Need help

[SabE]

Hello everyone I’m a complete noob and looking to go off grid. So this is sorta a long post. I’ve been doing research for months but math really gets me.

My current power bill with solar ( Came on the house when I moved in ) says I use 1100 kWh in 30 days or 36.66 kWh a day. We use gas for water and gas for our washer and dryer. When I move I will need to switch the gas over to solar. I will also be getting a well. The water heater I’m looking at is the EcoSmart 11 13kWh electric tankless water heater, the washer and dryer is both Energy Star appliances. The washer uses approximately 537 kWh in a year and the dryer 608 kWH in a year based off the yellow energy guide label. I would use both washer and dryer 2 hours a week. I also have no clue what all I will need to power a well and sewage pump as well as whatever it takes to do it too.

Can anyone help me determine what my new kWh a day would be so I can then move onto the # of solar panels, battery bank, charger controller, and inverter I need.

 

[sunshine_eggo]

Hello everyone I’m a complete noob and looking to go off grid. So this is sorta a long post. I’ve been doing research for months but math really gets me.

My current power bill with solar ( Came on the house when I moved in ) says I use 1100 kWh in 30 days or 36.66 kWh a day.

Noted.

We use gas for water and gas for our washer and dryer. When I move I will need to switch the gas over to solar.

This creates some complexity. if you have your gas usage, you can approximate an equivalent kWh need to replace it with electrons.

I will also be getting a well.

This further creates complexity. What pump and how much water do you need per day?

The water heater I’m looking at is the EcoSmart 11 13kWh electric tankless water heater,

This will destroy you. tankless electric is hands down the most demanding application of residential solar. You will need to likely double your system size to allow this. Consider a heat pump water heater instead.

the washer and dryer is both Energy Star appliances. The washer uses approximately 537 kWh in a year and the dryer 608 kWH in a year based off the yellow energy guide label. I would use both washer and dryer 2 hours a week.

If you truly only use two days per week, it's more important to know the power consumption of the units, and you need to factor that in to certain days.

I also have no clue what all I will need to power a well and sewage pump as well as whatever it takes to do it too.

Well depth and daily consumption? Will you have above ground storage? Will you have a pressure tank?

 

[Texican]

you said "when I move I will need to move the gas over to solar "
so are you moving to a different house/location ? or just wanting to reduce grid usage with some solar ?
if you will not have the grid available at all that will be a different solution

 

[SabE]

Noted.



This creates some complexity. if you have your gas usage, you can approximate an equivalent kWh need to replace it with electrons.



This further creates complexity. What pump and how much water do you need per day?



This will destroy you. tankless electric is hands down the most demanding application of residential solar. You will need to likely double your system size to allow this. Consider a heat pump water heater instead.



If you truly only use two days per week, it's more important to know the power consumption of the units, and you need to factor that in to certain days.



Well depth and daily consumption? Will you have above ground storage? Will you have a pressure tank?

I don’t know the pump for the water since I’ve never had a well. How much water I need is also something I haven’t figured out. On average it says a person uses 60 gallons a day. Idk if I’ll actually use that much.

I wash my clothes once a week, and it’s normally one load. A hour to wash and a hour to dry. Normally.

I’ve never had a well like I said so I don’t know what all I need to operate it

 

[SabE]

you said "when I move I will need to move the gas over to solar "
so are you moving to a different house/location ? or just wanting to reduce grid usage with some solar ?
if you will not have the grid available at all that will be a different solution

Yes I’m moving to a new location, on raw land.

 

[John Frum]

Is propane an option for the homestead?

 

[sunshine_eggo]

I don’t know the pump for the water since I’ve never had a well. How much water I need is also something I haven’t figured out. On average it says a person uses 60 gallons a day. Idk if I’ll actually use that much.

Does your water bill show you gallons used/month? Ours does.

I wash my clothes once a week, and it’s normally one load. A hour to wash and a hour to dry. Normally.

Then you need to know the power ratings of the units, i.e., the voltage they work at and the max amps they draw.

I’ve never had a well like I said so I don’t know what all I need to operate it

Find the typical well depth in your area. Assuming you're in the USA, there may be a well registry for your state. Arizona has one. I have looked up my neighbors wells.

There are alternatives to instant hot water like pre-heat systems that circulate the cold water in the pipes back to the tank and then fill the pipes with hot water. it takes a few minutes, but it eliminates water waste.

I really want to discourage you from going tankless electric water heater off-grid. They are horribly inefficient and demanding. When I said it doubles your system size, it might even be triple. A heat pump water heater is 4-5X more efficient (uses 1/5-1/4th the electricity to heat water vs. traditional hot water heater or tankless), and you can get the same water savings with a pre-heat system.

