i moved to an area not coastal that has alot of wind. average 4-5 days of at least 10-15 mph winds sometimes more. i am considering getting a vawt small one at first and then maybe 1500V windmill. any sugestions? want to power simple chicken coop small and small 14' x 24' starter house . i live in central florida.
Looking for Wind Turbine Reccommendation
- Thread starter simmjz
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We had small wind gens on our forestry camps years ago. Frankly they were useless.
They were not VAWTs so I can't speak to them.
Our windvane ones didn't produce enough power to even top up batteries.
We converted them all to small solar and they just work for our application which is basically lights and power.
They were not VAWTs so I can't speak to them.
Our windvane ones didn't produce enough power to even top up batteries.
We converted them all to small solar and they just work for our application which is basically lights and power.
svetz
Works in theory! Practice? That's something else
Wind in Florida? Sure you're just not seeing gusts from seasonal storm activity?
Average for most parts is between 6 to 8 and that's just not enough to generate power.
On the other hand, if you do have a steady breeze between 8 and 12 year round can be pretty good.
Average for most parts is between 6 to 8 and that's just not enough to generate power.
On the other hand, if you do have a steady breeze between 8 and 12 year round can be pretty good.
Randal Barrett
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If you do get wind above 15mph a lot or you are looking for wind generation during storms, it can be done cheaply, But; there are specific problems with wind turbines that can destroy your batteries, burn up the turbine or both. Most wind turbines come with a cheap charger that will short out the wind turbine wiring to slow it down and stop charging of the batteries. I did figure out a simple solution to both. Preventing wind turbine burning up was pretty simple, get a controller that has dump load resistors and make sure it will dump variable, not on/off. This way, the controller will actually control Bulk and Float when you have lots of wind power. The cheap controllers will just dump power into your batteries overcharging them unless it hits the preset limit and shorts out the turbine. Most of the time, the turbine will overcharge and ruin your batteries. If you have unprotected Lithium batteries, the loss is extreme.
When you marry a Turbine with Solar, you have more problems. The proper controller with dump load resistors will control bulk and float, but, it will not coordinate with the solar chargers correctly and can even dump solar charge to the dump load resistors. This is where my simple fix comes in! Put relays on the solar inputs to the solar chargers and have them disconnect the solar inputs Whenever the dump load controller sends power to the dump load resistors! The dump load bulk controller voltage setting must be set just above the solar bulk controller voltage setting. This insures that when you have enough wind power and the batteries are exceeding the solar bulk setting, the solar is disconnected so you are only dumping turbine generated power.
There are other details and settings that must be considered, but it will protect your turbine, batteries and insure a smooth marriage of wind and solar.
Xantrex makes the controller. Wind turbine is connected directly to the batteries through rectifier normally. The controller only kicks in when voltage is above highest solar charger settings. It is basically a high voltage dump controller with dump resistors, but will do variable dump to hold the batteries at the bulk and then reduce to float as long as the turbine is producing enough power. When the turbine stops producing sufficient power, the dump load controller will stop sending to the dump load resistors and the relays will turn the solar inputs back on.
There are hybrid controllers that claim to do this, but are poorly documented and have many complaints. The expensive systems that dump turbine excess to dump load resistors variably are very expensive and still have issues.
The only problem with this simple fix is balancing your settings to the the batteries. Lead/Acid are the most difficult to get the settings correct. Lithium with a good BMS are easy since we can apply 14.6v constantly and not hurt them. Lead/Acid need to be brought down to float, leaving them up at 14.6v will eventually kill them.
This info is most applicable to windy areas, but even in my case where I am only concerned about stormy day production, I don't want the turbine to get damaged or over charge my batteries. In my case, with lithium batteries with a good BMS, I don't want the tubine to cause the batteries to shut off and then back on due to over voltage. This would be problematic. You have between 14.2v and 14.6v to balance the solar and turbine on BattleBorn Batteries. It can be done.
Understanding Turbine/Solar issues and finding simple solutions will be a big topic. At this time, you will see that most don't benefit from their turbine at all, while others have burned up turbines and batteries. As a result, most will recommend staying away from turbines and that is good advice if you don't do it right! If you are like me and want the turbine married safely with solar, it can be done.
Here is how a proper system with lithium batteries will work.
1. Solar keeps batteries charged/float.
2. Wind is sufficient to charge batteries above highest solar setting of 14.4v , solar charger stops charging and yet voltage keeps rising.
3. Dump Load Controller starts variable dumping at 14.6v and turns off solar inputs.
4. Wind continues to blow and Dump Load Controller keeps voltage at 14.6v which is fine for lithium.
5. Wind drops or load increases causing dump load controller to stop dumping, solar relays turn on and solar starts charging again.
6. Wind and Solar will both be charging unless voltage rises above solar limit again.
It will be trickier with lead/acid but can be done with proper float settings.
