.

An example where switching to grid during the charge window would not serve in my case is the following case. I want to charge my batteries during my off peak period which is from 10 PM until 6 AM but ONLY if the batteries are below a set value (determined by weather in my case). In the current software my system will switch over to grid for the entire 8 hour period.

The weather optimize is doing the same thing. It forces me to set the charging window small since it's running on grid during the whole period regardless of the battery SOC. I would say 90% of the time the batteries do not need charging but I have a 1.5 hour window allocated via weather optimize every day and it's always on grid power during that time. By the way, I like that weather optimize does not look at start SOC. If the SOC is below the stop AC SOC it will start charging. Normal AC charging based on time or time/SOC does not do that. SOC has to be below start SOC to initiate charging.

I see value in both schemes but for simplicity it should be consistent. I think topping off your batteries (if need be) is better than hitting a low water mark. Case in point: my start AC charging is 25% (or lower) but weather says we're getting a major storm with possible power outages and my batteries are at 26% at the charge window. My weather app said to charge to 80%. The system currently switches to grid! Batteries do not discharge nor charge and stay at 26%.

Thank you for looking into this. I hope this makes sense.
tsp

 

[EG4TechSolutionsTeam]

I may have not have fully explained the problem on request #1. I just tested it again. Conditions: batteries at 75% SOC, start AC charge SOC 25%, stop AC charging 35%, charge window set to 2300 to 2330 hours and charge via time/SOC selected. Current time 2304 hours.

While the system did not go into battery charging it did switch over to grid mode. I would think that it should only do that if charging is required.

An example where switching to grid during the charge window would not serve in my case is the following case. I want to charge my batteries during my off peak period which is from 10 PM until 6 AM but ONLY if the batteries are below a set value (determined by weather in my case). In the current software my system will switch over to grid for the entire 8 hour period.

The weather optimize is doing the same thing. It forces me to set the charging window small since it's running on grid during the whole period regardless of the battery SOC. I would say 90% of the time the batteries do not need charging but I have a 1.5 hour window allocated via weather optimize every day and it's always on grid power during that time. By the way, I like that weather optimize does not look at start SOC. If the SOC is below the stop AC SOC it will start charging. Normal AC charging based on time or time/SOC does not do that. SOC has to be below start SOC to initiate charging.

I see value in both schemes but for simplicity it should be consistent. I think topping off your batteries (if need be) is better than hitting a low water mark. Case in point: my start AC charging is 25% (or lower) but weather says we're getting a major storm with possible power outages and my batteries are at 26% at the charge window. My weather app said to charge to 80%. The system currently switches to grid! Batteries do not discharge nor charge and stay at 26%.

Thank you for looking into this. I hope this makes sense.
tsp

That makes sense, and we really appreciate the detailed explanation. We’ll take this information and pass it along to our team so they can review it and look into possible improvements.

 

[B Smith]

For this feature, the batteries will charge only when both the SOC or voltage reach the configured parameters, and it falls within the set time window.

Our team will review this feature further, but just to clarify, it is not based on time or SOC/voltage; it requires both time and SOC/voltage conditions to be met.



Thank you for sharing your feedback on these features! Will be passing this along to our team for review and future consideration.


We will get our team to review this feature as well. Thank you for bringing this to our attention.

Glad to see EG4 staff on this discussion. I second what SoTx is saying about request #1. The software is not doing an 'And' logic, it is doing an 'Or' logic. Just today I tested it and although my SOC stop % was reached, the AC charging of the batteries continued because it was still in the allowed time frame. An 'And' logic would have cut the charging off as soon as the SOC is reached or the time window passed (the 'And' test should fail at the point either condition is no longer true). Please test and fix this.