How dangerous are swollen LiFePo4 cells received from AliExpress ?

elvis_asaftei

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How dangerous are swollen LiFePo4 cells received from AliExpress ?

What do you think about the amount they are swollen?

was shipped by PWOD seller :

US $630.50 35% Off | PWOD 4-16PCS CATL 3.2V 310AH grade A lifepo4 battery RV 320AH battery pack RV and Solar Energy storage system EU US tax free


1319B482-6EE1-4942-8E68-D713715B6039.jpeg

081AE8F6-D795-4441-8BE3-AEC22C4A9339.jpeg
 

elvis_asaftei

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How dangerous are swollen LiFePo4 cells received from AliExpress ?

What do you think about the amount they are swollen?

was shipped by PWOD seller :

US $630.50 35% Off | PWOD 4-16PCS CATL 3.2V 310AH grade A lifepo4 battery RV 320AH battery pack RV and Solar Energy storage system EU US tax free


View attachment 55327

View attachment 55328

you can see that I can’t even use the busbar because of the swollen amount . What do you think ?
 

Bubba1

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I feel bad for you. I would try for refund. They probably shipped them insured or should have. It is the fault of supplier and or shipper or both.
 

Watchout

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Swollen cells should never occour on NEW cells, and is an indication of potential future problems. Try use a QR-code reader and check what production codes they have. If there is also selfadhesive paperstickers check if the codes match. Also check for scuff marks in particular on the bottom of cells. If it is new cells, the terminals should be bright and shiny, and copper almost yellowish rather than mat and reddish.

If you just received cells be sure to test them with capacity tester (I use a DL24P), but if your cells are 310Ah, that may take too long for a test (310 Ah / max 20A Constant Current = 15.5h).

Also please note that equal voltage on each cell is no indication of bsllanced cells.
 
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elvis_asaftei

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Swollen cells should never occour on NEW cells, and is an indication of potential future problems. Try use a QR-code reader and check what production codes they have. If there is also selfadhesive paperstickers check if the codes match. Also check for scuff marks in particular on the bottom of cells. If it is new cells, the terminals should be bright and shiny, and copper almost yellowish rather than mat and reddish.

If you just received cells be sure to test them with capacity tester (I use a DL24P), but if your cells are 310Ah, that may take too long for a test (310 Ah / max 20A Constant Current = 15.5h).

Also please note that equal voltage on each cell is no indication of bsllanced cells.

possible from high temperature with train metal container transport in direct sunlight or was shipped already swollen?
 

RCinFLA

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Bloating usually was caused by overcharging. They may blame you to get out of replacements.
Electrolyte can also breakdown if subjected to over 100 degs C (dark colored shipping container baking in hot sun).

The commonly used electrolyte is lithium hexafluorophosphate, ‘salt’ (LiPF6) dissolved in Ethylene Carbonate (EC) ‘solvent’ and will acccelerate in chemically breakdown rate above about 4.3v and below 0.2v. . 0.2v cell would have other issues with possible metal dendrite growth creating cell shorts.

When electrolyte breaks down, gases, mostly carbon dioxide, is released that causes the bloating. It may cause some delamination of layers. Other bad part of electrolyte decomposition is other byproducts of electrolyte breakdown coats the anode graphite and cathode LiFePO4 interface surfaces blocking paths for lithium-ion transfer increasing cell resistance.

It is usually not a safety issue unless pouches burst from over-pressure. The solvent in electrolyte that may leak out of a burst pouch is somewhat flammable, about the same as fuel oil or diesel. It has a high flash temperature for ignition (not very volatile)
 
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elvis_asaftei

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Please be aware, if your shipment did not have UN3841 label form the shipper on any part of the supply/delivery chain they will deny your claim. We found this out the hard way.

No Chinese sellers are in compliance of this so filing a claim is going to be a lost cause as as soon as the insurer finds out the shipment is for Lithium Batteries, they will ask to see the compliant labeling which is going to be absent and thus in violation of the shippers rules.

Yes the labeling automatically adds a hazmat charge to the overall cost of the shipment.
Interesting observation. I noticed the label is missing from this seller. Found it in other sellers box, so temperature is a big problem . How big and what was the temperature in metalic container ?
100C and electrolyte boiled ?
 

time2roll

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I would fit those cells in a compression and use them or at least test them. Keep moving forward.
Making a claim for refund is a separate issue.
 

Q-Dog

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Fresh off the hot truck in 90º+ heat my last batch of 200ah cells were a little bloated but they went down after they cooled inside the house. I slowly charged them up and with a full charge they were still smaller than when they were hot. I still have to build a shelf for them so they are not constrained in any way at the moment.
 

Alkaline

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I had similiar type of experience with PWOD
 

elvis_asaftei

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I had similiar type of experience with PWOD

when did you get the 310ah batteries from POWD ?
Do you have some pictures to see if the swollen amount is around 1cm as it is for me ?

Are there laws or regulations regarding swollen cells that should not be considered grade A ?
 

elvis_asaftei

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I did not get teh 310, but the 280 eve, clearly they were not new.
Look how PWOD cells look like and they say it is new grade A 310ah CATL cells .

I pushed the cells to each other but they are swollen.
Can’t even add the bus bars !

51A1C583-3FEE-434A-BF59-9EAA9267702D.jpeg

038C8972-E315-449B-8D59-7F813DF40414.jpeg
 

Alkaline

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when did you get the 310ah batteries from POWD ?
Do you have some pictures to see if the swollen amount is around 1cm as it is for me ?

Are there laws or regulations regarding swollen cells that should not be considered grade A ?
No laws in China my dude... its a roll of the dice.
 

Bud Martin

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Look how PWOD cells look like and they say it is new grade A 310ah CATL cells .

I pushed the cells to each other but they are swollen.
Can’t even add the bus bars !

View attachment 55904
So what does PWOD have to say about your issue? I am 100% they will not take any responsibility at all.
Did you buy using credit card, and you contact credit card company about this issue with the purchase?
 

Alkaline

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I did not even bother testing I filed a dispute and the seller had me ship them to some warehouse in california. they were all over the place puffy.

yes credit card charge back, alibaba just ignored and made up stories asking for some bs video and then said the proof is not suffcient.

Mastercard on the other said F that and issued a refund then they told me where to send the batteries back. Luckily it was only 4 cells and not a big pile.
 

Bud Martin

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That is still lots of weight for shipping back, it must have cost you quite a bit out off your pocket.
 

elvis_asaftei

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So what does PWOD have to say about your issue? I am 100% they will not take any responsibility at all.
Did you buy using credit card, and you contact credit card company about this issue with the purchase?

they are very uncooperative

8292FF47-FEF8-44B3-AE84-B32B5AF4334D.png
 

elvis_asaftei

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I did not even bother testing I filed a dispute and the seller had me ship them to some warehouse in california. they were all over the place puffy.

yes credit card charge back, alibaba just ignored and made up stories asking for some bs video and then said the proof is not suffcient.

Mastercard on the other said F that and issued a refund then they told me where to send the batteries back. Luckily it was only 4 cells and not a big pile.
I have 144 batteries received all bulged so not even bus bars fit . How can I reverse payment if it was 105 days ago ?!
 
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