Honda EU2000i propane conversion?

[2Big2B]

This was originally posted as:

"The Champion 2000 inverters is on sale at AMAZON for $499".

Well, long story short, AMAZON, or its supplier, blew it. They kept having shipping issues. I think it "fell off the truck" somewhere. Whatever. After two weeks and three attempts I gave up. It wasn't meant to be.

Pity. The Champion 2000 dual fuel is probably the best bang for the buck right now.
I researched it. It is the closest thing to having a Honda for a third of the cost. And it runs propane.

There is an important break in procedure though, that must be performed properly. It involves changing out the cheap chinese spark plug and running it for 5 hours at various loads; and then draining and changing to oil to remove the released metal shaving debris. It is a lot of hands on babying that I some people probably don't bother with. Its not fun.

BTW, if you get a Champion 2000/2500 to use primarily on propane, I would personnaly use the irridium version of the NFK BPR5HS Spark Plug, the NFK BPR6HIX, gapped tighter to about .22 - to tweak it for propane.

Buying a poorly broken in inverter generator can be a hazard worth considering when buying a used one.


Nevertheless, I found a good used Honda EU2000i for $500, delivered and demonstrated. It started right up, and ran clean and quiet. Its a Honda.

It has gasoline in it but I plan to convert to propane .

Hutch Mountain and Grenergy sell the most popular tri-fuel conversion kits, both at $299. There are others on ebay that are cheaper, and they all seem to use the same commonly available parts; with a large low pressure regulator being the main component. I could probably build the same kit myself sourcing the parts from Alibaba and Amazon for half the price. But should I?



The tricky bit is adjusting the low pressure regulator to get the right mixture setting. For $299 you get some hand holding if it won't start. That is the tradeoff. I need to think about that.





Any advice?

 

[Q-Dog]

Champion apparel and Champion Power Equipment are not the same company.

 

[wpns]

having combustables stored at my apartment is forbidden by the lease- but nobody said 'nuthin about no propane.

As long as you use that fancy new non-combustible propane you should be fine. It’s a bit more expensive than the regular stuff, but I hear it lasts longer.

 

[2Big2B]

Update:
Amazon blew it.

Instead I found a really nice used Honda 2000i locally for $500 cash, delivered.

I couldn't walk away from. that.



It test started right up on third pull. So now I have it, with a full tank of gas stashed away for now.
I am now working on plans to convert it to propane with a Hutch Mountain conversion kit ($300).



I might put together my own a DYI kit version using the same parts, for about half money. But I would be on my own without a customer support resource. That's a big tradeoff for something like this that I have no experience with tweaking. It might be pure frustration to figure out why it wont start without the right adjustments.

I would be interested in hearing from others with any experience with that.

 

[ElectricIslander]

Quite a few of my off-grid neighbours have had good results with propane conversions of their Honda 3000 inverter generators.

 

[JRH]

This was originally posted as:

"The Champion 2000 inverters is on sale at AMAZON for $499".

Well, long story short, AMAZON, or its supplier, blew it. They kept having shipping issues. I think it "fell off the truck" somewhere. Whatever. After two weeks and three attempts I gave up. It wasn't meant to be.

Pity. The Champion 2000 dual fuel is probably the best bang for the buck right now.
I researched it. It is the closest thing to having a Honda for a third of the cost. And it runs propane.

There is an important break in procedure though, that must be performed properly. It involves changing out the cheap chinese spark plug and running it for 5 hours at various loads; and then draining and changing to oil to remove the released metal shaving debris. It is a lot of hands on babying that I some people probably don't bother with. Its not fun.

BTW, if you get a Champion 2000/2500 to use primarily on propane, I would personnaly use the irridium version of the NFK BPR5HS Spark Plug, the NFK BPR6HIX, gapped tighter to about .22 - to tweak it for propane.

Buying a poorly broken in inverter generator can be a hazard worth considering when buying a used one.


Nevertheless, I found a good used Honda EU2000i for $500, delivered and demonstrated. It started right up, and ran clean and quiet. Its a Honda.

It has gasoline in it but I plan to convert to propane .

Hutch Mountain and Grenergy sell the most popular tri-fuel conversion kits, both at $299. There are others on ebay that are cheaper, and they all seem to use the same commonly available parts; with a large low pressure regulator being the main component. I could probably build the same kit myself sourcing the parts from Alibaba and Amazon for half the price. But should I?



