Lights in off-grid cabin during winter

[pnicknish2]

I am looking to install solar-powered lighting in an off-grid cabin in the mountains in New England. Right now, the cabin is a simple wooden structure (4 walls, a roof, and a floor) and is moderately insulated. It is mainly used in the winter, and it does have a propane heater for heating the cabin when people are staying there.

I have been doing research on how to install solar-powered lights in the cabin (so we don't have to resort to headlamps all the time) and am realizing that keeping the batteries warm will be an issue. With the propane heater, the cabin can get up to a comfortable 60F or so. However, the cabin is mainly used on weekends, and the temperature inside can easily drop below 32F when people are not there. I am worried that the battery won't be able to charge during the week when no one is around, and thus the lights won't turn on when people arrive in the evening.

Does anyone have any suggestions or tips? I read that burying the battery could be one way to go. Also, does anyone have any recommendations for good panel/battery combinations? If we can get 1-2 bulbs lit, that would be ideal, so we don't need anything super heavy duty power-wise.

Thank you!

 

[Crowz]

I use these for carport and some utility builds so this would work.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B09QJHN6NR/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&th=1

I use these indoors in closets and the stairwell to the 2nd floor of my house :

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B085PY9VYV/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

[Crowz]

I used the normal house wiring and overhead light fixtures by replacing the normal lightbulbs with 24v dc lightbulbs since that house has a 24v battery setup. I then moved the normal house wiring for the overhead lights to a dc cable I have run the house so the overhead lights look completely normal except they run off the dc battery bank now.

The reason I'm mention this is because this would allow you to just put in a normal overhead ac fixture and run wiring to it like you would with a regular house using a normal light switch except the wiring will go to your battery bank.

 

[Crowz]

On the battery side get batteries that have internal heating.

On the solar side use heating mats/pads that stick to things to heat the back side of the solar panels which will melt any snow on them and have enough panels to keep the batteries charged.

I'd use dc timers on the heating pads.

 

[45North]

For an unheated cabin in new england I'd use lead acid batteries rather than lithium. That way you can still charge them when they're below freezing point.
Edit: for the lights themselves if you want a familiar look you can get special 12v LED bulbs with a standard base for use in a normal lamp or ceiling fixtures. That's what I'd do.
Use a blue sea 12v automotive fuse block as a distribution centre.

 

[HarryN]

For an unheated cabin in new england I'd use lead acid batteries rather than lithium. That way you can still charge them when they're below freezing point.
Edit: for the lights themselves if you want a familiar look you can get special 12v LED bulbs with a standard base for use in a normal lamp or ceiling fixtures. That's what I'd do.
Use a blue sea 12v automotive fuse block as a distribution centre.

Exactly.

Here is a simple way to do it. Works with 12 or 24 volt.

Just wire it so the solar charge controller feeds the fuse block as @45North suggested.

There are LED lights and light strings available on line for 12, 24 and 48 volt.

Small test fixture

Sometimes it is easier to show people things in photos than to describe them. So I made a little test fixture from left over parts, nothing fancy. In this case, some people asked about methods of dealing with pre-charging the capacitors on the input stage of inverters, and I had suggested that...

diysolarforum.com

 

[Daddy Tanuki]

me three on the lead acid for this use. I would go so far as to say some AGM's even. if you use it daily then Lithium's are the way to go but if you use is sporadically and are worried about freezing then definitely Lead Acid just equalize whenever you can to keep the batteries healthy. Now if you want more then just a few lights and a point of use 300-600 watt inverter then I would go lithium and run a heating system.

 

[Crowz]

I just put heating pads on the bottom of my lithium batteries and put some of the heating pads on water lines too. My 12v system keeps all of the batteries for itself and the 48v stuff heated and the water pipes. I use a thermal controller to switch the pads on and off as needed.

Now that said the coldest it gets here is -2 degrees. If it got colder I'd add more batteries and a few more pads

 

[Madcodger]

For an unheated cabin in new england I'd use lead acid batteries rather than lithium. That way you can still charge them when they're below freezing point.

We live in Maine and are building a wood-fired sauna away from the house, barn, etc. The only need for electricity in it is lighting and recharging a bluetooth speaker now and then. Despite having a robust off grid system for the rest of the property (42KWH of LiFePO4 batteries in the barn), the sauna will utilize a simple 12V Walmart sealed lead acid marine (deep cycle) battery and a very small, simple inverter to power dimmable LED lights picked up at Home Depot.

If we go on vacation for a couple of weeks in winter I don't need to monitor it and worry about battery temps or battery heaters, and I can charge it with a couple of small panels on the roof that are easily cleared of snow. I could go with DC lighting and avoid the inverter as others suggest, but 120V LED lights are cheap and easy these days, and then if I need 120V for a short period of time (maybe a fan for a few minutes to dry something) I have the option. When we're not using the sauna a simple flick of the switch on the inverter removes it as a load. My two cents...

 

[KITROBASKIN]

I am looking to install solar-powered lighting in an off-grid cabin in the mountains in New England. Right now, the cabin is a simple wooden structure (4 walls, a roof, and a floor) and is moderately insulated. It is mainly used in the winter, and it does have a propane heater for heating the cabin when people are staying there.

I have been doing research on how to install solar-powered lights in the cabin (so we don't have to resort to headlamps all the time) and am realizing that keeping the batteries warm will be an issue. With the propane heater, the cabin can get up to a comfortable 60F or so. However, the cabin is mainly used on weekends, and the temperature inside can easily drop below 32F when people are not there. I am worried that the battery won't be able to charge during the week when no one is around, and thus the lights won't turn on when people arrive in the evening.

