Luyuan battery case
- Thread starter dddem
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Brucey
Velcro Man
I haven't been paying attention but these will be deep enough to fit the 16 cell 48V (deeper) cases?
S Davis
Solar Addict
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Yes, I am using them for the 24v cases but having them made with the extra depth for the 48v cases. And the heating, air conditioning and fans are all 48volt.
I was planning to DIY a box for 8s2p, but I'm poking around on Amy's Alibaba site to see what's available.
S Davis
Solar Addict
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Yep, I was planning on putting 92kwh in my detached garage but figured it would be better to isolate so they can just sit there and melt down without taking out my garage or anything else.
Little higher than cabinet height then, but still not crazy high.
I guess what would be the reasoning for going with only 3 vs 4?
Less weight?
S Davis
Solar Addict
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I guess and keeping it smaller, two three stack cabinets with a inverter cabinet in the middle.
Steve_S
Emperor Of Solar
Any of the 48V/16S cases will do for 8S2P should work the treat. Notice she has 2 case styles shown at the moment.
direct from Shenzhen Luyuan Technology Co., Ltd. in CN
Automotive from Shenzhen Luyuan Technology Co., Ltd.. Search High Quality Automotive Manufacturing and Exporting supplier on Alibaba.com.
szluyuan.en.alibaba.com
I hear that, I've got 43kWh in my powerhouse. TBH I'm not worried about the battery packs, especially now in these steel cases. Not that I was worried in anyway about my wood & polycarb boxes I made but this is better in more ways. LFP is not NMC - it is what it is. For them to reach a point of fire due to a fault or something is quite rare when properly assembled using good practices down to the little details.
The greater risk is the actual Equipment simply because there is so much more involved and far more points of failure. Form electronics to connections and everything in between from the Solar Panels to the battery packs themselves. Most solar system fires actually occur as a result of the gear and "NOT" the battery systems (FLA Included with proper installation & management).
Here on the forum we have seen a hell of a lot over the years, as well as on other forums & Youtube of course. We have seen really "professionally done" commercial installations both residential & larger but in contrast also some slap dashed tossed together crap that somehow works & didn't go poof instantly, (for a while anyways). Sure BOTH can have battery issues, of course, they are batteries & with stored energy that can do bad things, FLA has Sulphuric Acid but does the world scream about that ? When a Solar System catches fire somewhere it "may" make news BUT if it has any form of "Lithium" battery (will apply to Li-Sodium & Li-Sulfur as well) it becomes headline news even when it was NOT the batteries that caused it. Guess what - the worst part, is some "commercial" battery companies screw up by doing terribly silly things - example - stacking "prismatic" cells on their side. They may or may not leak (corrosive electrolyte) they could pop valves or they may be OK but any chance that something is more likely to go wrong (short or longterm) must be avoided and they don't! A Gamble ! TSK TSK TSK.
Bottom Line: (in general for one & all)
- NEVER EVER RUSH !!! That is your greatest enemy ! Take your time.
- Measure "everything" 3 or more times. From lengths to voltages/resistance etc NEVER ASSUME ANYTHING !
- Build your packs well, do proper crimps on everything, use good heatshrink etc etc...
- Do things 1 step at a time and not 3 things at once (begging for mistakes)
- Do your electrical system to the best of your ability, both the DC & AC sides, avoid shortcuts and cheaping out on critical things like breakers/fuses and such. Proper routing, clean & tidy adhering to codes & requirements for your region.
- Absolute DO provide good clearances to all devices, wiring etc... easier to access & do maintenance as well as safety reasons.
- Safety wise, always have this equipment in an appropriately clean & tidy area with easy access.
Battery Bank (2 or more packs) considerations are always a part of the equation that we all face.
- Whatever layout you decide upon consider "access" to individual packs should any need arise. Do not over complicate.
- Consider wire lengths & differentials affecting battery packs, in addition to cable/wire routing. Equal length wires can easily become jungles if not considered and quite a mess.
- Never forget proper Fuses/Breakers as applicable
-- BUSBAR implementation & switching is quite varied and flexible so that a myriad of combinations are possible but one critical point, is these are essential components and should always be Good Quality components and not bargain basement discount stuff !
- ENSURE that the battery packs can be Temperature Managed in the sense that temps are consistent for all packs and within operating specs IE not charging below 0C/32F and not exceeding 55C/131F. *(real world lessons learned)
* It is BEST to not have more than 2C temp variation on packs below 17C as the voltages will begin to deviate and hamper performance increasingly. Additionally, be aware that the lower to "ground surface" the cooler it will be, as you stack packs on on shelves, each shelf up will be just a degree or two warmer. During charge & heavier discharge the batteries will warm and that heat will rise as expected but warms the pack above. This may not seem significant but when closely observed over time you will see pack performance affected through that "stacked back". It is most prudent to allow airflow in & around the packs so that a relative constant temp will be maintained. Temperatures DO affect cell deviation & balance as it affects the resistance.