The tricky bit is adjusting the low pressure regulator to get the right mixture setting. For $299 you get some hand holding if it won't start. That is the tradeoff. I need to think about that.

View attachment 235594View attachment 235595



Any advice?

I have a Hutch Mountain conversion kit…for my Honda 2200… good stuff… I also have the champion 3400 dual fuel .. lived off of it for 3 full weeks 24/7 ,did great… ran everything in the RV…
Both are good things to have…

 

[OzSolar]

One of the very few things I've learned in my 55 some odd years is that, in general, trying to beat people out of thier "overpriced" kits never works out. YMMV

 

[2Big2B]

One of the very few things I've learned in my 55 some odd years is that, in general, trying to beat people out of thier "overpriced" kits never works out. YMMV

From my own 70+ years, I absolutely agree.

Reverse engineering someone else's proprietary design work is wrong on many levels. It is arguably unethical. Moreover it commits to someone else's design flaws. Missteps from ordering wrong parts and unforseen obstacles can be more expensive.

But admit it. It's fun.
That's what this DYI group is all about, no?

My specific need is for an having an emergency use only inverter generator to mitigate a hurricane's long term power outtage. It needs to be small, compact, quiet and safely stored. It needs to run on propane particularly because I live in an apartment building where storing gasoline is a lease violation. I wouldn't dream of it. But propane? I doubt propane is any issue to be of complaint during or after a Category class hurricane. Until then, it stays on the down low.

I already have a capable 10kw battery bank and 1500w psw inverter to survive comfortably for a few days. It is not sustainable beyond that without an acceptable battery recharger solution.

I have an unassembled 520w 4 flex panel + charge contoller makeshift solution, but it won't help much if skies are still heavily overcast with sustained bad weather. Also on the down low.

But having a little inverter on propane is perfect. I only need it to power 1000 watts continuously. It is for my 10A powerblock wheelchair battery charger. I can get up to 1800w out of the Honda running on propane. It will just purr on that.

Apart from a marginal reduction in power, propane also runs hotter than the Honda air cooled gasoline design. They are built for abuse though. They are hard to kill little beasts. But that's probably why kits like Genergy like cutting out vent holes in the door panel and spark plug door cover.

My solution is to simply run the Honda with the door panel off and spark plug cover off; with a propane hose connecting directly from the regulator into the carburator. It will run fine on pure propane.

Running it might make it a little less quiet, but I can mitigate that if I need to.
Running it with open access will give me view and access of the engine, and it would provide better air cooling.

Why butcher the case ???
Why shove in all that pricey gas line hardware crap in there?
Are you trying to kill the beast ???

Overstuff it with crap that interferes with its air cooling
Introduce multiple gaslines leading to bleeding of propane under the hood.
With the right air / temperature mixture it might explode.

Yeah. That might do it. Godzilla.

I think these kit designs are stupid.

Just Keep It Simple.

I will port the propane directly into the carberator venturi flange hack from a hose through its open door panel.

With an open door panel operation it will run cooler and involve no permanent radical surgery or expensive, leaky and unnecessary extra hose connections. The venturi with hose can always be removed to restore everything back to original, or the added venturi mod can be left in place, blocked off.

Parts list:
I have ordered a Garretson type 039-122 Low Pressure Regulator and 3/8" ID Natural Gas Hose from ebay.. $30 (cheapest)
I have ordered the NashFuel's load block that everyone uses.. $$25 (overpriced for what it is)
I have ordered the NashFuel's model specific venturi flange.. $60 (arguably unnecessary)
I have ordered a NGK Iridium-IX Spark Plug CR5HIX ... $15 (gapped to .022 for best propane performance)

That comes to about $200. A complete kit runs only about $300 with all that extra meatball surgery stuff...

Propane tank -> regulator -> load block -> hose - > carburetor venturi.

Simple, practical and cheap.



Youtube videos
Watch enough of these videos and you pick up on all the clumbsy mistakes people make in both plan and execution.
You get to learn from others mistakes.

Convert Honda EU2200i EU2000i to propane without any conversion kit
This is mostly one what influenced me the most.

Honda EU2200i Generator Propane Conversion Kit - Easy Installation - a Hutch Mountain conversion.
This one is great! An installation by some blonde standing outside in the snow of Alaska!

