Is it possible to hire solar company to install solar panel only and I buy my own batteries and connect?

[eruisi]

I found many batteries available online that are much cheaper than from solar companies.
I am thinking to hire a licensed solar company to install solar panels with inverter for me then I buy my own batteries as backup system.
Is this allowed? Am I still qualified for 30% Federal credit? I am living in Bay Area in California using PG&E

 

[SomethingAppropriate]

I tried to get a solar company to put panels, that I had, on my roof.
They told me "no thanks" I talked to 5 different companies and NONE would do anything unless I bought panels from them.
I even tried sweetening the deal by saying sure, I'll buy panels from you for the roof, but you need to help me get the panels that I own onto a ground mount.

They said no thanks.

Simply put, they seem to be too busy to be bothered with not making all the money they can.

 

[eruisi]

Thanks for the quick help, but I am willing to buy panels from solar companies, but I want to buy my own batteries then connect to the inverter myself.

 

[Siamac]

They're not too busy. They just want very high profit margins.

But it's definitely possible. Just find one that's willing to do it for you.

 

[eruisi]

I am a little worrying about license/permit. I know PG&E has some restriction on solar system if you want to connect solar system to their grid.
and obviously I still want to get 30% Federal credit if I install solar this way

 

[Siamac]

Don't tell them about your plan. Just tell them that you want a particular inverter (one that you're comfortable connecting the batteries to it yourself). After they install it, it's yours to do whatever you want.

The only issue is that they will likely give you problems if there's a warranty claim

 

[Siamac]

Make sure you have all the details agreed on before signing the contract. It's very hard to change anything afterwards, but most of them really want the high margin profit from your business so they will be willing to work with you before signing

 

[eruisi]

Don't tell them about your plan. Just tell them that you want a particular inverter (one that you're comfortable connecting the batteries to it yourself). After they install it, it's yours to do whatever you want.

The only issue is that they will likely give you problems if there's a warranty claim

I would assume panels/inverter are still under regular warranty right? I cannot claim battery issues of course.

 

[Siamac]

Yes, they absolutely are. But let's say that the inverter goes out and the installer claims it's because of your batteries and refuse to change it for you

 

[fuzzmunky415]

You'll need a licensed installer (and of course a local inspector) to sign off on a compliant system to be eligible for the federal rebate.

 

[mciholas]

You'll need a licensed installer (and of course a local inspector) to sign off on a compliant system to be eligible for the federal rebate.

Not true.

You can DIY and claim it on your taxes. There is no requirement to have a license installer or an inspector's sign off. What you need is proof you bought qualifying solar equipment, and that's receipts, and only if you get audited.

Solar companies won't touch systems they don't make money on the equipment (and usually at big mark ups). They also won't install anything but their favorite stuff (which usually seems to be Enphase microinverters and Tesla Powerwalls).

Normal electricians won't touch solar usually. Roofers won't touch it either.

So people are often forced into DIY to get things done the way they want.

Your best bet is to act as your own contractor (most states allow this for your primary residence) and then you can hire a guy or two to help if you need it, but they don't need to be contractors per se. Finding that "right guy" can be hard, though.

Mike C.

 

[fuzzmunky415]

Not true.

You can DIY and claim it on your taxes. There is no requirement to have a license installer or an inspector's sign off. What you need is proof you bought qualifying solar equipment, and that's receipts, and only if you get audited.

Solar companies won't touch systems they don't make money on the equipment (and usually at big mark ups). They also won't install anything but their favorite stuff (which usually seems to be Enphase microinverters and Tesla Powerwalls).

Normal electricians won't touch solar usually. Roofers won't touch it either.

So people are often forced into DIY to get things done the way they want.

Your best bet is to act as your own contractor (most states allow this for your primary residence) and then you can hire a guy or two to help if you need it, but they don't need to be contractors per se. Finding that "right guy" can be hard, though.

Mike C.

