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Half price electric cars

SparkyJJO said:
I don't see how 39k is considered "cheap"
Maybe compared to 120k, but that's absolutely insane.
Although that said, $16k trade in on a $30k car that was only 5 years old is horrible.

EVs are good - functionally - for a particular market, but not good for a lot of people (anywhere cold, or rural). And still not cost-effective, if you're on the early adopter train. Ouch.

I'll stick with my gas-powered cars for now. An EV would be a total waste of money here, for me.
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39k for the top of the line Mercedes thats only 2 years old?? The closest gas is the GLS 450 which isn't nearly as nice and still 65k+ for a 23.

www.mbusa.com

EQS - Luxury Electric SUV

The EQS SUV raises the bar for an electric SUV, with cutting-edge features and timeless elegance. See design, performance and technology features, as well as models, pricing, photos and more.
www.mbusa.com www.mbusa.com

I'm not really sure how its a waste of money. EVs are cheaper than gas cars, much less maintenance and electricity is 1/3 the price. Even if you charged at stations its still the same/cheaper depending on where you go. There's a few spots in columbus where I can DC fast charge for free. Run over there for 15 minutes and grab 200 miles charge.

The Tesla app says I spent $2000 over the past 365 days and saved $900 over gas. Would have been a lot more but 63% was from superchargers which was when my daughter had it in college. The goal was for her to use one of the 25 free chargers in the city but when dad pays for superchargers I guess no point. Must have been about 20k of the 30k miles and in the total time we owned it I spent $315 in repairs which was 1 service because a coolant leak or something on the engine. They even gave me a loaner


Screenshot_20250311-133724.png
 
One thing to keep in mind with a mercedes. There is no such thing as a cheap to own mercedes. This is not saying they are bad cars. I own a few of them. But they are DESIGNED to be expensive to own from parts to service.

The point is if you say to yourself that mercedes is normally out of my price range and suddenly you can get one for a cheap price... Its still out of your price range :)
 
The most I've ever spent on a gas vehicle was $21k, and that was at the peak of the covid used car market, and I had few choices, and an EV minivan doesn't exist. Our "spare" car is a '13 civic that sits most of the time, so I stand by my statement that a $39k EV is utterly a waste of money for me. Glad it works out for you, it is nice to have extra disposable income for nicer cars, and I don't fault you for being able to do that. Good for you.

But PLEASE, don't act like it is "cheaper" for everyone. It is "cheaper" for you in comparison to another high end car, sure, but for average joe who isn't spending bucketloads of money on a car, it isn't "cheap."
 
SparkyJJO said:
The most I've ever spent on a gas vehicle was $21k, and that was at the peak of the covid used car market, and I had few choices, and an EV minivan doesn't exist. Our "spare" car is a '13 civic that sits most of the time, so I stand by my statement that a $39k EV is utterly a waste of money for me. Glad it works out for you, it is nice to have extra disposable income for nicer cars, and I don't fault you for being able to do that. Good for you.

But PLEASE, don't act like it is "cheaper" for everyone. It is "cheaper" for you in comparison to another high end car, sure, but for average joe who isn't spending bucketloads of money on a car, it isn't "cheap."
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They make the VW ID.buzz, ford etransit, esprinter. also isn't the Pacifica a PHEV? Minivans are the least popular with 3.6% market share. They're not making them because no one wants them.

I can't think of another 2020 car with 100k miles thats comparable to a Tesla Model 3 for $16k. The dealer's selling it for 17.5k and thats WITH FSD. You can get older model S's for like $10k even. EVs save on average over $1200 a year vs gas.... or $100/month. That means even if you buy it for $20k over 5 years its really $14k. If EVs drop to around $5k they'll basically be free compared to gas.
 
Crowz said:
One thing to keep in mind with a mercedes. There is no such thing as a cheap to own mercedes. This is not saying they are bad cars. I own a few of them. But they are DESIGNED to be expensive to own from parts to service.

The point is if you say to yourself that mercedes is normally out of my price range and suddenly you can get one for a cheap price... Its still out of your price range :)
Click to expand...

True but they're not horrible compared to other luxury cars. I should mention my other cars are a Range Rover, Porsche Panamera Turbo, and BMW M6. I was considering a Taycan for $55-60k but those repair bills are going to be insane and idk of any indy shops that'll touch them.

I think with used EVs right now we're in an opposite bubble. People are concerned about used EVs out of warranty, most don't know the EV models and there's a huge supply off lease with little demand. Also the whole political Elon Musk Tesla thing is causing people to dump their Teslas and flood the market.

