Need Help Please.

[Deleted member 9967]

I guess I am just naive about solar. Wait, there is no I guess it is an absolute fact. I also think that maybe I am different than most but maybe not. I am not trying to maximize anything. Just hopefully put some charge back in the battery and not start a fire. The whole solar world to me seems so inexact and it has to be. Specially for travelers. Is the sun going to shine, am I partially shaded for part of the day, where am I in the country, how much will I be driving this week versus next week and on and on. I have had people tell me I must know all the energy that I will use(an energy audit) and go from there. Again which week, which month, hot, mild, cold, humid or dry? It will always be changing and many people install solar and then make changes. Many are limited by roof space. Many then add panels on the ground. I think this is probably very normal as who really know how they will use it now and six months from now. Pretty easy to size a furnace for a house. What part of the country, how many square foot and how much insulation. Furnace runs more when it is bitter cold and less when mild. When someone takes solar mobile I think there are just so many variables. In my case I THINK I over paneled for my needs. Someday I will probably find out. My guess is that answer will change based on conditions. Rain for four days and I don't think it matters how much solar you have or how many batteries you will be short. Okay you could have a ton of batteries but most aren't going to do that. My solution for times like that is I pull out my little generator and charge back up. I think the subject is fascinating and pretty cool that you get energy from the sun.!! Not trying to rant but just thought it would not be this hard especially with my expectations. To me, from watching a ton of YouTube videos is tilting panels. That sure seems to make a big difference Anyway thanks again and my quest continues.

I know the feeling. We all started where you are basically.
Heck, all i wanted was better batteries for my mobility scooter. Now I have a coulomb meter. Hope to get a BMS one day with relays and shunts and more "oh my".
Also, as if that weren't enough. I need to get a special charger specifically for the batteries I got as well.

So simple choice to "get better batteries" has made me come here for months now LOL.

So yes, we are all in the same boat on the same journey.
just some have paddle a bit more and some [like myself] a lot less.

 

[ICT]

I know the feeling. We all started where you are basically.
Heck, all i wanted was better batteries for my mobility scooter. Now I have a coulomb meter. Hope to get a BMS one day with relays and shunts and more "oh my".
Also, as if that weren't enough. I need to get a special charger specifically for the batteries I got as well.

So simple choice to "get better batteries" has made me come here for months now LOL.

So yes, we are all in the same boat on the same journey.
just some have paddle a bit more and some [like myself] a lot less.

Thanks!! I think my paddles fell out of the boat. Just seems like it shouldn't be this hard. I just want to charge some lead acid batteries. I have a battery charger in the garage that will do it. I just bought a 45 amp smart charger that will do it. I could have gone with a bigger smart charger but didn't see the need. When I bought these panels I thought no big deal just get a SCC over cable for safety and use circuit breakers and away I go. Just saw gas for $1.65. Can run that small generator for a long time and replace it a couple times for cheap. I have built a quiet box for it and it can hardly be heard. Sure would like solar though.

 

[Deleted member 9967]

Thanks!! I think my paddles fell out of the boat. Just seems like it shouldn't be this hard. I just want to charge some lead acid batteries. I have a battery charger in the garage that will do it. I just bought a 45 amp smart charger that will do it. I could have gone with a bigger smart charger but didn't see the need. When I bought these panels I thought no big deal just get a SCC over cable for safety and use circuit breakers and away I go. Just saw gas for $1.65. Can run that small generator for a long time and replace it a couple times for cheap. I have built a quiet box for it and it can hardly be heard. Sure would like solar though.

To be honest. It always looks overwhelming at first.
But through experience in learning many things I have found it is like the old saying of "how do you eat an elephant?
One bite at a time".

So pick one thing and know it.
Then pick another and know that thing.
After a while you will have half the elephant gone and you will wonder where the time went.

Even if you never use half the knowledge for yourself. There is someone else just like you joining this forum in two months that you might be able to help with one or two facts.

It is what I do. I only know a few things. But the few things I do know, I know them well. And this forum is half the reason why.
The other half is videos and lots of reading in my spare time.
Heck, even if you only read half an hour a day [I read a few hours a day LOL] you can still learn tons.

Anyhow, I hope this encourages you.

Don't be overwhelmed by the size of the mountain, instead enjoy the trip.
One
Step
At
A
Time.

