Idaho rules

[timselectric]

Grid tie here in Spain, as far as I can tell is very straightforward & off grid is completely unregulated, unlike putting some 19 inch rims on your car which is a ball ache

Grid-tied is too regulated. I want no part of big brothers games.

 

[rhino]

Huh?

This https://www.currentconnected.com/product/eg4-chargeverter-v2-48v-100a-battery-charger/

 

[slayer666]

Well, I can't find that there is a fine or jail time or anything for not permitting. Looks to me like if you don't get your permits and all of that and they do somehow find out, they just at that point, want you to get the shit together. Fill out their application and get permits and whatever.

A hybrid or grid-tied system requires permission and approval from the power company, and the local AHJ.
Off grid systems only require approval from the local AHJ.
Portable systems are not regulated by the AHJ. Other than the connection to the house (if there is one).

What if I'm using an off grid inverter but, I use the grid for nothing more than AC input for that inverter?

 

[timselectric]

Well, I can't find that there is a fine or jail time or anything for not permitting. Looks to me like if you don't get your permits and all of that and they do somehow find out, they just at that point, want you to get the shit together. Fill out their application and get permits and whatever.

Enforcement escalates in stages. With the final stage being condemning the property and seizure.

What if I'm using an off grid inverter but, I use the grid for nothing more than AC input for that inverter?

Off grid systems only require approval from the local AHJ.

 

[Osmethne]

Well, I can't find that there is a fine or jail time or anything for not permitting. Looks to me like if you don't get your permits and all of that and they do somehow find out, they just at that point, want you to get the shit together. Fill out their application and get permits and whatever.

What if I'm using an off grid inverter but, I use the grid for nothing more than AC input for that inverter?

As long as it's not backfeeding it shouldn't be a problem.

The worst thing I've seen a power company do is threaten to disconnect them from their grid. I guess if you installed it in a way that it was a safety hazard and if someone got hurt from it then that could be a jail situation.

But I would not know about such things because I am an upstanding member of society. Those aren't solar panels on my roof, they're sculptures that vaguely resemble panels. Those aren't batteries in my utility room, they're the house's self destruct mechanism.

 

[caesarv]

I tried to get a permit from my city but they were impossible to deal with and kept changing their minds. They required a fire rating for my ground mount system which makes no sense...it is just aluminum, concrete, and panels. I argued and they finally agreed that it was not necessary. So I submitted the paperwork...only to have it rejected for lack of a fire rating. I finally gave up and just installed it anyway. The inspector that came out for a mini-split installation that I simultaneously did, said that the office people that do permits don't know what they are doing.
FYI, I am using an 18Kpv and it is set to never feed back power.

 

[slayer666]

As long as it's not backfeeding it shouldn't be a problem.

The worst thing I've seen a power company do is threaten to disconnect them from their grid. I guess if you installed it in a way that it was a safety hazard and if someone got hurt from it then that could be a jail situation.

But I would not know about such things because I am an upstanding member of society. Those aren't solar panels on my roof, they're sculptures that vaguely resemble panels. Those aren't batteries in my utility room, they're the house's self destruct mechanism.

 

[Kornbread]

Well, I can't find that there is a fine or jail time or anything for not permitting. Looks to me like if you don't get your permits and all of that and they do somehow find out, they just at that point, want you to get the shit together. Fill out their application and get permits and whatever.

What if I'm using an off grid inverter but, I use the grid for nothing more than AC input for that inverter?

By definition, off grid inverters are not to be connected to grid that's why I mentioned pulling a Tim might be the ticket. A battery charger has no means of pushing power to the grid, therefore, they should not be regulated.

The ahj is another story ...

 

[Daveyclimber]

Man, I love not needing permits in my county. Don't have the grid available anyway.

 

[timselectric]

Man, I love not needing permits in my county. Don't have the grid available anyway.

Definitely cuts out headache, time, and extra fees.

 

[OffGridInTheCity]

I use UL listed ATSs to keep my off-grid power separate from the grid. These are mechanically linked relays (UL listed) so that (properly wired of course) it's physically impossible as apposed to depending on a software algorithm and/or limiter probe monitoring that can malfunction without knowing to energize the grid fully or partially.