This free advice is to help others find simple solutions to marry solar and wind. A good hybrid controller should do exactly what has been described here. If you know of hybrids that work correctly, let me know. The benefit to the above solution is that it will work with any solar controllers and any size system. This is not true of hybrids.
Has anyone else done anything like this?
When you marry a Turbine with Solar, you have more problems. The proper controller with dump load resistors will control bulk and float, but, it will not coordinate with the solar chargers correctly and can even dump solar charge to the dump load resistors. This is where my simple fix comes in! Put relays on the solar inputs to the solar chargers and have them disconnect the solar inputs Whenever the dump load controller sends power to the dump load resistors! The dump load bulk controller voltage setting must be set just above the solar bulk controller voltage setting. This insures that when you have enough wind power and the batteries are exceeding the solar bulk setting, the solar is disconnected so you are only dumping turbine generated power.
There are other details and settings that must be considered, but it will protect your turbine, batteries and insure a smooth marriage of wind and solar.
Xantrex makes the controller. Wind turbine is connected directly to the batteries through rectifier normally. The controller only kicks in when voltage is above highest solar charger settings. It is basically a high voltage dump controller with dump resistors, but will do variable dump to hold the batteries at the bulk and then reduce to float as long as the turbine is producing enough power. When the turbine stops producing sufficient power, the dump load controller will stop sending to the dump load resistors and the relays will turn the solar inputs back on.
There are hybrid controllers that claim to do this, but are poorly documented and have many complaints. The expensive systems that dump turbine excess to dump load resistors variably are very expensive and still have issues.
The only problem with this simple fix is balancing your settings to the the batteries. Lead/Acid are the most difficult to get the settings correct. Lithium with a good BMS are easy since we can apply 14.6v constantly and not hurt them. Lead/Acid need to be brought down to float, leaving them up at 14.6v will eventually kill them.
This info is most applicable to windy areas, but even in my case where I am only concerned about stormy day production, I don't want the turbine to get damaged or over charge my batteries. In my case, with lithium batteries with a good BMS, I don't want the tubine to cause the batteries to shut off and then back on due to over voltage. This would be problematic. You have between 14.2v and 14.6v to balance the solar and turbine on BattleBorn Batteries. It can be done.
Understanding Turbine/Solar issues and finding simple solutions will be a big topic. At this time, you will see that most don't benefit from their turbine at all, while others have burned up turbines and batteries. As a result, most will recommend staying away from turbines and that is good advice if you don't do it right! If you are like me and want the turbine married safely with solar, it can be done.
Here is how a proper system with lithium batteries will work.
1. Solar keeps batteries charged/float.
2. Wind is sufficient to charge batteries above highest solar setting of 14.4v , solar charger stops charging and yet voltage keeps rising.
3. Dump Load Controller starts variable dumping at 14.6v and turns off solar inputs.
4. Wind continues to blow and Dump Load Controller keeps voltage at 14.6v which is fine for lithium.
5. Wind drops or load increases causing dump load controller to stop dumping, solar relays turn on and solar starts charging again.
6. Wind and Solar will both be charging unless voltage rises above solar limit again.
It will be trickier with lead/acid but can be done with proper float settings.
This free advice is to help others find simple solutions to marry solar and wind. A good hybrid controller should do exactly what has been described here. If you know of hybrids that work correctly, let me know. The benefit to the above solution is that it will work with any solar controllers and any size system. This is not true of hybrids.
Has anyone else done anything like this?
b.james
New Member
Randal , 14.6V for LFP is too high mate . You go there once on first charge to lay down a special protection layer called ? SEI layer ? then you stay under that thereafter. 3.5V per cell is as high as you want to go and I stay down at 3.4V . That's 14V for yours.
I'm interested in what you have to say about wind generation as I bought a cheap Chinese one , cost me $180 AUD ... $120 USD , just so I could learn and I bought one of those cheap 3 wire controllers that cross one or two wires to brake them and a red led comes on.
I have not been able to do anything useful with it yet. I put it on a 12V battery yesterday and then put a meter on it and it was sending a quarter amp into the battery . Hopeless at that.
So interested to see if your figures can be revised down a bit and still feed my 24 V LFP 200Ah battery. Also looking at the Xantrex can the "equalisation " be turned off? That will stuff your LFP quick smart . Keeps pulsing up 15V and switches the BMS off which switches the inverter off . And it keeps doing it every 10 seconds on my bloody useless controller.
The other question with the Xantrex , can the output be then run into something like a Victron solar charger as input . I wonder if anyone has tried it as "equalisation" can be turned off on a Victron.
I'm interested in what you have to say about wind generation as I bought a cheap Chinese one , cost me $180 AUD ... $120 USD , just so I could learn and I bought one of those cheap 3 wire controllers that cross one or two wires to brake them and a red led comes on.
I have not been able to do anything useful with it yet. I put it on a 12V battery yesterday and then put a meter on it and it was sending a quarter amp into the battery . Hopeless at that.
