EG4 6000XP lights flickering

[Adam De Lay]

I found 2 things that are causing flicker, one of my 3d printers, its ac heat bed once it hits temperature and then maintains it, it cycles off and on constantly, that cycle off and on is causing the flicker in the shop. I have a 3d print farm and all my 3d printers (bambu lab printers) are all on UPS's and are not causing any flickering, but one of my larger non bambu lab printers that can't go on a UPS (at least none of the dozen+ UPS's I have) because it draws over 1000 watts when heating up the bed and it is too much for the UPS so it is just plugged directly into the wall. Also my electric kettle in the house does the same thing, once it reaches set temp it cycles on and off to maintain temp, causing some of the led bulbs in the house to flicker. I replaced some of the bulbs with some philips ones and so far no flicker that I have noticed. Need to find all new shop lights now that won't flicker too.

It’s a chore to figure out what’s causing it but it sounds like your on the right track!

 

[Quattrohead]

Is this a constant flicker because of those appliances or brief flick up and down each time they cycle the thermostat?
There is a big difference between lights that flicker occasionally because of a load turning on and off and a constant flickering / twitching.

 

[42OhmsPA]

Need to find all new shop lights now that won't flicker too.

You could try wiring a small capacitor into the lighting circuit, such as one used in a ceiling fan. It helped a bit when I was running my TP6048.

 

[doox00]

Is this a constant flicker because of those appliances or brief flick up and down each time they cycle the thermostat?
There is a big difference between lights that flicker occasionally because of a load turning on and off and a constant flickering / twitching.

It flickers randomly when the cycling happens on and off, so it is a quick flicker but in sync with the appliance cycling on and off.

 

[doox00]

You could try wiring a small capacitor into the lighting circuit, such as one used in a ceiling fan. It helped a bit when I was running my TP6048.

I was wondering about something like this too, I am going to wire a ups in line on my shop lights and see if that helps or not.

 

[AshleyL]

I found 2 things that are causing flicker, one of my 3d printers, its ac heat bed once it hits temperature and then maintains it, it cycles off and on constantly, that cycle off and on is causing the flicker in the shop. I have a 3d print farm and all my 3d printers (bambu lab printers) are all on UPS's and are not causing any flickering, but one of my larger non bambu lab printers that can't go on a UPS (at least none of the dozen+ UPS's I have) because it draws over 1000 watts when heating up the bed and it is too much for the UPS so it is just plugged directly into the wall. Also my electric kettle in the house does the same thing, once it reaches set temp it cycles on and off to maintain temp, causing some of the led bulbs in the house to flicker. I replaced some of the bulbs with some philips ones and so far no flicker that I have noticed. Need to find all new shop lights now that won't flicker too.

Get Philips Ultra Efficient model, they will not flicker.
I replaced all mine with this model from the T8 to the bulb types.

 

[Madcodger]

I was wondering about something like this too, I am going to wire a ups in line on my shop lights and see if that helps or not.

Be careful with this approach, as it might cause other issues. We recently had contractors here doing some work and had a UPS for our router and Starlink plugged into the same circuit where they plugged in their chop saw. The inverters weren't affected at all by the saw, nor were LED shop lights on that circuit. But the UPS went crazy, faulted, and started screaming with an alarm (and no, the saw wasn't plugged into it). Happened several times until we finally unplugged it. Tried a replacement (different model) and it did the same. Same saw also faults AFCI breakers if plugged into one. I have a similar model saw from the same manufacturer (Dewalt) and it trips AFCIs as well. Brushes in the motor, apparently, but both saws are fairly new. Theirs gets a lot of use, mine very little.

 

[Quattrohead]

It flickers randomly when the cycling happens on and off, so it is a quick flicker but in sync with the appliance cycling on and off.

I don't think there's much you are going to be able to do about that, you would see the same being powered from the grid too. Back then you would have just accepted it but now you are the power company.

