General question on panel installation / labor time.

[Bluebeat]

Hi Folks.
I am looking to build a smaller tie in grid system that I can expand at a later time. I can get a decent deal on pre-owned 200W mono panels. Not the top of the line, but cheap enough. Looking to install 4kw system that I can expand to 6.5kw at a later time when budget permits and perhaps a semi-off grid / battery in future. The hybrid inverter I am looking at is: PHOCOS ANY-GRID PSW-H 6.5KW.

2 questions please.

1) I have a licensed electrician that can do everything inside the home... but he does not like to work on the roofs. So I would need to hire somebody to install these 200W panels on the roof of one story house. I want to start with 20 panels. Considering I will have all the installation parts / wire /brackets etc. Can anybody give me an idea of how long this takes and approximate cost to put up 20 x 200W. I understand there are many variables and rates, so looking to get very average figure.

2) PHOCOS ANY-GRID PSW-H 6.5KW. Seems like a decent unit for the price. Are there competitors that are better at the same price range?

Thank you for your time.
Mike.

 

[Scixxor]

Hello, I'm not sure how much it would cost you to get those panels installed but for your second question, EG4 makes a similar all-in-one with pretty much the same features and more for $700 cheaper. A lot of people on the forum have them as well: https://signaturesolar.com/eg4-6-5k-off-grid-inverter-6500ex-48/?ref=cPwLcVc0SW-BjN Oh and seeing how you're putting those mono panels on a roof make sure they'll work well with your roof, they need a reflective surface (or at the very lease something white) under them to work well.

 

[Bluebeat]

Scixxor,
Thanks for your reply and suggestion! EG4 looks interesting. Watched couple of videos. Will look into it deeper. As far as roof installation, I will definitely get someone who knows what they are doing (or at least done it for several years). I guess, I am looking to guesstimate a median / fair price to install 20 panels (my panels + material). Personal guess, it should take no more than one full day for licensed person + helper.

 

[Scixxor]

Scixxor,
Thanks for your reply and suggestion! EG4 looks interesting. Watched couple of videos. Will look into it deeper. As far as roof installation, I will definitely get someone who knows what they are doing (or at least done it for several years). I guess, I am looking to guesstimate a median / fair price to install 20 panels (my panels + material). Personal guess, it should take no more than one full day for licensed person + helper.

Upon thinking about it more my dad does very similar work and seeing how you would have all the parts I don't see it costing you more than $600 for just 2 people for a day. But this will seriously depend on who you hire and where you live.

 

[Bluebeat]

$600... Is reasonable money for my neighborhood, but some people think they are too "special" and have to earn as much as neurosurgeons
In my opinion, a fair price for licensed non-city or fancy suburb electrician is $70-$90 an hour + helper ~$25-40. I just don't know how long it takes to put up / wire 20 x 200W panels on average roof.

Not sure if I am reading it right, but seems EG4 is not hybrid and an OFF-GRID only system.

 

[Scixxor]

$600... Is reasonable money for my neighborhood, but some people think they are too "special" and have to earn as much as neurosurgeons
In my opinion, a fair price for licensed non-city or fancy suburb electrician is $70-$90 an hour + helper ~$25-40. I just don't know how long it takes to put up / wire 20 x 200W panels on average roof.

Not sure if I am reading it right, but seems EG4 is not hybrid and an OFF-GRID only system.

Yeah I mean my dad does painting and all sorts of specialist home improvement work for $300 a day. I figure that since it's solar and more specialized + a helper that $600 was about right. Again I'm not certain as I've never had someone do it. As for the EG4 yes it's a hybrid and can work just fine off-grid and works even better with the grid.

 

[Bluebeat]

Scixxor,
EG4 is not a hybrid inv., only offgrid.... that what I was told by signaturesolar.
Surprised nobody chimed in. It is a beginner section....

 

[Scixxor]

Scixxor,
EG4 is not a hybrid inv., only offgrid.... that what I was told by signaturesolar.
Surprised nobody chimed in. It is a beginner section....

