I found a Ground Neutral Bond in my locked house electrical meter... What should I do?

[rloveless]

So I recently found that I have multiple ground neutral bonds or connections in my house. I'm trying to clean up the extra connections so I only have one connection.

So far i've found that a electric cloths dryer plug was wired with a GN bond.. Fixed that. Also a feeder to a sub panel had it's strain relief connection too tight and pierced the Neutral insulation connecting it to my electrical box. Fixed that. See Pic.
.

Both my main panel and my sub-panel don't have a bonding screw or a GN bond(at least non make on purpose).

I have also noticed that I have a GN bond in my locked meter box on the side of my house. This seems odd. Is this common practice? Should use the Meter box GN bond as the single house GN Bond? Should I make an additional GN bond at my main service entrance? I'm not sure how to handle this.

Here's a private Youtube video showing my meter box issue:

Thanks for any advise or thoughts.

 

[timselectric]

That's normal.
Prior to the first means of disconnect, the neutral and ground are common.
After the first means of disconnect, they are kept separate.
The feeder from the utility company to the meter, won't include a ground conductor.
Also, metal conduit is an acceptable EGC, when installed correctly. And yours appears to be.

 

[timselectric]

The only thing that I see is that they ignored the outside breaker as the first means of disconnect. And done the bonding at the inside panel.
Since it's existing, and will function OK as is, I wouldn't change anything. Unless you rebuild the service at some point.

 

[rloveless]

And done the bonding at the inside panel.

They actually don't have a GN bond or bonding screw in any of the panels in my house. Do you think I should add a GN bond at the first means of disconnect on the outside of my house? ... then I'll have 2 GN bonds on my house. One in the meter box and one in the disconnect box next to my meter. I think that would be fine?

 

[kscessnadriver]

The only thing that I see is that they ignored the outside breaker as the first means of disconnect. And done the bonding at the inside panel.
Since it's existing, and will function OK as is, I wouldn't change anything. Unless you rebuild the service at some point.

Depends on how it was labeled. I believe if it's labeled as an emergency disconnect (and not a service disconnect), you don't bond the neutral and ground there.

 

[rloveless]

Also, metal conduit is an acceptable EGC, when installed correctly. And yours appears to be.

I climbed in the attic and took some pictures of the EMT. The 90 connections look a bit questionable to me. They just slide into place. No threads. One of the connections is only seated 1/4 in inside the other pipe. maybe there's a way to make those 90 connections more solid? As is my meter shows pretty good continuity though.


The other 90 connection:



This is where it come main feeder lines come into my main house electrical panel:

 

[rloveless]

Depends on how it was labeled. I believe if it's labeled as an emergency disconnect (and not a service disconnect), you don't bond the neutral and ground there.

It's not labeled... But yeah it's my main service disconnect. I think I can make the connection there and also in my meter and it won't cause any issues...

 

[timselectric]

They actually don't have a GN bond or bonding screw in any of the panels in my house. Do you think I should add a GN bond at the first means of disconnect on the outside of my house? ... then I'll have 2 GN bonds on my house. One in the meter box and one in the disconnect box next to my meter. I think that would be fine?

What's in the meter is not a N/G bond. It's a "bonded neutral".
I wouldn't expect you to see any bonding screw in that old of a panel. (Assuming it was installed at the same time as the outside)
But all of the neutrals and grounds should be on the same bar, and the bar will not be isolated from the box. All together, this is the N/G bond.

 

[timselectric]

Depends on how it was labeled. I believe if it's labeled as an emergency disconnect (and not a service disconnect), you don't bond the neutral and ground there.

Being that old, it's the main disconnect.
The inside panel, more than likely doesn't have a main breaker.