Hybrid battery backup with several generator options
Here are multiple Honda EU 2000i propane inverters running in parallel.

Its interesting, but I don't like the looks of this style conversion:
I guess its advantage is easier starting.
By placing the regulator as close as possible to the engine, the low pressured gas gets into the engine faster.
That probably means one less pull on the rope to prime it. A blessing.
You lose easy access to the engine as a tradeoff as a curse.
It must make oil changes a nightmare.

EU2000i EU2200i - Propane & Natural Gas Conversion Kit Install for Honda Generator
I respect the work this guy at Grenergy has put into his product. I have spent some time studying the parts he uses to figure things out. I love the concept. I hate the execution. For all the reasons previously stated. I wish I could buy his machined aluminum block venturi.

Also:

Honda Propane Conversion Kit - Less Power?? Engine Damage?? Video Part 1 - EU2200i EU2000i
Grenergy explains more details.


Honda EU2000i Propane conversion
This is a more radical option of replacing the carburator with one that has been modified.
Very instructional but I wouldn't do it. Too complicated. Just pray it will start.
I don't like tugging on a recoil engine that won't start.

GenConneX - A Slick Conversion Kit
Remove the fuel tank and shove the regulator under the hood instead.
A marvel in creative engineering. Full dissasembly required. $399.
Full gender reassignment. It would make Dr. Kinsey cross his legs...

 

[Offgrid Jungle]

But you already have legal gasoline storage in your vehicle. Where are you going to get propane during the storm?

 

[wpns]

Let us know how it goes. I'm also prohibited from storing flammables in my garage, though I guess they look the other way when the power's out but the instructions for the tri-fuel kit I saw made it look like it's "three fuels, but pick one, and potentially remove the adapter to use with gasoline", which is much less interesting...
Now I wish I hadn't gotten rid of those metal jerry cans.

 

[Luk88]

But you already have legal gasoline storage in your vehicle. Where are you going to get propane during the storm?

I suppose the gas mains, but that surely would be LNG, right? Or maybe the apartment association prohibits gas, but they don't care about propane bottles?

But then how does one run a generator in an apartment? Maybe on a balcony? If I was in this position I'd like a generator as backup of a backup, but my primary backup plan would be balcony solar (if possible).

 

[2Big2B]

But you already have legal gasoline storage in your vehicle. Where are you going to get propane during the storm?

Well, that's a fair question.

I don't own a car - just a couple of power wheelchairs. Both are powered by 24v 100A LiFePo4 DYI batteries. One is for roaming my apartment. The other is my street beast. Building its batteries is what originally led me here a couple of years ago. Planning on how to remain operational using them in the event of a rougue hurricane is kinda' why I am still here - just to keep my hand on things.

I have the wheelchair batteries setup with Anderson connectors to attach inverters. They are stand alone 2.5kw power banks. I have two pair of new Power Queen 24v 100A 12v LiFePo4 batteries as spare 24v packs to also run an inverter, or I can split it out to 12v applications if I want to stretch things.

But you're right, where am I going to get gas or propane in the aftermath of a storm?
After a few days when my batteries run down, thats where my makeshift 4 panel 520w solar generator comes into play.
If the sun won't shine, out comes the generator.
Beyond that, I guess I will just have to sit in the dark like everyone else.
I still have an acoustic guitar and an uncurable love of the blues ...

 

[2Big2B]

Let us know how it goes. I'm also prohibited from storing flammables in my garage, though I guess they look the other way when the power's out but the instructions for the tri-fuel kit I saw made it look like it's "three fuels, but pick one, and potentially remove the adapter to use with gasoline", which is much less interesting...
Now I wish I hadn't gotten rid of those metal jerry cans.

Getting a generator never occurred to me until now, so it is being a bit of an education for me too. I thought this would be a good place to journal what I have been figuring out, for the sake of other pilgrims that follow.

I collected the Youtube links that make short work on understanding the Honda propane conversion.
If you can't afford a Honda, get a Champion 2500 for $499 at Amazon. It's dual fuel - propane or gasoline. I was planning on getting one myself. Breaking one in is a chore though.

 

[wpns]

I suppose the gas mains, but that surely would be LNG, right?

The gas mains are gaseous Natural Gas, not Liquified Natural Gas, that would be a nightmare! But yeah, essentially methane.

 

[Brucey]

In the US generally there's the piped natural gas to the house, or LPG (in smaller grill tank size and then moving up to 1000 gallons or more).