California. Since the IRS form 5695 requires 'installation', and is considered a home improvement to receive said benefit, we agree you have two options: licensed contractor or owner-builder. Both options answer to the local planning/building department to be a compliant system. That is why I have been waiting for Eco-Worthy rack batteries to get UL listing, my planning department requires it. Ducks in a row before DIY saves both time and money, the object of the entire exercise. Lastly, money is indeed a reason OP will find it difficult to locate a freelancer versus solar-competent electrician, but less related to exorbitant profits over basic liability. Indeed in California the CSLB anguage appears to suggest solar companies will be frozen out of the ESS portion and given over to the electricians.

Guides and Publications - CSLB

cslb.ca.gov

https://cslb.ca.gov/Resources/BoardPackets/2022/June_7,_2022_CSLB_Staff_Draft_BESS_Regulatory_Language.pdf

Edit: 'Incidental' installation should mean a solar company can install batteries as PART OF its installation, not after the fact. After the fact, an electrician is required.

 

[eruisi]

Yes, they absolutely are. But let's say that the inverter goes out and the installer claims it's because of your batteries and refuse to change it for you

I can uninstall batteries before calling them. How would they know I uses the system with batteries? Would they have my data in cloud?
Frankly speaking I am OK to replace a compatible inverter myself, the only thing I am not comfortable to do is installing panels on roof & wire it into my braker panels (one is outside, secondary is in garage)

 

[eruisi]

California. Since the IRS form 5695 requires 'installation', and is considered a home improvement to receive said benefit, we agree you have two options: licensed contractor or owner-builder. Both options answer to the local planning/building department to be a compliant system. That is why I have been waiting for Eco-Worthy rack batteries to get UL listing, my planning department requires it. Ducks in a row before DIY saves both time and money, the object of the entire exercise. Lastly, money is indeed a reason OP will find it difficult to locate a freelancer versus solar-competent electrician, but less related to exorbitant profits over basic liability. Indeed in California the CSLB anguage appears to suggest solar companies will be frozen out of the ESS portion and given over to the electricians.

Guides and Publications - CSLB

cslb.ca.gov

https://cslb.ca.gov/Resources/BoardPackets/2022/June_7,_2022_CSLB_Staff_Draft_BESS_Regulatory_Language.pdf

Edit: 'Incidental' installation should mean a solar company can install batteries as PART OF its installation, not after the fact. After the fact, an electrician is required.

Is UL listing a requirement to get 30% Federal credit?

BTW: seems that it will be UL listed very soon:

Q5:What certifications does it have?​

A5:The UL1973 and UL9540A certifications are being processed, expected to be obtained in March-April 2025.

 

[SkyBlue]

I found many batteries available online that are much cheaper than from solar companies.
I am thinking to hire a licensed solar company to install solar panels with inverter for me then I buy my own batteries as backup system.
Is this allowed? Am I still qualified for 30% Federal credit? I am living in Bay Area in California using PG&E

This article says that solar contractors have to hold a C-10 electrical contractor license to install batteries with a PV system in California. Does anyone know if this rule applies to DIY installations as well?

A new front in California’s solar wars: Who’s allowed to install…

Climate groups are suing to block a state agency decision to limit battery installations to licensed electricians, saying it could harm contractors and…

www.canarymedia.com

 

[Cmy]

I tried the 'you install panels and I will do the rest' route and got lots of refusals. In their defense is blame for problems. Decided to replace a metal roof before panels and knew I didn't want to DIY that. Retired contractor/neighbor gave me the number for his metal roofing sub who had done panels at several neighbors. They mounted and connected panels, but the rest was up to me.

Worked well, paid $100/panel plus $800 for the tele-lift. Lift price seemed high but they had done well on the new roof. 34 Signature panels arrived Monday afternoon, mid December and the lift a few hours later. Panels went up Tuesday and were done mid afternoon with all trash picked up. Owner came by the next day to run PV wires off the roof as I set up the Growatt 11.4. County, not city, so only Utility approval and he showed up as we were finishing.