 

[SabE]

Does your water bill show you gallons used/month? Ours does.



Then you need to know the power ratings of the units, i.e., the voltage they work at and the max amps they draw.



Find the typical well depth in your area. Assuming you're in the USA, there may be a well registry for your state. Arizona has one. I have looked up my neighbors wells.

There are alternatives to instant hot water like pre-heat systems that circulate the cold water in the pipes back to the tank and then fill the pipes with hot water. it takes a few minutes, but it eliminates water waste.

I really want to discourage you from going tankless electric water heater off-grid. They are horribly inefficient and demanding. When I said it doubles your system size, it might even be triple. A heat pump water heater is 4-5X more efficient (uses 1/5-1/4th the electricity to heat water vs. traditional hot water heater or tankless), and you can get the same water savings with a pre-heat system.

Okay so I can do a heat pump water heater no problem, just need to know how many gallons and to find out how much kWh it uses a day for 2 people.

Well depth in the state I’m looking at says 20feet from ground surface.

And no we don’t get charged for water or gas here so we don’t know how many gallons we use :/ but when I look it up says 60 gallons per person on average so 120 gallons for two people a day.

 

[SabE]

Is propane an option for the homestead?

I was only going to use propane for the stove

 

[John Frum]

I was only going to use propane for the stove

For heating applications I like propane.
I also like a propane generator as a power source before the solar power is up and running.
Then as a backup in case of a problem with the solar system including the sun not cooperating.

 

[MisterSandals]

I was only going to use propane for the stove

This would be a good choice for water heater.

 

[SabE]

This would be a good choice for water heater.

Heat pump water heater is suppose to be better?

 

[MisterSandals]

Heat pump water heater is suppose to be better?

I was quoting your use of propane for cooking and thinking that using propane for water heater would be a strong candidate.
I am not familiar with heat pump water heaters. If you have a LOT of solar then i would consider that too.

 

[AHTrimble]

I don’t know the pump for the water since I’ve never had a well. How much water I need is also something I haven’t figured out. On average it says a person uses 60 gallons a day. Idk if I’ll actually use that much.

I wash my clothes once a week, and it’s normally one load. A hour to wash and a hour to dry. Normally.

I’ve never had a well like I said so I don’t know what all I need to operate it

With a garden and trees to water, along with some small lawn, we average about 500gals per day in the summer, about 150 - 200 per day in the winter. And we are in Arizona mountains not the desert.

 

[AHTrimble]

I was quoting your use of propane for cooking and thinking that using propane for water heater would be a strong candidate.
I am not familiar with heat pump water heaters. If you have a LOT of solar then i would consider that too.

We live 100% off-grid and we use propane for a tankless water heater, cooking, and clothes dryer. We use about 25 gals of propane ever 4 months or so.

 

[SabE]

We live 100% off-grid and we use propane for a tankless water heater, cooking, and clothes dryer. We use about 25 gals of propane ever 4 months or so.

propane tankless water heater? Is the tankless better than the tank if it’s propane? Also how many watts per day

 

[MisterSandals]

propane tankless water heater? Is the tankless better than the tank if it’s propane?

Yes, i think tankless with propane is fairly common.
Which is better (tank or tankless) depends on your use and use pattern.

 

[AHTrimble]

propane tankless water heater? Is the tankless better than the tank if it’s propane? Also how many watts per day

Yes, unquestionably. You only use propane to heat water...not keeping water hot while sitting in a tank.

 

[PenderBen]

Hello.

As was suggested above, if you have decent exposure consider a solar water heater. I’m in southern BC Canada and have friends here with solar water heaters who get all the hot water they need for most of the year, and they don’t even have very good exposure. You can supplement with a demand propane system if needed.

I went propane tankless for my setup, a combi boiler for DHW and radiant heating, but I’m planning to add solar hot water in the future. The solar heaters can also be preheaters before the propane system, if there isn’t enough sun, saves propane.

I don’t have any pumps on my system, I have heard/read that they can be problematic depending in their startup load, etc. Also consider a cistern/tank for holding and if you can place it with enough elevation you won’t need a pressure pump, might even be worth building a small water tower.
Will the sewage pump be necessary, or can you situate the house for a gravity system? One of the first things I did for my house site was make sure I could do a gravity sewage system, I would have moved the house site to avoid a powered system.

Look at what you’re currently using electricity wise and consider any ways to reduce your electrical use, unless you have a massive budget and can build a system that runs anything think of ways to reduce your demand.

I’m a novice at this stuff too, but am not without a certain amount of experience, hope some of that helps

 

[MrBadger]

I was only going to use propane for the stove

I personally use a propane instant water heater. super efficient. outdoor non vented cost $200. vented propane instant hot water tank around $500.