 

[timselectric]

I climbed in the attic and took some pictures of the EMT. The 90 connections look a bit questionable to me. They just slide into place. No threads. One of the connections is only seated 1/4 in inside the other pipe. maybe there's a way to make those 90 connections more solid? As is my meter shows pretty good continuity though.
View attachment 269008

The other 90 connection:
View attachment 269010


This is where it come main feeder lines come into my main house electrical panel:
View attachment 269012

That does look odd. But over the years, many "new" products have hit the market. And were short lived, and never seen again. I have seen a lot of odd products. I can only assume that it passed an inspection at the time.

 

[timselectric]

I'm also going to guess that the inside panel is more than ten feet from the point where the service enters the house. And this is why there's an exterior main disconnect.

 

[TM48]

So far i've found that a electric cloths dryer plug was wired with a GN bond.

Do you have a three wire or four wire pig tail?(cord) If three wire your cabinet is no longer grounded. If four wire you're good.

 

[rloveless]

Do you have a three wire or four wire pig tail?(cord) If three wire your cabinet is no longer grounded. If four wire you're good.

It's 4 wires.... They had the G and N attached to the same ground screw on the dryer.

 

[rloveless]

What's in the meter is not a N/G bond. It's a "bonded neutral".
I wouldn't expect you to see any bonding screw in that old of a panel. (Assuming it was installed at the same time as the outside)
But all of the neutrals and grounds should be on the same bar, and the bar will not be isolated from the box. All together, this is the N/G bond.

The inside panel(inside my garage) is actually only 3 years old. a square D panel. The old panel was inside my house and I had an electrician move the panel to the other side of the wall which put the new panel in my garage.

This is where the old panel was(only facing inside the house). The Electrician added this junction box to move all the wire to the new panel. No G/N bond in either box shown here. The aluminum EGC only connects to the frame of this box.


Here's my new panel(No G/N bond):


I added the main disconnect to this panel so I could add a generator interlock kit.

I plan on adding the G/N bond at the main service disconnect box next to my meter... Even though I have a "bonded neutral" to the frame of my meter box. I'll also make sure those EMT fitting connect well. Please let me know if you have any concerns with this.

Thanks for your help!

 

[rloveless]

I'm also going to guess that the inside panel is more than ten feet from the point where the service enters the house. And this is why there's an exterior main disconnect.

yup. more that 10 feet

 

[timselectric]

I'll also make sure those EMT fitting connect well.

This is very important, as your entire grounding system will be relying on it.

 

[DPC]

I climbed in the attic and took some pictures of the EMT. The 90 connections look a bit questionable to me. They just slide into place. No threads. One of the connections is only seated 1/4 in inside the other pipe. maybe there's a way to make those 90 connections more solid? As is my meter shows pretty good continuity though.
View attachment 269008

The other 90 connection:
View attachment 269010


This is where it come main feeder lines come into my main house electrical panel:
View attachment 269012

Those look more like poles for a tent or gazebo repurposed as emt

 

[Q-Dog]

Those look more like poles for a tent or gazebo repurposed as emt

I was thinking it looked like automotive exhaust pipe.

 

[timselectric]

Those look more like poles for a tent or gazebo repurposed as emt

To me, it looks like rigid, slipped inside an EMT 90°.
You can see what looks like threads on the first picture.
Not sure what the brown stuff is.

 

[timselectric]

I was thinking it looked like automotive exhaust pipe.

That's a good possibility.

 

[rloveless]

Not sure what the brown stuff is.

I think it's rust. Oh the female ends there's a slit in the pipe allowing it to open a bit... Very odd.

 

[timselectric]

I think it's rust. Oh the female ends there's a slit in the pipe allowing it to open a bit... Very odd.

Definitely odd. Hopefully the connection is good enough for grounding.

 

[Gadwall*Drake]

To me, it looks like rigid, slipped inside an EMT 90°.
You can see what looks like threads on the first picture.
Not sure what the brown stuff is.

Looks like that to me, too. Odd, if it is because fittings to connect the two obviously exist.

 

[DPC]

What ever it is
It’s wrong
Need a solid connect there for bonding purposes

 

[rloveless]

Running a ground wire was actually pretty easy... I did that today. So now I don't need to worry about those odd fittings.