eg4 wall mount failure a concern vs racks?

[tinysparky]

Purchasing this weekend, the start of my new solar installation as my current one is SolarEdge doesn't have batteries. I like the redundancy of the rack solution, but don't know if it is worth the additional cost (wall = $8,972 for 14.3kWh vs rack of 2@ $8,570 for 10.24kWh or 3@ $9,800 for 15.36kWh).

Is failure of the whole battery something that should concern me and driving me to the slightly more redundant rack style? In the next 12 months I would either add to get a total of 2 wall mount units or 5 rack batteries.

I am getting the Gridboss+ flexboss, then.......

either the clean install of the
EG4-WallMount Indoor Battery | 48V 280Ah | 14.3kWh | Indoor | Heated UL1973, UL9540A | 10-Year Warranty
EG4 Indoor Buildable Conduit Box | Designed for EG4-WallMount Indoor Battery
Subtotal:$8,972.86 for 14.3kw

or
2x EG4 LL-S Lithium Battery | 48V 100AH | Server Rack Battery | UL1973, UL9540A | 10-Year Warranty
(Pre-Assembled) EG4 Enclosed Battery Rack | 3 Slot | Wheels Included
7' of 2/0 wire
Subtotal:$8,570.06 ($9,800 if I add in the 3rd battery to get 15.36kWh)

 

[wpns]

Neither of those options will drive the flex boss to its full output power.

 

[Underengineered]

For me, I went with the sever rack batteries because A) I have the space and B) I can move the batteries around on wheels because I’m never going to be done with my solar room. Adding rack batteries and moving them to make space is easier for me.
I don’t have an actual answer to your question except to say your worry about failure is probably legit. On the flip side I haven’t had any issues with my server rack batteries.

Edit: I wanted to clarify, I didn’t mean to say you will have a failure. What I meant to say is your worry about a failure is legit in that you would be down 14kW of storage if the wall mount does go down. I should have also added, failure is probably unlikely.

 

[wpns]

Is failure of the whole battery something that should concern me and driving me to the slightly more redundant rack style?

IMNSHO failure of the batteries is unlikely or the manufacturer wouldn’t give you a 10 year warranty. Not that their business plan couldn’t be “go out of business before the warranty claims eat us alive”, but that seems <ahem> unlikely for EG4/SS

 

[MattMan119]

On one hand the wall mound got a lot of good feedback as of late, seems everyone is using them for mount and forget type systems. Take up less space, they look great, they are easy to connect. That little power bar circle on the front is pretty convenient. They are very heavy, like right at 300lbs and not really one man job but can be. (ADDED: They have an outside version)

On the other hand, the server rack allows you to grow a bit when you need to go up to 30kw without changing what space everything takes or location or even any wiring. Just add in new batteries, connect to busbar and set dip switches and go. They are still 100lbs each, but manageable. I have not had any problems with balance or communications, but that means they are connect and talk and when it is all working, there are no problems, but does have a bit more moving parts to cause problems.

I used the 3 Server Rack battery's; not sure I had any reason other than being in an RV I could build them a nice mount. Not sure there is a right or wrong answer here. Sounds like a good place to be with both directions.

 

[Daddy Tanuki]

i guess one question is do the codes in your location have a requirement? otherwise I would agree with the server rack batteries, especially if they are on a wheeled cart that makes them easy to move.

 

[Madcodger]

Take up less space, they look great, they are easy to connect.

This convinced me to go with "wall mounts", and I now have five of them (two are not wall mounted, and stand in front of the space between the other three). If I had kids at home or lived in an earthquake zone I might not do that, but they're in a dedicated, lockable mechanical room in a household of two adults, so...). I also purchased an outdoor version of the Powerpro for my separate office building on the property (freestanding 14x22 structure) , and will connect it to a Victron Multiplus and one of their SCCs. That unit will sit inside but I bought the outdoor version for the heater, in case the heat in that building ever goes out while we're away for an extended period. I don't want it charging when cold. Personally, I find the value of those Powerpros very hard to beat.

 

[Offgrid Jungle]

This convinced me to go with "wall mounts", and I now have five of them (two are not wall mounted, and stand in front of the space between the other three). If I had kids at home or lived in an earthquake zone I might not do that, but they're in a dedicated, lockable mechanical room in a household of two adults, so...). I also purchased an outdoor version of the Powerpro for my separate office building on the property (freestanding 14x22 structure) , and will connect it to a Victron Multiplus and one of their SCCs. That unit will sit inside but I bought the outdoor version for the heater, in case the heat in that building ever goes out while we're away for an extended period. I don't want it charging when cold. Personally, I find the value of those Powerpros very hard to beat.