Sorry for the Long Post - read, Hope it Helps, Good Luck.
Thanks for the link Steve! Those cases are snazzy!
The video was very helpful and it answered some of my questions. When you say two case styles, you mean one is narrow and deep, while the other is wide and not so deep, right?
Do you think the 16s has room for more than one BMS?
How much compression is applied to the cells? Mine will be in an RV, so compression is important to keep the terminals from being stressed.
S Davis
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I had Amy make a custom box with two BMS, two screens, on/off, rs485, I am doing two 4s in a 8s box. The same fronts and BMS mounting plate should work for you. They are for the Non inverter jk BMS.
Steve_S
Emperor Of Solar
VS
Which is similar to the ones I & Others are using.
There are different terminals available Single/Double
and as S_Davies showed this casing can be had with 2 JK Screens BUT I think those were for normal JK's and not the Inverter model which is a heck of a lot bigger.
Compression: Well I use Flexible Laminated Copper bars for the dual-hole cells & Copper Mesh bars for single screw/stud cells. My cells are only compressed moderately "hand tight" - taking into account that I only used Poly Foam mesh on the front between the plate-bms mount & fr4 sheet & cell. There is 9 long screws 3 each side & centre, so you can get nice even pressure.
S Davis
Solar Addict
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The new jk inverter BMS is too big to fit two in one case. But it looks like this other case might be made to work it has more acreage in the BMS area.
What's the deal with the monster BMS I'm seeing? My Overkill Solar 4s BMS is dinky compared to those.
Needed for talking to an inverter/charger and also with other batteries. I don’t understand the need for it either, but I don’t have that big of a system or high of any loads.
chrisski
Solar Boondocker
If you contact Amy, she can get you battery boxes that are not listed on the site. That's how I got my case for my 50 ah Cells for a 24 volt build I ordered from her.
I will say that there was a lot of other work that went into assembling that battery and getting the battery case did not save me as much time as I'd hoped.
The plastic case is definitely better than a plywood case. I also need to come up with a way to keep the cells from sliding around in the case.
I'm going to remeasure 2 batteries I have that are 25 ah each and bundle these into 25 AH cells two parelled into a single battery 2P8S
Steve_S
Emperor Of Solar
I Asked AMY to crunch up some Numbers with "general Shipping" to MID-USA to show what REAL costs are that are not fluffed up for profit.
This was crunched up 20 Minutes ago so current "as of today".
This is for CASE KITS but not including BMS etc... Just the Case, seperators busbars, breaker etc.
***Case kit price(BMS and screen not included):
For 24V/8S—original price $168
For 48V/16S—original price $235
***Freight to middle USA:
For 24V case kit—$76
For 48V case kit—$116
By sea,DDP
szluyuan.en.alibaba.com
This was crunched up 20 Minutes ago so current "as of today".
This is for CASE KITS but not including BMS etc... Just the Case, seperators busbars, breaker etc.
***Case kit price(BMS and screen not included):
For 24V/8S—original price $168
For 48V/16S—original price $235
***Freight to middle USA:
For 24V case kit—$76
For 48V case kit—$116
By sea,DDP
Products list direct from CN
Main products Lifepo4 battery, LTO battery and 142 more Products from Shenzhen Luyuan Technology Co., Ltd. on Alibaba.com
szluyuan.en.alibaba.com
Zwy
Emperor Of Solar
I own 2 of the cases and purchased without BMS/screen because I already had those. The pair came with the cells I ordered.I Asked AMY to crunch up some Numbers with "general Shipping" to MID-USA to show what REAL costs are that are not fluffed up for profit.
This was crunched up 20 Minutes ago so current "as of today".
This is for CASE KITS but not including BMS etc... Just the Case, seperators busbars, breaker etc.
***Case kit price(BMS and screen not included):
For 24V/8S—original price $168
For 48V/16S—original price $235
***Freight to middle USA:
For 24V case kit—$76
For 48V case kit—$116
By sea,DDP
Products list direct from CN
Main products Lifepo4 battery, LTO battery and 142 more Products from Shenzhen Luyuan Technology Co., Ltd. on Alibaba.com
It does require some work to get the BMS mounted in my experience. Some use a plastic tie but I have an application where it needs to be securely fastened on one box. It also had the breaker hole too small, Amy claimed it should not fit thru the hole but then the breaker bracket wasn't long enough. I had to enlarge the opening to make it work, showed her the photos and she then ignored the problem.
I'm changing a few things, one is making a plate to mount the BMS, a Class T fuse and holder. There isn't any compression with the plate using the separators, the cells fit loose inside. If there was compression, the plate is not fastened at the bottom. I'll end up adding poron on the ends. I'll have to drill holes in the bottom of the case to install screws to hold the bottom of the compression plate.