 

[fuzzmunky415]

This article says that solar contractors have to hold a C-10 electrical contractor license to install batteries with a PV system in California. Does anyone know if this rule applies to DIY installations as well?

A new front in California’s solar wars: Who’s allowed to install…

Climate groups are suing to block a state agency decision to limit battery installations to licensed electricians, saying it could harm contractors and…

www.canarymedia.com

You can DIY, with the assistance/approvals of your local permitting agency. Aka community development dept/planning dept/building and engineering or whatever name issues building permits.

 

[fuzzmunky415]

' defense is blame for problems.'

Liability. Contractors want to help, but not for excessive risk they cannot defend in a court. A good contractor follows the rules, even if the rules suck the biggie.

 

[fuzzmunky415]

Is UL listing a requirement to get 30% Federal credit?

BTW: seems that it will be UL listed very soon:

Q5:What certifications does it have?​

A5:The UL1973 and UL9540A certifications are being processed, expected to be obtained in March-April 2025.

Two separate things..5695 credit requires home improvement upgrade/installation, installation requires permits, permits require code requirements, and in this case batteries MAY (do, in my city based on NEC version they follow) require UL listed compliant components. It costs $$$ to live where you do...it may be cheaper to take the PG&E hit and conserve even more than you do.

 

[Siamac]

I tried the 'you install panels and I will do the rest' route and got lots of refusals. In their defense is blame for problems. Decided to replace a metal roof before panels and knew I didn't want to DIY that. Retired contractor/neighbor gave me the number for his metal roofing sub who had done panels at several neighbors. They mounted and connected panels, but the rest was up to me.

Worked well, paid $100/panel plus $800 for the tele-lift. Lift price seemed high but they had done well on the new roof. 34 Signature panels arrived Monday afternoon, mid December and the lift a few hours later. Panels went up Tuesday and were done mid afternoon with all trash picked up. Owner came by the next day to run PV wires off the roof as I set up the Growatt 11.4. County, not city, so only Utility approval and he showed up as we were finishing.

Thanks for sharing

So installation came out to over $4000.

 

[robbob2112]

this conversation has been rehashed many times - it always comes down to review the IRS booklet on .... once you have reviewed it and come to your own conclusions decide who you agree with.

Basically the IRS book requires the equipment to be installed. Is says _nothing_ about who installs it, permits, inspections, or anything else to do with the NEC.

There is just a one-line blank to list the cost for the equipment that was installed. If you DIY you can't claim your own labor...BUT, if you do DIY it and had to buy special tools that have no other purpose than the install they are part of the equipment... if you buy, install, sell the equipment/tools then you can only deduct the net that it cost you.

if you do it without permits or inspections or anything else it still counts... so long as it was installed. There is no place in the form to list the installed, AHJ, inspections, permits, completiongs or any other part of it... just cost.

 

[fuzzmunky415]

I needed a permit to install my ceiling fan...so...

 

[robbob2112]

I needed a permit to install my ceiling fan...so...

WOW, that is stupid insane - I can see it in California I suppose --- and I would have ignored it...

You need permits to keep from getting in trouble from your AHJ --- but the IRS doens't care in the slightest.

 

[mciholas]

I needed a permit to install my ceiling fan...so...

You need a permit to install a ceiling fan *legally*, in some officious AHJs. This is often ignored, though.

You can still claim the tax credit for solar even for "illegal" installations. It just has to be "installed". A collection of receipts totaling your claimed amount and a photo of the system installed should be all the proof you need if you are audited.

Mike C.

 

[fuzzmunky415]

WOW, that is stupid insane - I can see it in California I suppose --- and I would have ignored it...

You need permits to keep from getting in trouble from your AHJ --- but the IRS doens't care in the slightest.

I did ignore it. Had to pay 2x permit fee when selling the house, and fan failed inspection since it sat about 2 inches too low. Yanked that effer out and put in a cheap light!