Lithium Battery Pack EXPLOSION Caught on Camera!!

[A.Justice]

The addition of water is what most likely set off the grenading.

While the video says nothing about adding water, I have to agree with your conclusion. I've seen 18650s (most likely what that pack is made of) fail, and they normally just vent a large flame. If you add water to them during or shortly after the failure, they can literally go off like cartridges.

It would be pretty easy to believe that somebody in that decent sized group, without thinking much about it, dumped a bottle of water on it trying to be helpful

 

[Sojourner1]

They helped alright with a made for you tube video.

If only campers brought a shovel for digging with them. Maybe a temp hole and buried with dirt "if" they weren't exploding.

 

[MrNatural22]

Funny watching it launch flaming cells off into the forest!

What's so dam funny about a possible forest fire?

 

[GH learning solar]

I'd like to know why LiFePO4 is safer than Li-ion. Is the LiFePO4 chemistry more stable/less flammable? Does the LiFePO4 cells vent better depending on cell container? It is possible in this melt down fire video the Li-ion cells did not fail as it could have been a poor designed or defective BMS in the pack that over charged the cells causing this incident. And if that was the case would anyone know could an overcharging defective BMS attached to a LiFePO4 cause the cells to melt down like that or are they just a more stable lithium than that?

 

[curiouscarbon]

I'd like to know why LiFePO4 is safer than Li-ion. Is the LiFePO4 chemistry more stable/less flammable? Does the LiFePO4 cells vent better depending on cell container? It is possible in this melt down fire video the Li-ion cells did not fail as it could have been a poor designed or defective BMS in the pack that over charged the cells causing this incident. And if that was the case would anyone know could an overcharging defective BMS attached to a LiFePO4 cause the cells to melt down like that or are they just a more stable lithium than that?

hi!

for each battery chemistry, the cell will heat up depending on the charge or discharge current in amperes. but also, depending on the current temperature of the cell.

some chemistries do not heat up much when cell is at moderate room temperature, e.g. 25C. but at higher temperature, similar amperes current can create like >10x the heating effect, which seems to result in fire from too high temperature.

LiFePO4 chemistry, unlike "traditional LiPo" chemistry, does not have such a big bump in self heating effect with increased temperature.

like this:

the vertical axis is how much heat is generated in the cell for a given ampere current, and the horizontal axis is cell material temperature.

LiFePO4 has a bump around 250C but it is still drastically less than most other "LiPo" chemistries. the other chemistries just skyrocket in terms of self heating effect vs temperature. With LiFePO4, past 250C, the self heating effect apparently decreases.

this works out to fires maybe being started by high resistance connections as opposed to the cell itself bursting into flames.

i am still learning about the topic ?

 

[Zwy]

I'd like to know why LiFePO4 is safer than Li-ion. Is the LiFePO4 chemistry more stable/less flammable? Does the LiFePO4 cells vent better depending on cell container? It is possible in this melt down fire video the Li-ion cells did not fail as it could have been a poor designed or defective BMS in the pack that over charged the cells causing this incident. And if that was the case would anyone know could an overcharging defective BMS attached to a LiFePO4 cause the cells to melt down like that or are they just a more stable lithium than that?

Start here https://diysolarforum.com/threads/lifepo4-safety-for-beginners.989/

 

[wattmatters]

Fundamentally the chemistry of iron phosphate means the oxygen (which is what drives a combustion process) is not so easily released, in contrast to other L-ion chemistries which can more easily and rapidly release O2 from their bonds when heated sufficiently. IOW LiFePO4 batteries do not self supply oxygen at a rate to readily enable a thermal runaway to occur.

It is possible to create thermal runaway in a LiFePO4 cell but it requires some extreme overcharging at ridiculously high voltages. Such as demonstrated in this test where they applied up to 35 V to keep a 1C charge rate into an already fully charged cell. Cells reached temps of between ~300-500 °C.

Radware Bot Manager Captcha

 

[Substrate]

It is unclear to me just how the solar charging was actually implemented. Maybe I'm missing it..

Perhaps the "solar charging" was merely charging an auxiliary battery, and then using an MSW (mod sine wave) inverter instead of a psw type, and using inverted ac for the charge? If so, doing it with an msw - either 3rd party of provided with the vehicle, can be a problem.

MSW inverter and battery powered tool / fridge charger would be a big no-no. MSW and chargers are a problem, since those chargers that rely upon a clean AC for regulation / timing etc can be fooled into charging too long or not long enough with msw.

The other possibility is was the battery powered fridge left to sit discharged for an entire year in a hot garage, and then placed into service later? Was the device new or abused already?

Too many unknown variables to point to anything conclusive, so the video is more about drama than informative.

 

[Nickatnyt]

Just say no to Lithium Ion. Wanna see some real scary stuff? Watch vids of E-bike batteries catching fire while in an elevator with people in there too.

 

[BigGun]

One big problem is -- Cheap Chinese cells with minimal protection -- another thing is -- Heat and Cold charging / discharging -- But for these application Li-ion is not a good choice

 

[Surferdudemi]

Fundamentally the chemistry of iron phosphate means the oxygen (which is what drives a combustion process) is not so easily released, in contrast to other L-ion chemistries which can more easily and rapidly release O2 from their bonds when heated sufficiently. IOW LiFePO4 batteries do not self supply oxygen at a rate to readily enable a thermal runaway to occur.

It is possible to create thermal runaway in a LiFePO4 cell but it requires some extreme overcharging at ridiculously high voltages. Such as demonstrated in this test where they applied up to 35 V to keep a 1C charge rate into an already fully charged cell. Cells reached temps of between ~300-500 °C.

Radware Bot Manager Captcha

Isn't there also a difference in the electrolyte? The Li-ion electrolyte catches fire when exposed to air, right?

 

[Geokilroy]

Dumped water on a failed lithium battery. Doesn't surprise me.

The video clearly says they used the water bottle to knock the battery out of the truck. Did not say they dumped water on it. Also look at the bottle, it looks like it is still sealed. Not much water missing if any. Also later showed bottle with very small holes and almost no water missing.

I understand and appreciate the warning about the dangers of using water in this situation but don't accuse them of dumping water in this situation. Also, comments about them being unsafe during this incident are unnecessary. Everyone reacts to adversity differently. Some will freeze. Some will run away. Some will stay and try to minimize the collateral damage. I applaud them for their actions. I did not see any kids in the video. I heard a lady telling everyone to stay back. It's easy to be critical after the fact.