These are not "perfect" for someone who can not fabricate or be able to modify it. These are "OK" but not perfected. I'll end up making my own battery cables to accommodate the Class T and I have to install a post for the negative terminals and fabricate a cable for the negative too.
If I was to order again, I'd order the box with the BMS. But then adding a Class T might require modification anyway.
Amy is open to suggestions, I informed her I was adding a Class T and she requested photos when I'm finished. I've been slowly picking away at the pair of boxes in the evening.
Steve_S
Emperor Of Solar
Th 24V case like the 48V has 9 screws for the BMS-Pressure plate. It is pretty even pressure when done right. no need for more screws or attachment points. When you have all 9 screws installed that plate won't go anywhere. The Mounting Points are as generic as can be. Mine were fine for use with the JK INverter edition and those same points apply to Pace/Seplos & TDT BMS' of the same class. If using a different BMS then that has t be sorted. I can''t imagine you finding a casing that will accept "all formats" of BMS.
The cases are designed to take a variety of cells (see sizes) so compensating for the space difference is up to use... I used urethane foam mesh on the side & at the front to compensate without issues.
BTW: They are working on getting a few other Case Models/Types up for sale soon. They are looking at different formats and how they are setup / assembled (cell orientations & other issues). EVEN GSL has started abandoning packs with cells on their sides after all the problems & issues.
Anyways, I provided more info to help folks make their choices. The rest is up to whoever to make their choices.
The cases are designed to take a variety of cells (see sizes) so compensating for the space difference is up to use... I used urethane foam mesh on the side & at the front to compensate without issues.
BTW: They are working on getting a few other Case Models/Types up for sale soon. They are looking at different formats and how they are setup / assembled (cell orientations & other issues). EVEN GSL has started abandoning packs with cells on their sides after all the problems & issues.
Anyways, I provided more info to help folks make their choices. The rest is up to whoever to make their choices.
I Asked AMY to crunch up some Numbers with "general Shipping" to MID-USA to show what REAL costs are that are not fluffed up for profit.
This was crunched up 20 Minutes ago so current "as of today".
This is for CASE KITS but not including BMS etc... Just the Case, seperators busbars, breaker etc.
***Case kit price(BMS and screen not included):
For 24V/8S—original price $168
For 48V/16S—original price $235
***Freight to middle USA:
For 24V case kit—$76
For 48V case kit—$116
By sea,DDP
Products list direct from CN
Main products Lifepo4 battery, LTO battery and 142 more Products from Shenzhen Luyuan Technology Co., Ltd. on Alibaba.com
These numbers are in line with the 16s case that I ordered. I can't break out the shipping cost for just the case since I also ordered 18 EVE 280 Ah cells. The delivery guy is going to hate me. From first contact to notification of shipping out of Amy's facility was four days.
With regard to there being a bit of extra room in the case for the batteries, I'm hoping so. I need to add warming pads to the cells. I prefer to put them on the sides, not the bottom. If there isn't enough room on the sides, then I'll go with the bottom.
The JK inverter BMS was also ordered. I have a lot to learn about connecting that to a Victron system.
Alibaba's process for taking a credit card is vastly improved from my last order in 2020. The credit card I used last time had expired so I needed to start over. Took all of 2 minutes, if that.
Steve_S
Emperor Of Solar
The prices shown in my post for the "actual case kit for 1 pc" + S&H is "Just for the cases" if you order the Case Kits. nothing extra.
If ordering extra things - that is on top . BUT they can put the BMS & Screen boxes into the Case Box and ship it as "one box". Cells , well that's cells...
SoggyShoes
Solar Enthusiast
What heating pads are you using?
I want to do the same thing for my 24V cases that I ordered from Amy @ Luyuan.
Putting the pads under the cells seems like it would be most efficient, but I was worried about the weight on the pads and the batteries are in an RV so there will some movement.
I'm going to put in a question to the folks at UltraHeat. They made a set of side pads for my last set of batteries. This is an expensive option but they'll be made to fit and they're designed specifically for batteries.
The weight of the cells on the pads was one of my concerns last time. With pads on the sides you get two pads, thus twice the heat. The only downside of the pads I used is that they are sticky backed. Once it's attached to the side of the battery, it's probably not coming off unless you cut it off. If I have to replace a cell, that's going to be a problem. The fix for that most seen on the forum is to mount the pads to a thin sheet of aluminum and then place the sheet against the side of the battery.
As I recall, the pads are 12 volt. My new battery is 48 volt. I'll have to run four pads in series to get the right voltage, or power the pads off of my 48-12 converter.
I've had the pads on my 4s batteries for almost four years with no problems. The cells are in a compression fixture that keeps them from moving.
The way the pads are made the heat radiates to the sticky side. The non-sticky side is insulated. When the pads are operating, you can't feel much heat from the insulated side. I haven't checked the difference with an infrared gauge, just my hand.
Heating the entire box seems wasteful to me. Then again, the only way to insulate the cells (using rigid foam) is on the outside of the box.
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