The dealer bought my EQS for 54k in Dec and sold it for 38k so like a 17k loss. Plus they're basically selling my Tesla at cost
 
justinm001 said:
They make the VW ID.buzz, ford etransit, esprinter. also isn't the Pacifica a PHEV? Minivans are the least popular with 3.6% market share. They're not making them because no one wants them.

I can't think of another 2020 car with 100k miles thats comparable to a Tesla Model 3 for $16k. The dealer's selling it for 17.5k and thats WITH FSD. You can get older model S's for like $10k even. EVs save on average over $1200 a year vs gas.... or $100/month. That means even if you buy it for $20k over 5 years its really $14k. If EVs drop to around $5k they'll basically be free compared to gas.
Click to expand...

The e-transit costs $45k and gets a wow 159 miles rated so in real life in the winter it gets what, 100 miles? Could be useful, I guess, but $20,000 is a LOT of gasoline and maintenance, without the headaches. We have a minivan because we have 3 kids, a little car is a no-go with how stupid big these car seats are (can't fit the 3 in the Civic at all, no chance). And given 10k miles/year (I'm surprised we do that much) there is no way an EV would pay for itself.

Again, a Model 3 or Model S is useless for me. The closest equivalent vehicle I have is the Civic and it sits most of its life now. Only reason we even have it is the car has been paid off for years, and having a spare set of wheels on occasion warrants having it around. But, if we didn't have it, I wouldn't go spending thousands to go get it, and an EV would be even more useless as the most times it gets used is in the winter when I won't drive my summer car.

I'm sure an EV make sense for some people, and I have no problem with that. But don't you go telling me an EV is good for everyone because they simply are not.
 
SparkyJJO said:
The e-transit costs $45k and gets a wow 159 miles rated so in real life in the winter it gets what, 100 miles? Could be useful, I guess, but $20,000 is a LOT of gasoline and maintenance, without the headaches. We have a minivan because we have 3 kids, a little car is a no-go with how stupid big these car seats are (can't fit the 3 in the Civic at all, no chance). And given 10k miles/year (I'm surprised we do that much) there is no way an EV would pay for itself.

Again, a Model 3 or Model S is useless for me. The closest equivalent vehicle I have is the Civic and it sits most of its life now. Only reason we even have it is the car has been paid off for years, and having a spare set of wheels on occasion warrants having it around. But, if we didn't have it, I wouldn't go spending thousands to go get it, and an EV would be even more useless as the most times it gets used is in the winter when I won't drive my summer car.

I'm sure an EV make sense for some people, and I have no problem with that. But don't you go telling me an EV is good for everyone because they simply are not.
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There's tons of EV SUVs with 3rd row. Even mine has a 3rd row option. Can easily fit 4 car seats in the back. Looks like the model Y can fit 2 car seats in the 3rd row. I'm assuming they're 20k used too as they're similar priced to the model 3.

But you're not really comparing apples to apples, you're comparing a free car to a 20k car. Compare a 2020 gas car to a 2020 20k model Y then add $1k/year in additional fuel. Ignore the maintenance which is more in gas and other things.

Even a chrysler pacifica PHEV gets close to 30miles on electric only, which covers most trips. ITs not much more than the gas only version.

An EV is cheaper and more reliable than gas. Your only issue is they only have a few minivans and they're not old enough to compare in pricing.

Now Tesla opened up their charging network to other manufacturers and there's tons of DC fast charge everywhere its not an issue to travel in an EV. I'm betting we'll be seeing a ton of Bucee's and other similar places add EV chargers and start popping up with something to do in 15-30 minutes while you charge and hop back on the road
 
And maybe someday they'll be viable option.

Not yet.

I like options. Maybe I'll buy one one day.

But not yet.

And NO ONE should ever FORCE me to buy what they want me to buy. I'm not one to force anyone to buy a gas car if they want an EV, so no one should force me to buy an EV if I want a gas car.

And after reading about the guy here on this forum who dumped tons of kWh into his battery to just barely charge it in the winter due to the heating requirements so it could even begin to charge....

You buy what you want and can afford. I'll buy what I want and can afford. Maybe sometimes there will be overlap. Maybe not. And that's fine.
 
SparkyJJO said:
And maybe someday they'll be viable option.

Not yet.

I like options. Maybe I'll buy one one day.

But not yet.

And NO ONE should ever FORCE me to buy what they want me to buy. I'm not one to force anyone to buy a gas car if they want an EV, so no one should force me to buy an EV if I want a gas car.