When my ATSs have failed, and 3 of 6 have failed over 7 years, they fail by 'mechanically sticking in position' (won't switch the relays) rather than any kind of accidental both relays closed / grid back-feed. They use simple mechanics to ensure only 1 relay (grid or off-grid) is closed at a time.

This let's me use grid-assist automatically but yet have confidence that I won't back-feed the grid or risk danger to anyone outside the home circuits.

 

[jorby]

I have to wonder how much property taxes would go down after they take away the grid connection, phone line, and wired internet, in the quest to get someone to comply with the "safety" rules. They do increase taxes on property with those "improvements" where I live.

 

[Solar Guppy]

I have to wonder how much property taxes would go down after they take away the grid connection, phone line, and wired internet, in the quest to get someone to comply with the "safety" rules. They do increase taxes on property with those "improvements" where I live.

That's not what they take, its the occupancy permit that gets pulled for code violations and without it the home can't be lived in.

 

[jorby]

That's not what they take, its the occupancy permit that gets pulled for code violations and without it the home can't be lived in.

That is why I have been hoping for the discovery of another, more diy friendly, planet to move to.

 

[slayer666]

That is why I have been hoping for the discovery of another, more diy friendly, planet to move to.

Try Planet Libertarian. I've lived on it for about 15 years and it's working great for me!

 

[slayer666]

Planet Federalist and planet Constitutional Conservative are pretty good, too. That makes three planets you can check out!

 

[GotSun?]

There's horror stories of some governments using drones and satellite imagery to find solar panels and come harass property owners for having unapproved systems.

Can't speak to what's really true or not, but I could definitely see it happening.

It is true. They're using satellite imagery primarily to identify unsanctioned dwellings, but they might as well use it to spot solar panels too.

 

[OffGridInTheCity]

It is true. They're using satellite imagery primarily to identify unsanctioned dwellings, but they might as well use it to spot solar panels too.

Google maps is quite clear showing solar panels - here's a shot of my own south roof as an example. You can make them out clearly enough to count them! Absolutely no privacy in this day and age of satellites, maps, drones, and AI to process all the images to answer simple queries by the government such as "How many panels does tax lot xyz at address 123 have"? coupled with personal info data mining "How much can they pay?"

In my youth I didn't understand the phrase "Fight the Future" from the X-Files but I do now

 

[Chispas]

That's not what they take, its the occupancy permit that gets pulled for code violations and without it the home can't be lived in.

The more I learn about the rules and regs in the USA the more surprised I become. We have lived in our "toolshed" for decades, so far, so good. I think the difference is that rural Spain needs people. Here, it tends to be things that make money that they regulate, a hangover from the Fascist times.

 

[Dagoth Ur Does Solar]

Here, it tends to be things that make money that they regulate

Don't worry, virtually every regulation scheme in the US is designed to make money for someone. Pretty sure it's no different no matter where you go.

 

[Chispas]

Don't worry, virtually every regulation scheme in the US is designed to make money for someone. Pretty sure it's no different no matter where you go.

my point was that off grid is completely unregulated here & the idea that just having a panel array in your yard means property taxes go up is insane.Here, if you want to live in a house without plumbing, water or electricity its your life, no such thing as an occupancy permit needed.
But yeah, I agree, most regulation is about someone getting paid.

 

[Quattrohead]

That's not what they take, its the occupancy permit that gets pulled for code violations and without it the home can't be lived in.

I think they can only pull your occupancy permit for health violations, code violations incur fines and financial attachments to your home. If not paid, they can then sell your home to cover the fines and costs.

 

[Solar Guppy]

The OC can be revoked as it is issued based on compliance to building codes, Gemini pointed me to the text in law.

 

[wheelman55]

Seems like with all that crap to go through, a lot of people would just "do it anyway." I mean, if it's not exporting to the grid, how would they ever know?

The bigger deal is that your homeowners insurance company could decline coverage in the event of a fire.

 

[Quattrohead]

The bigger deal is that your homeowners insurance company could decline coverage in the event of a fire.

That is not a thing, they will nickel and dime you on the payout and then drop your ass but they will not deny coverage.