 

[Reed Cole]

Thanks!! I think my paddles fell out of the boat. Just seems like it shouldn't be this hard. I just want to charge some lead acid batteries. I have a battery charger in the garage that will do it. I just bought a 45 amp smart charger that will do it. I could have gone with a bigger smart charger but didn't see the need. When I bought these panels I thought no big deal just get a SCC over cable for safety and use circuit breakers and away I go. Just saw gas for $1.65. Can run that small generator for a long time and replace it a couple times for cheap. I have built a quiet box for it and it can hardly be heard. Sure would like solar though.

It's not that complicated, you just need to decide how to configure your panels and then buy an appropriately rated charge controller.

If you want someone to tell you what to do, I would tell you to wire your three panels in parallel and get the Victron 150/70. You will be able to charge your batteries when the sun comes out.

With a small mobile system it's hard to go wrong, you are limited by your roof space so you kind of have to adapt your usage to what you can produce and usually have to supplement with another charging source anyways. Since you already have a generator you don't mind using then you really don't have anything to worry about, though I suspect you won't need it much since your electrical needs don't sound very extravagant.

 

[ICT]

It's not that complicated, you just need to decide how to configure your panels and then buy an appropriately rated charge controller.

If you want someone to tell you what to do, I would tell you to wire your three panels in parallel and get the Victron 150/70. You will be able to charge your batteries when the sun comes out.

With a small mobile system it's hard to go wrong, you are limited by your roof space so you kind of have to adapt your usage to what you can produce and usually have to supplement with another charging source anyways. Since you already have a generator you don't mind using then you really don't have anything to worry about, though I suspect you won't need it much since your electrical needs don't sound very extravagant.

THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU!!! I do have more roof space but don't see any reason to add more panels. It seems like Victron is the best but could I use the OUTBACK 150/60 also? I don't need all the bells and whistles that Victron seems to have. I am not a tech guy and the only apps on my phone are the flashlight app and calculator. Again THANK YOU so much!!!

 

[ICT]

To be honest. It always looks overwhelming at first.
But through experience in learning many things I have found it is like the old saying of "how do you eat an elephant?
One bite at a time".

So pick one thing and know it.
Then pick another and know that thing.
After a while you will have half the elephant gone and you will wonder where the time went.

Even if you never use half the knowledge for yourself. There is someone else just like you joining this forum in two months that you might be able to help with one or two facts.

It is what I do. I only know a few things. But the few things I do know, I know them well. And this forum is half the reason why.
The other half is videos and lots of reading in my spare time.
Heck, even if you only read half an hour a day [I read a few hours a day LOL] you can still learn tons.

Anyhow, I hope this encourages you.

Don't be overwhelmed by the size of the mountain, instead enjoy the trip.
One
Step
At
A
Time.

Love it!!

 

[DASH]

I guess I am just naive about solar. Wait, there is no I guess it is an absolute fact. I also think that maybe I am different than most but maybe not. I am not trying to maximize anything. Just hopefully put some charge back in the battery and not start a fire. The whole solar world to me seems so inexact and it has to be. Specially for travelers. Is the sun going to shine, am I partially shaded for part of the day, where am I in the country, how much will I be driving this week versus next week and on and on. I have had people tell me I must know all the energy that I will use(an energy audit) and go from there. Again which week, which month, hot, mild, cold, humid or dry? It will always be changing and many people install solar and then make changes. Many are limited by roof space. Many then add panels on the ground. I think this is probably very normal as who really know how they will use it now and six months from now. Pretty easy to size a furnace for a house. What part of the country, how many square foot and how much insulation. Furnace runs more when it is bitter cold and less when mild. When someone takes solar mobile I think there are just so many variables. In my case I THINK I over paneled for my needs. Someday I will probably find out. My guess is that answer will change based on conditions. Rain for four days and I don't think it matters how much solar you have or how many batteries you will be short. Okay you could have a ton of batteries but most aren't going to do that. My solution for times like that is I pull out my little generator and charge back up. I think the subject is fascinating and pretty cool that you get energy from the sun.!! Not trying to rant but just thought it would not be this hard especially with my expectations. To me, from watching a ton of YouTube videos is tilting panels. That sure seems to make a big difference Anyway thanks again and my quest continues.

The dynamics of generating Electricity from Solar Energy with a small system really isn't that complicated. There's plenty of information and products out there for that purpose. The more difficult part is matching the solar system with the expectations of the end user. This gets even more complicated as the amount of solar energy generated on a day to day basis is variable and not predictable, the end users electrical demands may change, and most users grew up only having to flip a switch and pay a utility bill to get electric.