And after reading about the guy here on this forum who dumped tons of kWh into his battery to just barely charge it in the winter due to the heating requirements so it could even begin to charge....

You buy what you want and can afford. I'll buy what I want and can afford. Maybe sometimes there will be overlap. Maybe not. And that's fine.
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100% agree. Winter isn't great with an EV since we don't have hot engines to provide all that heat into the cabin. My range went from 230 to 200 at 80%. I'm supposed to charge up to 200kwh but it was at like 65kwh and preconditioning got to 80kwh most times. Preconditioning can't use that much power, maybe 1-2 kwh
 
I agree Re: rural/cold to a point. It's more about the use pattern. $10-15K can get a decent used EV. I haven't purchased fuel for any of my vehicles in over a year, And I haven't purchased significant electriciy for the same length of time, here and there for an odd trip. I haven't replaced, brakes, heater hoses, spark plugs, oil, air filters, pcv valves, fuel injectors, fuel filters, fuel pumps, o2 sensors, exhaust systems, MAF sensors, etc. I have replaced tires, and the 12v battery.

EV is a no brainer here for me. Just not a lot to go wrong.
 
ksmithaz1 said:
I agree Re: rural/cold to a point. It's more about the use pattern. $10-15K can get a decent used EV. I haven't purchased fuel for any of my vehicles in over a year, And I haven't purchased significant electriciy for the same length of time, here and there for an odd trip. I haven't replaced, brakes, heater hoses, spark plugs, oil, air filters, pcv valves, fuel injectors, fuel filters, fuel pumps, o2 sensors, exhaust systems, MAF sensors, etc. I have replaced tires, and the 12v battery.

EV is a no brainer here for me. Just not a lot to go wrong.
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Same could be said for almost every single Toyota hybrid on the road…. @ 45/gallon it’s cheaper and easier for your average Joe to get a hybrid
 
And I since I got rid of the RX8, I just cleaned out the cabinet, a need to get rid of 8 quarts of 5-20 conventional, and several gallons of anti-freeze, the oil drain pan. I guess I'll hold onto all the pullers and crap, but I doubt, I'll ever need to do another timing belt, and I'm not sure which car this serpintine belt was for. Boxes of odds and ends for vacuum system on the old Olds.
 
ksmithaz1 said:
And I since I got rid of the RX8, I just cleaned out the cabinet, a need to get rid of 8 quarts of 5-20 conventional, and several gallons of anti-freeze, the oil drain pan. I guess I'll hold onto all the pullers and crap, but I doubt, I'll ever need to do another timing belt, and I'm not sure which car this serpintine belt was for. Boxes of odds and ends for vacuum system on the old Olds.
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Picture inheriting a 2 car garage fully loaded with tools, parts and fluids and no clue what any of it goes to...

I got a box with timing belts. Best I can tell there are belts for at least 3 different engines. No clue if they match anything I own or inherited.
 
Re: Prius, ummm. they have a motor and it runs. Work with a guy who leases them, was cabbing, now uber/lyft. Did I mention no oil drips in the driveway? Prius's leak like a sieve after a lot of use.

I will say a modern Hybrid is a pretty nice ride.
 
ksmithaz1 said:
And I since I got rid of the RX8, I just cleaned out the cabinet, a need to get rid of 8 quarts of 5-20 conventional, and several gallons of anti-freeze, the oil drain pan. I guess I'll hold onto all the pullers and crap, but I doubt, I'll ever need to do another timing belt, and I'm not sure which car this serpintine belt was for. Boxes of odds and ends for vacuum system on the old Olds.
Click to expand...
I got rid of my last 3 rotor cosmo in 04, got rid of my FD in 14 but kept my two first gens…. It’s about time to pull them out of storage and rebuild everything
 
justinm001 said:
They make the VW ID.buzz, ford etransit, esprinter. also isn't the Pacifica a PHEV? Minivans are the least popular with 3.6% market share. They're not making them because no one wants them.

I can't think of another 2020 car with 100k miles thats comparable to a Tesla Model 3 for $16k. The dealer's selling it for 17.5k and thats WITH FSD. You can get older model S's for like $10k even. EVs save on average over $1200 a year vs gas.... or $100/month. That means even if you buy it for $20k over 5 years its really $14k. If EVs drop to around $5k they'll basically be free compared to gas.
Click to expand...
one think that has been ignored in this conversation is the simple fact that what would be a minor accident with a ICE engine vehicle can be a total for an EV. fine if you spend thousands on comprehensive gap insurance and uninsured motorists.. but what if you have the bare bones cover the other idiot insurance? now that EV is a ticking time bomb waiting for you to slide off the road one time in the rain, or snow and it is totaled. Or you can buy a 5 year old toyota, honda (fuck i hate hondas)(other than 3 wheelers, quads and dirt bikes) cash on the barrel head and buy the cheapest insurance as other than an major event that total the car you can always fix it cheaply...

there is a cost associated with the insurance that you all are ignoring.