Well that's odd because it is. It has an AC input and output (the input being where you connect it to the grid) it even says in the description that is has "AC/Solar charger priority" Hell in the manual it shows that it can be connected to the grid! https://img1.wsimg.com/blobby/go/22...b/6500EX-48 Manual (1).pdf?ref=cPwLcVc0SW-BjN Have a read for yourself, it shows it on page 7. Signature solar must have misunderstood.

 

[12VoltInstalls]

one full day for licensed person + helper.

$750-$1100

 

[12VoltInstalls]

an AC input and output

One thing may be whether it’s UL approved versus UL compliant. “Compliant” may be not approved in many jurisdictions and SS may view calling it off grid as a liability pass.

 

[Solar Guy Richard]

Well that's odd because it is. It has an AC input and output (the input being where you connect it to the grid) it even says in the description that is has "AC/Solar charger priority" Hell in the manual it shows that it can be connected to the grid! https://img1.wsimg.com/blobby/go/221d8b1c-8797-46e7-aba8-9f147f582e0b/6500EX-48 Manual (1).pdf?ref=cPwLcVc0SW-BjN Have a read for yourself, it shows it on page 7. Signature solar must have misunderstood. View attachment 99375

Hybrid typically refers to being able to both utilize battery storage as well as selling back to the grid. The EG4 cannot sell back, but it can utilize grid for charging batteries or as a passthrough.

 

[Hedges]

Upon thinking about it more my dad does very similar work and seeing how you would have all the parts I don't see it costing you more than $600 for just 2 people for a day. But this will seriously depend on who you hire and where you live.

Yeah I mean my dad does painting and all sorts of specialist home improvement work for $300 a day. I figure that since it's solar and more specialized + a helper that $600 was about right. Again I'm not certain as I've never had someone do it. As for the EG4 yes it's a hybrid and can work just fine off-grid and works even better with the grid.

$600... Is reasonable money for my neighborhood, but some people think they are too "special" and have to earn as much as neurosurgeons
In my opinion, a fair price for licensed non-city or fancy suburb electrician is $70-$90 an hour + helper ~$25-40. I just don't know how long it takes to put up / wire 20 x 200W panels on average roof.

Not sure if I am reading it right, but seems EG4 is not hybrid and an OFF-GRID only system.

Wages for a person you hire, and price paid to a company for a job, can be two very different things.

At least in California, if we hire a person as an employee (whether full-time or to work one day), we need worker's compensation insurance. Last time I did that over 15 years ago, up-front payment and minimum premium was $650. Once enough wages paid to use up that much premium (percentage of wages, ranging from 2% of for office work to 100% for roofer), additional premiums due. With worker's compensation insurance, it is "no-fault". Without, you are liable for 100% of all medical expenses, lost wages, compensation.

Any reason you're not doing the roof mount installation yourself?
How about ground mount?

For a grid-tie PV system I estimate $1/watt for all materials. If complete system purchased from and installed by a company, $3 to $4/watt.
Battery system differs in cost of inverter and batteries. It is also not as large and competitive a market, and has to be sized right (vs. grid-tie where almost any size is fine, at least until you get into the nuances of utility rates.)
If you can hire the right skills for the right price you may be able to get installation done for well under that $2 to $3/watt extra. System design, troubleshooting, repair are on you.

Don't start your project and buy things without a written quote for labor to do what is needed. You may be in for a rude surprise.

 

[Bluebeat]

#1 - Thank you all for contributing!
-------------
I should have been more clear on my goals.
I want to build ~5kw-6.5k grid tie / off-grid hybrid system with batteries added at a later time.
Goals:
Reduce elec. bills and emergency power for essentials (when batteries are added)

Issues:
I lived in area for 15 years and I do not trust many local contractors (and there are solid reasons for that)
There is one electrician (licensed) that I fully trust., but he doesn't like to spend extensive time on roofs. He can hook up inverter and do all things "inside". My idea is to do my own research into major parts which are Hybrid Inverter / charger and panels. Subcontract reliable person who can draw design that will work for my location and should pass local codes, but has a flat fee. Have somebody install panels on the roof and have my electrician do the inside work.

 

[Scixxor]

Hybrid typically refers to being able to both utilize battery storage as well as selling back to the grid. The EG4 cannot sell back, but it can utilize grid for charging batteries or as a passthrough.

Ah, that explains the everything. I knew it wasn't off-grid only, thank you for the response.