 

[ICT]

The dynamics of generating Electricity from Solar Energy with a small system really isn't that complicated. There's plenty of information and products out there for that purpose. The more difficult part is matching the solar system with the expectations of the end user. This gets even more complicated as the amount of solar energy generated on a day to day basis is variable and not predictable, the end users electrical demands may change, and most users grew up only having to flip a switch and pay a utility bill to get electric.

I agree and that is why my expectations are low. Some days the sun just doesn't shine.

 

[Deleted member 9967]

I agree and that is why my expectations are low. Some days the sun just doesn't shine.

Good grief, that sounds like a hit country song you got there. LOLOL

 

[rkw]

Thanks!! I think my paddles fell out of the boat. Just seems like it shouldn't be this hard. I just want to charge some lead acid batteries. I have a battery charger in the garage that will do it. I just bought a 45 amp smart charger that will do it. I could have gone with a bigger smart charger but didn't see the need. When I bought these panels I thought no big deal just get a SCC over cable for safety and use circuit breakers and away I go. Just saw gas for $1.65. Can run that small generator for a long time and replace it a couple times for cheap. I have built a quiet box for it and it can hardly be heard. Sure would like solar though.

Gas for $1.65...I hate you!! hahahaha...we're at $3.03 right now in CA Central Coast area. It can get a LOT higher in SF or LA. It's one reason I am leaving CA even being native born here 50-mumble years ago. Plus it's time to travel and explore this damned country a bit more. My solar plan will allow that with ease, it just takes time to build out. While waiting look what the costs of LFP raw cells has done....we can get 8 280Ah cells delivered from China in almost ready to use condition for about $900...that's 560Ah give or take. Plan is two banks at 24v, already bought 6 nice 340W panels a year ago for $85/ea...I can get 5 on the roof and 6 if I am willing to switch to mini-split AC's (maybe just one mini split and leave my 2nd roof top as is for now). It all takes time and reading here and Will's plus other videos on YT have helped me a lot if only to realize what can be done today. Right now I'm sort of like you, had to buy a new 200Ah AGM in a pinch and combining with a big inverter to run a few things while I manage rebuilding the electrical system in the RV this Fall. But better a bit longer delay to do it right than on the road and have failures in the desert somewhere.

Anyway it does always seem like magic, and some insist on trying to make it look like black secret magic answering basic questions trying to cover every eventuality at once...can't be done that way. We need straight forward answers we can follow up on as we go...that's how we learn thinking through a solution then realizing there is an unconsidered bump to deal with...that's the fun of it...

 

[ICT]

Good grief, that sounds like a hit country song you got there. LOLOL

Add in the dog died and the wife left and we are half way done with that song.

 

[ICT]

Gas for $1.65...I hate you!! hahahaha...we're at $3.03 right now in CA Central Coast area. It can get a LOT higher in SF or LA. It's one reason I am leaving CA even being native born here 50-mumble years ago. Plus it's time to travel and explore this damned country a bit more. My solar plan will allow that with ease, it just takes time to build out. While waiting look what the costs of LFP raw cells has done....we can get 8 280Ah cells delivered from China in almost ready to use condition for about $900...that's 560Ah give or take. Plan is two banks at 24v, already bought 6 nice 340W panels a year ago for $85/ea...I can get 5 on the roof and 6 if I am willing to switch to mini-split AC's (maybe just one mini split and leave my 2nd roof top as is for now). It all takes time and reading here and Will's plus other videos on YT have helped me a lot if only to realize what can be done today. Right now I'm sort of like you, had to buy a new 200Ah AGM in a pinch and combining with a big inverter to run a few things while I manage rebuilding the electrical system in the RV this Fall. But better a bit longer delay to do it right than on the road and have failures in the desert somewhere.

Anyway it does always seem like magic, and some insist on trying to make it look like black secret magic answering basic questions trying to cover every eventuality at once...can't be done that way. We need straight forward answers we can follow up on as we go...that's how we learn thinking through a solution then realizing there is an unconsidered bump to deal with...that's the fun of it...