 

[Quattrohead]

Same saw also faults AFCI breakers if plugged into one. I have a similar model saw from the same manufacturer (Dewalt) and it trips AFCIs as well. Brushes in the motor, apparently, but both saws are fairly new.

Sounds like a poor quality saw or lack of testing in the RFI department to me. You should talk to DeWalt about that behavior.
Actually would that be a brushless motor these days?

 

[doox00]

I don't think there's much you are going to be able to do about that, you would see the same being powered from the grid too. Back then you would have just accepted it but now you are the power company.

Well that is where my issue is, I don't get flickering at all ever when on grid (when no sun and batteries are dead so the inverter switches to grid power).

 

[doox00]

Be careful with this approach, as it might cause other issues. We recently had contractors here doing some work and had a UPS for our router and Starlink plugged into the same circuit where they plugged in their chop saw. The inverters weren't affected at all by the saw, nor were LED shop lights on that circuit. But the UPS went crazy, faulted, and started screaming with an alarm (and no, the saw wasn't plugged into it). Happened several times until we finally unplugged it. Tried a replacement (different model) and it did the same. Same saw also faults AFCI breakers if plugged into one. I have a similar model saw from the same manufacturer (Dewalt) and it trips AFCIs as well. Brushes in the motor, apparently, but both saws are fairly new. Theirs gets a lot of use, mine very little.

This is because the UPS can't handle that much load, UPS's are rated for max current draw, most of the models I have (APC and Cyberlink's) have around 900 watt max load rating. The circuit only has lights on it also, so I don't have to worry about anything else running off it, not sure it will work but worth a try I guess before I replace all the lights in the shop (which I just did late last year when I redid my pole barn and before I had solar installed).

 

[AshleyL]

Well that is where my issue is, I don't get flickering at all ever when on grid (when no sun and batteries are dead so the inverter switches to grid power).

....Of course you will not get any obvious flickering on grid. Basically your motor related stuff got synced to the power phase of the super duper large generator at your utility provider.
Let start by learning how AC power works. Watch in order, top to bottom.

 

[Quattrohead]

Well that is where my issue is, I don't get flickering at all ever when on grid (when no sun and batteries are dead so the inverter switches to grid power).

Oh I did not see that from before, well I guess there is ultimately nothing better than grid, hardly surprising considering the size of it.

 

[Quattrohead]

This is because the UPS can't handle that much load

You seem to have missed that this saw was not connected to the UPS, just on the same circuit as the UPS input.

 

[doox00]

You seem to have missed that this saw was not connected to the UPS, just on the same circuit as the UPS input.

Ahh I see, that is very odd then for sure.

 

[Madcodger]

This is because the UPS can't handle that much load,

You missed the part where I noted that the saw was NOT plugged into the UPS - it was just plugged into an outlet on the same circuit. My post was simply to help another forum member know that a UPS on a circuit with a "problem" device can cause issues of its own, even WITHOUT the device being plugged into the UPS.

 

[Madcodger]

Sounds like a poor quality saw or lack of testing in the RFI department to me. You should talk to DeWalt about that behavior.
Actually would that be a brushless motor these days?

If I had to use it often, I would, but from speaking with a number of contractors and friends, it's apparently common. Great saw otherwise, and certainly not a bargain brand. Personally, I'll just plug it into a non-AFCI circuit.

I have to say, I find AFCI requirements have gone way too far, and along with a zillion other little things, have increased the cost of building a home dramatically. You hear things like, "Oh, it's just a tiny percentage of the overall cost to build a home" as justification for everything, but together, it all adds up. Breakers that cost $65 must be substituted for those I can still purchase for about $10. And who makes up tue committees that establish these rules? Oh, yeah, it's often people that work for the manufacturers. Riiiiggghhhttttt...