I've seen others stack a second unit in front of the first wall mounted battery. My two neighbors would benefit from this method. The solution in my head is to mount a eye bolt on each side and strap the second one to the wall as a safety measure. Even a rachet strap left loose would do the trick. (They both went with the outdoor version. No screen on the front to worry about and IP65 rated)

I personally went with the Big Battery Ethos system and love it. I couldn't carry the EG4 battery down tiny steps to my basement. The Ethos is also a good stackable system that is a very clean install and IP65 rated.

 

[DIYrich]

The indoor Powerpro with the conduit box is $3,400 plus shipping.
3 Lifepower rack batteries plus rack is $4,000 ($3,600 for 3 batteries and $375 for a 3 slot rack) plus shipping.

If you really care about redundancy, etc. then build your own batteries, and you can swap out bad cells.

 

[Madcodger]

I've seen others stack a second unit in front of the first wall mounted battery. My two neighbors would benefit from this method. The solution in my head is to mount a eye bolt on each side and strap the second one to the wall as a safety measure. Even a rachet strap left loose would do the trick.

I've thought of doing this, but the things are so stable in current location I haven't (yet). But if having them fall over is the worry, I think a good-sized strap sounds smart.

 

[wpns]

Check my profile picture, you can mount the first Outdoor battery 4" up the wall and the conduit box cover will clear the batteries in front of it. I've got room for one more pair of batteries in front of those, and then I have to rearrange the shelving in the utility room or punch through the back of the wall into the next room and install the next pair there. But we need some time on these to determine the payback, even with grid power at 62 cents it's hard to justify another $10K(*) for another pair of batteries.

(*) My installed cost, soup to nuts, SWAG.

 

[WattAboutThat]

First, I am not an expert.

My reasoning for using EG4 LL S batteries
is scalability. You can add up to 64 of these into your array over time. And that gives you freedom to expand as needed.

What I do not know, is if you can mix multiple batteries into the array of different brands or models.

I also do not know the max quantity of the newer eg4 wall mount batteries, and if tgey can be expanded to as much storage as the eg4 ll s models.

The EG4 LL S models store 5120Wh of energy each. Usually you purchase 6 to an array rack
(even though they offer a 3 unit rack, i would opt for the larger rack, allowing expandability.

5120Wh
x 6 = 30,720Wh
x12 = 61,440Wh
x18 = 92,160Wh
:
x36= 184,320Wh
:
x64= 327,680Wh (maximum storage).

most other systems limit to only
16 battery addresses

i think the goal is to build
up to 36 as quickly
as funds permit

this would account for a cloudy day or two

and when you have plenty of sun
you can use everything to the max

 

[Daddy Tanuki]

yes but at the currently advertised cost of 253.71 per kWh a 12 pack at 61 kWh would cost 15.5k USD. I can build that out with winstons at the same or slightly less... and i trust the winstons a bit more.

 

[Offgrid Jungle]

You might as well think in 3 battery groups. In your design, a 6 battery rack with 3 batteries to start is a reasonable approach. If floor space allows, I prefer the 3 battery racks simply because they are lower.

I was involved in consulting a design for my neighbor that has hired an experienced solar installer company. He wanted to use Pytes rack batteries and the solar guy quoted 10 batteries just set in his garage exposed. I suggested 9 Pytes batteries, filling three Pytes cabinets. If my neighbor wants more batteries, another 3 battery cabinet assembly will be added later.

 

[wpns]

First, I am not an expert.

My reasoning for using EG4 LL S batteries
is scalability. You can add up to 64 of these into your array over time. And that gives you freedom to expand as needed.

What I do not know, is if you can mix multiple batteries into the array of different brands or models.

I also do not know the max quantity of the newer eg4 wall mount batteries, and if tgey can be expanded to as much storage as the eg4 ll s models.

The EG4 LL S models store 5120Wh of energy each. Usually you purchase 6 to an array rack
(even though they offer a 3 unit rack, i would opt for the larger rack, allowing expandability.

5120Wh
x 6 = 30,720Wh
x12 = 61,440Wh
x18 = 92,160Wh
:
x36= 184,320Wh
:
x64= 327,680Wh (maximum storage).

most other systems limit to only
16 battery addresses

i think the goal is to build
up to 36 as quickly
as funds permit

this would account for a cloudy day or two

and when you have plenty of sun
you can use everything to the max

Wallmount batteries are also limited to 64 addresses, though by then you are into a quarter of a million dollars and almost a megawatt-hour, so scalability isn’t an issue.

Personally I’d rather have 1/3 fewer points of failure.