WOW! Someone leaving Ca? I wonder who would ever want to leave that messed up state-haha. Most beautiful state ever and people ruined it. How does anyone vote for those idiots. Anyway I agree. I think it is great that many are reaching for the stars with the best system ever. I on the other hand am just looking to charge some lead acid batteries. Straight forward and simply is nice. One of Will's video talked about a 12 volt refrigerator versus a dorm fridge. I loved his concept about yes that high priced 12 volt is nice but my dorm fridge is way bigger and much more convenient. Like Will said in the video just add an extra panel and you still saved a lot of money.

 

[Hedges]

One of Will's video talked about a 12 volt refrigerator versus a dorm fridge. I loved his concept about yes that high priced 12 volt is nice but my dorm fridge is way bigger and much more convenient. Like Will said in the video just add an extra panel and you still saved a lot of money.

Wire fridge thermostat to turn on inverter and save the no-load consumption for 75% of time when fridge isn't running. Or idle-sleep feature of inverter. Use a timer or SoC control to shut off fridge at night, and battery only has to be big enough for starting surge (and to accept peak PV charging current).

A few years ago, powering a fridge from PV was hardly practical. It's getting to the point where powering the house from grid is hardly practical. Only while net metering survives. When that's gone we will use grid as a backup generator, unless "demand charges" are too high. But then we will be back to heating with firewood.

 

[ICT]

Wire fridge thermostat to turn on inverter and save the no-load consumption for 75% of time when fridge isn't running. Or idle-sleep feature of inverter. Use a timer or SoC control to shut off fridge at night, and battery only has to be big enough for starting surge (and to accept peak PV charging current).

A few years ago, powering a fridge from PV was hardly practical. It's getting to the point where powering the house from grid is hardly practical. Only while net metering survives. When that's gone we will use grid as a backup generator, unless "demand charges" are too high. But then we will be back to heating with firewood.

I am so glad you said that!!! I forgot about having inverter turn on with fridge. Seems like I have seen a couple videos on how to do that. I was also going to experiment with freezing water bottle during the day and leave some in freezer and put some in fridge so I can turn off at night. That might still work along with you inverter suggestion!!! If fridge needs to turn on at night it might be much less. Thanks so much for that tremendous idea.

 

[Hedges]

Water freezes/thaws at 32F, 0C. That will keep things cool, but frozen food turns mushy.
You can use blue ice, or look up brine and use a salt concentration in water tuned to your target temperature. Freezer has to be colder than that to freeze it. With power off, salt and ice keeps it at a setpoint colder than 0C; that is how ice cream makers work.

Some inverters have a sleep mode of only a few watts. They check the AC side for loads occasionally. That would let all your appliances serve to turn on inverter. Within certain wattage load thresholds, of course.

 

[ICT]

Water freezes/thaws at 32F, 0C. That will keep things cool, but frozen food turns mushy.
You can use blue ice, or look up brine and use a salt concentration in water tuned to your target temperature. Freezer has to be colder than that to freeze it. With power off, salt and ice keeps it at a setpoint colder than 0C; that is how ice cream makers work.

Some inverters have a sleep mode of only a few watts. They check the AC side for loads occasionally. That would let all your appliances serve to turn on inverter. Within certain wattage load thresholds, of course.

Another great idea. I do have a bunch of those blue ice squares. I will have to see if my inverter has a sleep mode. Thanks again!!

 

[Deleted member 9967]

Or how about using those temp probes and turning things on and off based on the temperature of the freezer instead?
This way your solar powered inverter etc turn on when the freezer gets warm [say 5 below] and turns off when it gets 10 below.
So instead of the usual "turn off when too cold" to save the batteries. Turn on when too warm to save the food.
Just another idea.

 

[Hedges]

Or how about using those temp probes and turning things on and off based on the temperature of the freezer instead?
This way your solar powered inverter etc turn on when the freezer gets warm [say 5 below] and turns off when it gets 10 below.
So instead of the usual "turn off when too cold" to save the batteries. Turn on when too warm to save the food.
Just another idea.

Exactly.
I figured the optimum was to turn off fridge as soon as PV drops to where battery begins to discharge.
But another thermostat turns it back on if needed to save the ice cream during the night.

 

[Deleted member 9967]

Exactly.
I figured the optimum was to turn off fridge as soon as PV drops to where battery begins to discharge.
But another thermostat turns it back on if needed to save the ice cream during the night.

Yes, just put the temp probes inside of the freezer is all.

 

[ICT]

WOW!! Great ideas.