You would need to change the orifice size if moving from nat gas to lpg, or at least had to do that for our gas dryer.

 

[2Big2B]

I suppose the gas mains, but that surely would be LNG, right? Or maybe the apartment association prohibits gas, but they don't care about propane bottles?

But then how does one run a generator in an apartment? Maybe on a balcony? If I was in this position I'd like a generator as backup of a backup, but my primary backup plan would be balcony solar (if possible).

Right.

Battery bank w/inverter is first backup plan.
520w solar power on my back door south facing ground floor balcony/patio is backup to battery backup.
Generator is the backup backup to the battery backup. Kapische' ?

I got a full 5gal / 20lb BBQ propane bottle that will carry me a couple of days. I could carry it on my power wheelchair to the 7-Eleven down the street for an exchange maybe. Or, I could find someone to bring me some gasoline. I have options.

 

[2Big2B]

The gas mains are gaseous Natural Gas, not Liquified Natural Gas, that would be a nightmare! But yeah, essentially methane.

Personally, as much as I would like to, I am not about to mess with home gass lines, or the electric panel... I don't own the place. Batteries, solar, bottled propane, finger picking the blues in the dark. In that order. Can't hardly wait.

 

[2Big2B]

I suppose the gas mains, but that surely would be LNG, right? Or maybe the apartment association prohibits gas, but they don't care about propane bottles?

But then how does one run a generator in an apartment? Maybe on a balcony? If I was in this position I'd like a generator as backup of a backup, but my primary backup plan would be balcony solar (if possible).

FWIW, I have heard that LPG gas runs poorly in generators. I would avoid.

Also, one can do a weld on a tailpipe for attaching an exhuaust hose for porting away the exhaust fumes. Theoretically I guess one could run the generator inside the apartment, but its not worth messing around with the dangerous fumes and noise involved. If I wanted to live in that I could always move to the city...

 

[wme]

https://trufuel50.com/4-cycle-mix/
A little pricey, but it has a 5 year+ storage when in an unopened factory can.
I store my generator carb dry after running it on trufuel and have 2 gallons. I can keep my DIY solar generators charged for 10 days on 2 gallons.
There other brands of this type of gas.

 

[2Big2B]

https://trufuel50.com/4-cycle-mix/
A little pricey, but it has a 5 year+ storage when in an unopened factory can.
I store my generator carb dry after running it on trufuel and have 2 gallons. I can keep my DIY solar generators charged for 10 days on 2 gallons.
There other brands of this type of gas.

I wasn't aware of this product.

Home depot sells it for about $7 for 32oz can = 1/4 ga. = $28 per gallon.
Amazon sells a case of (6) 32oz = 1.5 gal = $28 per gallon with free delivery...

It couldn't hurt to replace the gas in it now with this stuff until I get around to the propane conversion.

Good idea.

Thank you.

 

[ElectricIslander]

Ryobi makes a nice little 900W propane only inverter generator that I found very reliable and quiet. Perfect for charging batteries on a balcony as it can take small propane barbeque canisters in a pinch.

It ran about 3000 hours and powered our off grid cabin 12 hrs a day (synthetic oil changed every 100 hrs) until eventually it's camshaft gear broke. I bought a 20 foot barbeque extension hose and ran it off our 500 gallon propane tank but initially ran it off 20 lb barbeque cylinders and even the little 2 lb camping canisters which screwed right into the generator.

Propane's flame temperature is indeed slightly hotter than gasoline but I've never found overheating of propane generators to be an issue at all. If anything small generators can run better on propane than gasoline but do not quite put out as much peak power due to about 20% reduced energy in the fuel.

 

[2Big2B]

I saw a photo somewhere of that little Ryobi running on a 1lb bottle about a month ago, and it blew my mind. I wasn't aware that small inverter generators existed that ran on propane and regretted my new investment in solar.

Also known as a Baja 900, I couldn't find one for sale anywhere though. I think they were literally a flash in the pan. Your's is the second one that I've heard about which apparently had the same sort of death.



It suggests to me that they all probably had the same design flaw that removed from the market. Then again, because of its form factor, I wonder how many people asphixiated themselves by running it inside? Perhaps it was a safety regulation thing that made these little gems dissapear.

Pity. It looked perfect to me at the time.