 

[Quattrohead]

I have to say, I find AFCI requirements have gone way too far, and along with a zillion other little things, have increased the cost of building a home dramatically. You hear things like, "Oh, it's just a tiny percentage of the overall cost to build a home" as justification for everything, but together, it all adds up. Breakers that cost $65 must be substituted for those I can still purchase for about $10.

Yep been through this with the home build. Breakers were my second highest cost after concrete
Seriously my biggest expense was the ground and concrete work. 6" thick ICF walls though.
My inspector looked the other way for GFCI/AFCI on the dishwasher and both fridges, but made me change the kitchen fridge circuit to 20A.
It was his sticking point so I made it good, he helped me out in many other ways.

 

[HardYakka]

Just got our final electrical too (DIY), had to label "NON-GFCI" for the freezers in Garage. Those new combo's are $$$$. Have a bloody AFCI flashing constantly on a circuit that has nothing plugged in yet and I've pulled apart validated all outlets. Sub said he pulls the AFCI's and replaces them after final with the old reliable ones.

BUT our LED lights constantly flicker, randomly, with the EG4's and there is less that 10% loads as there is nothing really running inside yet, still doing finishing work. We are "Off-Grid" purists lol.

 

[TM48]

This a interesting video that may have some applicability for some cases.

 

[HardYakka]

two 6000xp's, not paralleled yet, running tests.. I've switch over the daily xp to what was going to be the slave and guess what, haven't seen a flicker while we've been in the house working these past two days.

Yes, both units have the latest FmW, identical hookups up/down stream.

 

[wpns]

two 6000xp's, not paralleled yet, running tests.. I've switch over the daily xp to what was going to be the slave and guess what, haven't seen a flicker while we've been in the house working these past two days.

Yes, both units have the latest FmW, identical hookups up/down stream.

Check the connections, (re)tighten all the lugs? I need to do this too, finally realized the fridge starting was dimming the lights..

 

[ElkPicture]

I found 2 things that are causing flicker, one of my 3d printers, its ac heat bed once it hits temperature and then maintains it, it cycles off and on constantly, that cycle off and on is causing the flicker in the shop. I have a 3d print farm and all my 3d printers (bambu lab printers) are all on UPS's and are not causing any flickering, but one of my larger non bambu lab printers that can't go on a UPS (at least none of the dozen+ UPS's I have) because it draws over 1000 watts when heating up the bed and it is too much for the UPS so it is just plugged directly into the wall. Also my electric kettle in the house does the same thing, once it reaches set temp it cycles on and off to maintain temp, causing some of the led bulbs in the house to flicker. I replaced some of the bulbs with some philips ones and so far no flicker that I have noticed. Need to find all new shop lights now that won't flicker too.

Cool. Thanks for the update. One thing you could try is to make sure you have a good ground rod connected and also get one of those whole home surge protectors....supossedly those 2 items will help smooth out power fluctuations and help your appliances last longer... I know it doesn't flicker when on grid but could be worth a try if you need a whole home surge protector anyways.

 

[doox00]

Cool. Thanks for the update. One thing you could try is to make sure you have a good ground rod connected and also get one of those whole home surge protectors....supossedly those 2 items will help smooth out power fluctuations and help your appliances last longer... I know it doesn't flicker when on grid but could be worth a try if you need a whole home surge protector anyways.

Hey there, I already have a Siemens FS140 whole house surge protector on each panel in the house/pole barn, 3 total. Ohh and another one on my disconnect outside the house, they put one in when the electrician had to update to latest code when putting in all new panels in the house, so 4 total, the 1 outside is not a Siemens though, don't remember which brand it was. I had put the 3 Siemens in prior to installing the solar system.

 

[rogerheflin]

You seem to have missed that this saw was not connected to the UPS, just on the same circuit as the UPS input.

My laser printer shares the circuit/plug with my 1100 ups and it warming up freaks the UPS out. Best guess is it drags down the voltage enough that the UPS goes online because it sees the grid is unstable.