Does anyone have any suggestions or tips? I read that burying the battery could be one way to go. Also, does anyone have any recommendations for good panel/battery combinations? If we can get 1-2 bulbs lit, that would be ideal, so we don't need anything super heavy duty power-wise.

Thank you!

With such small loads, consider how much less you could spend keeping things at 12V DC with LED light strings (using a warm color temperature of maybe 4500K). A small LFP battery can be part of the luggage one brings to the cabin. Creating a pole mount to raise a panel(s) above the snow, and always left at a winter time angle, and attached to a simple charge controller inside would be a future option.

Or some kind of portable battery/inverter (LFP batteries) like EcoFlow? Some of us are concerned about theft at remote cabins.

 

[chrisski]

I shop for my LED Bulbs at superbrightleds.com. Huge selection and each bulb has a spec for lumens and watts, so you get what you need.

I read that burying the battery could be one way to go.

Is burying an option for you? I would imagine it would at least need to be below the frostline. Also would need to be accessible, yet waterproof. Being from New England, it would be difficult to meet all three of Buried below the frostline, accessible, and water proof.

 

[OzSolar]

Or some kind of portable battery/inverter (LFP batteries) like EcoFlow? Some of us are concerned about theft at remote cabins.

I like it! I had some off grid customers who finally just started packing everything home and leaving the cabin unlocked. They were sick of returning to doors kicked in.

Here's another idea:

USB String lights and several larger USB power banks. The smaller Jackery/EcoFlow type of portable all in one's have 300 WH or larger batteries

The below lights are 1W so if you ended up needing 3 strings of them (or similar) you could run the lights for ALL night for an entire week with a battery that be easily packed in from home. Bring 2 just in case.

https://www.amazon.com/Brightech-Ambience-Pro-Camping-Lights/dp/B07SW6Y6D3/ref=asc_df_B07SW6Y6D3/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=693769127243&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=9421282657048943796&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9023454&hvtargid=pla-817710007081&mcid=c4a371ca7f3534d09ca45125792b430b&gad_source=1&th=1

 

[Daddy Tanuki]

I shop for my LED Bulbs at superbrightleds.com. Huge selection and each bulb has a spec for lumens and watts, so you get what you need.

Is burying an option for you? I would imagine it would at least need to be below the frostline. Also would need to be accessible, yet waterproof. Being from New England, it would be difficult to meet all three of Buried below the frostline, accessible, and water proof.

I would think that even in new england and all of its fabled granite that a couple of lbs of C4 and some line charges could cut a channel below the frost line.... the local LEO's might have an issue if you do not have blasting permits, but thats just paperwork this is a tounge in cheek joke folks, do not take it seriously.

 

[Daddy Tanuki]

I like it! I had some off grid customers who finally just started packing everything home and leaving the cabin unlocked. They were sick of returning to doors kicked in.

Here's another idea:

USB String lights and several larger USB power banks. The smaller Jackery/EcoFlow type of portable all in one's have 300 WH or larger batteries

The below lights are 1W so if you ended up needing 3 strings of them (or similar) you could run the lights for ALL night for an entire week with a battery that be easily packed in from home. Bring 2 just in case.

https://www.amazon.com/Brightech-Ambience-Pro-Camping-Lights/dp/B07SW6Y6D3/ref=asc_df_B07SW6Y6D3/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=693769127243&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=9421282657048943796&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9023454&hvtargid=pla-817710007081&mcid=c4a371ca7f3534d09ca45125792b430b&gad_source=1&th=1

i leave my cabin unlocked, nothing but food inside it... My shop/wharehouse is locked tight with its own defensive measures.

 

[green mountain boys]

I would think that even in new england and all of its fabled granite that a couple of lbs of C4 and some line charges could cut a channel below the frost line.... the local LEO's might have an issue if you do not have blasting permits, but thats just paperwork this is a tounge in cheek joke folks, do not take it seriously.

The general store down the road from me used to sell dynamite. Ah, the good old days.

 

[Daddy Tanuki]

The general store down the road from me used to sell dynamite. Ah, the good old days.

you must live in an enlightened and intelligent location. They would never sell high explosives to anybody in rural Indiana where I am from... Too many issues would rapidly come together... a hodge podge mixture of hold ma beer to you are fornicating w/my little sister to who got voted in as mayor last week...

 

[Andrewr05]

Honestly for what you're describing I second the portable power station as well.

How do you get to and from the cabin?
Lugging a power station in and out may be your best bet.
But that relies on you being the only one that goes up there, you going up there every time somebody else does, or you letting others borrow your unit.

If you really only plan on wanting lights then you can easily get away with a pretty lightweight 500wH unit that would charge your phones a few times and run all the lighting you'd need for a whole weekend.

No need to run wires everywhere worry about junction boxes or fuse blocks or light fixtures or battery heaters or anything, just run some lights connected into the 12v cigarette lighter port or USB C.

And you could even still put a few small solar panels up there so that you can charge it up and keep it going longer.

 

[dopeassjackson]

Just buy a solar generator and bring it back and forth. They have got so much cheaper in the last 5yrs.

I have a offgrid cabin in central NY. When my FLA batteries die I'm going lithium or solar generator depending on price.

 

[HarryN]

Why not just have a 12 or 24 volt AGM setup there.

Wire in a small solar panel that is mounted to the wall vertically so the snow just falls off. ( 200 - 300 watts of panels )

Maybe there is a way to have a ledge or roof eave to keep snow from accumulating.

 

[efficientPV]

I leave for seven months in the winter and I have lights on my garage. I have a $3.50 ebay PWM charge controller connected to a 4W solar panel to detect when the sun goes down. Battery is lead from town recycling. It is connected to a 13.5V 1A 120V LED power supply which provides float. My main system is disconnected from the array, but 500W of panels provide 60V DC to power the 120V AC supply. I assume it works. It is working every time I get back.