Probably just as well though, as it led me to discover the more robust alternatives like the Champion 2000. I wasn't keen on having to break in a new one though. Running a 2000w inverter for 5 hours under various loads on my patio would invite undue attention from neighbors and management. Not going through that exercize is probably what the issue was on the Ryobi/Baja 900w inverters like yours. They weren't built for a long life. They weren't a Honda.

I got lucky. I found a used Honda, albeit a gasoline machine but convertable. It has gasoline in it and ready to run as is. I am uncomfortable with having the gasoline in it though, as it needs special attention to prevent the decaying fuel from giving me problems. But, its already broken in. Assuming the gas is fresh (?) I think I will leave it operational as is, under wraps for a few months to get past hurricane season ,and then tackle the job of pulling and draining the carburator, purging the fuel lines and converting it over to propane. That would be the smart way to go I think.

My gut tells me to expect a serious weather event to ravage the powerlines later this season. I am banking on it.

 

[Luk88]

https://trufuel50.com/4-cycle-mix/
A little pricey, but it has a 5 year+ storage when in an unopened factory can.
I store my generator carb dry after running it on trufuel and have 2 gallons. I can keep my DIY solar generators charged for 10 days on 2 gallons.
There other brands of this type of gas.

I used to be quite careful when it comes to removing old gas/petrol from carburetor. But a decade or so ago I left few items for 2-3 years with fuel in them. I had no problem at all with 4 stroke engines. 2 strokes had to be flushed with clean fuel.

These days I don't care. Both my movers and a tiler had 3~4 winters with gas in and after I add half a tank of fresh fuel it starts fine.

My generator always has fuel in its tank. I close the valve going to the carb, but I don't run it to use fuel up. Again no problems (however I run it once at least every 3 months).

Also as my car is a diesel I buy petrol/gas once a year and I keep it in my shed. I have 20l,10l and 5l tanks. Often a half full 5l tank will go unnoticed for a couple of years. Again no issues.

Perhaps this is a difference in the kind of fuel we have around here vs elsewhere ? Or have I been lucky? (Eastern/Central Europe )

 

[Brucey]

I used to be quite careful when it comes to removing old gas/petrol from carburetor. But a decade or so ago I left few items for 2-3 years with fuel in them. I had no problem at all with 4 stroke engines. 2 strokes had to be flushed with clean fuel.

These days I don't care. Both my movers and a tiler had 3~4 winters with gas in and after I add half a tank of fresh fuel it starts fine.

My generator always has fuel in its tank. I close the valve going to the carb, but I don't run it to use fuel up. Again no problems (however I run it once at least every 3 months).

Also as my car is a diesel I buy petrol/gas once a year and I keep it in my shed. I have 20l,10l and 5l tanks. Often a half full 5l tank will go unnoticed for a couple of years. Again no issues.

Perhaps this is a difference in the kind of fuel we have around here vs elsewhere ? Or have I been lucky? (Eastern/Central Europe )

In the US due to big corn lobby there's 10% ethanol mixed in with most petrol grades, this causes big problems for small engines when left undrained. It's possible to get ethanol free/pure petrol but only at select stations and at premium pricing.

 

[Q-Dog]

I used to be quite careful when it comes to removing old gas/petrol from carburetor. But a decade or so ago I left few items for 2-3 years with fuel in them. I had no problem at all with 4 stroke engines. 2 strokes had to be flushed with clean fuel.

These days I don't care. Both my movers and a tiler had 3~4 winters with gas in and after I add half a tank of fresh fuel it starts fine.

My generator always has fuel in its tank. I close the valve going to the carb, but I don't run it to use fuel up. Again no problems (however I run it once at least every 3 months).

Also as my car is a diesel I buy petrol/gas once a year and I keep it in my shed. I have 20l,10l and 5l tanks. Often a half full 5l tank will go unnoticed for a couple of years. Again no issues.

Perhaps this is a difference in the kind of fuel we have around here vs elsewhere ? Or have I been lucky? (Eastern/Central Europe )

We have ethanol added to our fuel and a lot of people complain about it here. I personally have not had a problem with it, and in fact my fuel systems are cleaner now because of the alcohol. BUT, none of my stuff sits for longer than 6 or so months, and I always buy fuel from the busiest place in town.

Before ethanol I had to drain water out of gas tanks all the time. Haven't had to do that in the over 30 years we have had ethanol enhanced fuel.