So interested to see if your figures can be revised down a bit and still feed my 24 V LFP 200Ah battery. Also looking at the Xantrex can the "equalisation " be turned off? That will stuff your LFP quick smart . Keeps pulsing up 15V and switches the BMS off which switches the inverter off . And it keeps doing it every 10 seconds on my bloody useless controller.
The other question with the Xantrex , can the output be then run into something like a Victron solar charger as input . I wonder if anyone has tried it as "equalisation" can be turned off on a Victron.
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Randal Barrett
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b.james, I cannot see anywhere I said 16.6v. BattleBorn should be brought up to 14.2 to 14.6 and cut off at 14.7, no damage. I have a 500w 24v turbine. We have a 24v system. We have not had enough wind to be useful yet. For us, is just for stormy windy days. If you do get a lot of wind and the batteries hit the cheap controller setting, it will short out the turbine and make the windings get hot, eventually fails.
If you have prismatic cells and a BMS, you must adjust parameters accordingly.
b.james
New Member
Sorry fixed that typo. video url up below . SEI layer is explained towards the end . Don't get caught by the manufacturers as some just don't know or don't say ! Pro Power sealed LFP 12V battery makers set their BMS at 3.85V and are still doing it. SEI layer Video
LFP group but you have to join first.
LFP group but you have to join first.
Randal Barrett
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This is a good one:
Each manufacturer specs out the correct voltages for that lithium battery.
Randal Barrett
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This is a good one:
b.james
New Member
Thanks,yeh used to subscribe but he got a bit commercial for me . Try not to get your battery anywhere near those temps. Trouble with all those in a sealed cases , you just don't know whats in there.
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Samueru
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If it is going to be a VAWT, it has a to be a Darrieus type, most VAWT on the market are Savonius design and are very inefficient, and in fact some in the market don't produce any power at all.
Check your surroundings, I can't trust my weather report for wind speed, sometimes it says that the wind is over 24 kmh and blades of the turbine are not moving, and sometimes it says that the wind speed is 8 Kmh and the blades are going at full speed. check the Beaufort and see if you have winds over category 3.
Better get an horizontal axis wind turbine. I have a small 95$ 3 blade ebay horizontal axis turbine and I'm surprised by its performance. However it says that it produces 400W at 800 rpm and that's not true, it produces 100W instead. (Still better than a solar panel if you get enough wind).
Check the Hyacinth P300, that one is a real 300W wind turbine, and it has a passive overspeed protection, comes with 6 blades. I would set it up with just 3 blades and save the other 3 as replacement. It goes for 100$ on ebay.
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b.james
New Member
Samueru
Wish I had run into you first.
I bought a 12/24V 5 blade like so
see here
It works OK but I'm worried about the overspeed control through one of the windings . Does it always use the same winding? Can I get any other options to stop overspeed?
Can't seem to get anything to speak of on 24V but seems to put out a charge on 12V lead batteries
Wish I had run into you first.
I bought a 12/24V 5 blade like so
see here
It works OK but I'm worried about the overspeed control through one of the windings . Does it always use the same winding? Can I get any other options to stop overspeed?
Can't seem to get anything to speak of on 24V but seems to put out a charge on 12V lead batteries
Samueru
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Get a DC Clamp meter and see how much current it generates. The overspeed protection shorts all 3 phases (if it shorted one phase the turbine would wobble as it would throw it out of balance).
I have the same one as yours, just with 3 blades and 12V version, the thing needs to speed up to start charging 12V battery, the windings don´t put enough voltage at low speed as it is designed to give all its power at max speed, using the 24V model on a 12V battery fixes that issue, however it also cuts the max power output by half. The ideal solution is an MPPT controller that boosts or bucks the voltage to give the maximun power possible. Also if it uses the same PMG as the 3 blade version, it will actually produce less power (more blades reduces the tip speed ratio of the turbine).
I´ve seem it spiked to 10A a few days ago (about 130W, which means the gust was faster than 13 ms).
And of course the location is very important, in my case I should be putting it 10m above the roof, I only have it 2.6m, that noise the turbine makes is actually the cross wind turbulence hitting the blades.
b.james
New Member
One or two amps at 12V are pretty useless to me . I have about 20 solar panels just sitting here that I have not done anything with yet. Each pane is capable of producing 8 amps @30 odd volts. I put MPPT on two panels in series and get 16Amps out into a 24V battery.
Going to 48V now so I reckon I'll just dump the windy.
Going to 48V now so I reckon I'll just dump the windy.
Samueru
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Notice, a 100W solar panel produces about 500 Wh in a day, those run for 80$.
The turbine would only need to produce an average of 20W all day for it to produce those 500 Wh.
b.james
New Member
Always depends on where you are and what you have paid for your equipment. My 265 watt panels cost me about $10 AUD each brand new because I bought a full system that was discarded for another. I'm just above the tropic of capricorn so one panel produces about 9 amps at 27V or 243 watts for probably 6 hours a day in the sun. That's probably 1500 watts a day. Thats each panel and I have 20 of them sitting unused because I already had panels up.
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