I have the required by the base (DOD military required) minimum of 3 million yen (call it 25k USD for easy calculating) liability. it costs me depending upon vehicle shoot: break it down:

2006 nissan work truck, gets cargo/commerical: 30,000 yen per year
2016 subaru forestor, Wifes, passenger car rates: 20,000 yen per year
2018 Crown, passenger car rates 20,000 per year
1999 F350 dualie, cargo commercial 35,000 yen per year.

this is the bare minimum for each all it covers is the other guy.

so lets pick the cheapest of the four.. the nissan work truck full coverage for it for one year is 3k and the most they will pay out at its current age is 5k....

how about a nissan leaf? one of the most common if not the most common EV in japan. it is 5K a year for a driver with a clean record over the age of 35 yet younger than 60...(yes my rates will go up in another year or so) thats 5k... compared to 200 USD for bare minimum, however anything that can affect the battery system is going to total it. not as easy as a Tesla where a bent battery cover can total it, but you get the idea, there is no way in hell that the tesla or the nissan leaf is worth more than my wifes forester (which gets shitty gas mileage ) once you figure in insurance... remember sliding off the road in the crown or the forester might be a bent tie rod... bend/ding/crimp the battery cover on the tesla and it is totalled (at least in the US form what I have seen online.) so how is it cheaper once you figure in the needed full coverage to prevent it from getting totaled the one time it snows and you slide off the road?
 
Daddy Tanuki said:
one think that has been ignored in this conversation is the simple fact that what would be a minor accident with a ICE engine vehicle can be a total for an EV. fine if you spend thousands on comprehensive gap insurance and uninsured motorists.. but what if you have the bare bones cover the other idiot insurance? now that EV is a ticking time bomb waiting for you to slide off the road one time in the rain, or snow and it is totaled. Or you can buy a 5 year old toyota, honda (fuck i hate hondas)(other than 3 wheelers, quads and dirt bikes) cash on the barrel head and buy the cheapest insurance as other than an major event that total the car you can always fix it cheaply...

there is a cost associated with the insurance that you all are ignoring.

I have the required by the base (DOD military required) minimum of 3 million yen (call it 25k USD for easy calculating) liability. it costs me depending upon vehicle shoot: break it down:

2006 nissan work truck, gets cargo/commerical: 30,000 yen per year
2016 subaru forestor, Wifes, passenger car rates: 20,000 yen per year
2018 Crown, passenger car rates 20,000 per year
1999 F350 dualie, cargo commercial 35,000 yen per year.

this is the bare minimum for each all it covers is the other guy.

so lets pick the cheapest of the four.. the nissan work truck full coverage for it for one year is 3k and the most they will pay out at its current age is 5k....

how about a nissan leaf? one of the most common if not the most common EV in japan. it is 5K a year for a driver with a clean record over the age of 35 yet younger than 60...(yes my rates will go up in another year or so) thats 5k... compared to 200 USD for bare minimum, however anything that can affect the battery system is going to total it. not as easy as a Tesla where a bent battery cover can total it, but you get the idea, there is no way in hell that the tesla or the nissan leaf is worth more than my wifes forester (which gets shitty gas mileage ) once you figure in insurance... remember sliding off the road in the crown or the forester might be a bent tie rod... bend/ding/crimp the battery cover on the tesla and it is totalled (at least in the US form what I have seen online.) so how is it cheaper once you figure in the needed full coverage to prevent it from getting totaled the one time it snows and you slide off the road?
Click to expand...
I don't think full coverage insurance for EVs is really more than gas vehicles. They're not nearly as fragile as you make them out to be. But I don't really understand insurance. Also I get a couple speeding tickets a year and drive expensive cars so insurance hates me.
 
justinm001 said:
I don't think full coverage insurance for EVs is really more than gas vehicles. They're not nearly as fragile as you make them out to be. But I don't really understand insurance. Also I get a couple speeding tickets a year and drive expensive cars so insurance hates me.
Click to expand...
sorry but the insurance agent ways you are full of feces.
 
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