New Ecoflow Delta Pro - remaining run time (SoC) issues

[hamm55]

Hello All,

I'm new to the forum. General Background: Long time IT professional (networking, programming, etc) with home automation experience. I do have some lightweight experience with solar/storage systems (e.g. portable rv solar, solar generators, etc). After many months of researching for backup portable/mobile/flexible solar/storage options I pulled the trigger on a Delta Pro. I think the engineering is second to none with the flexible expansion capabilities along with the mobility/portability and smart/remote integration. They seem to be a forward thinking leading edge company for sure.

To the problem. I have ran a few load tests to verify runtime and have encountered a weird issue. It seems that the lower the wattage load the worse the runtime estimate gets. When I run a high load (e.g. hair dryer - 1600 watts) then the run time on the display is damn close. (See pics of fan test below).

I contacted Ecoflow support about this and they said the bms and battery pack probably needs to be re-calibrated due to being in storage for a long time. They instructed me to cycle it through 3 charging/discharging cycles (100%-0%) to see if that corrects the problem.

My questions are; (1) has anyone else experienced the problem with a new Delta Pro and (2) is this a common problem with other LIFPO4/BMS battery systems?

Any insight would be greatly appreciated!

Hamm55

 

[sunshine_eggo]

Ecoflow support is likely comprised of people speaking English as a second language just entering FAQ into a database of common problems and aren't technically competent enough to answer your question.

1) yes. Everyone.
2) Yes. all of them.

Your system has its own consumption. It's significant. The DC regulator, MPPT and inverter all burn juice simply by being on even if they're not doing anything. Charge it up to full, turn everything on, power no loads and see how long it takes to go to 0%. You'll be able to calculate your idle consumption.

Your inverter peak efficiency is about 30% of max continuous, so for a 2000W inverter, peak efficiency is about 600W. It tapers off slowly as you approach 2000W, but it rapidly goes to shit as you approach 0W.

At only 78W, you're probably only around 60% efficient, AND the unit is probably burning ~30W on its own.

78/.6+30 = 160W consumed to power a 78W load = 49% net efficiency.

At 600W, you're at peak efficiency and the 30W burn is a smaller % of the load:

600/.9 + 30 = 697W consumed to power a 600W load = 86% net efficiency.

Please note that all computations and numbers are for example only. They are used to demonstrate the concept that inverters have progressively shittier efficiency as the loads decrease from 30% rated, and ALL systems consume power just by being on.

If you have a 78W load, you use a 200W inverter, not a 2000W inverter.

These are shitty choices to power small loads for days at a time.

 

[hamm55]

Ecoflow support is likely comprised of people speaking English as a second language just entering FAQ into a database of common problems and aren't technically competent enough to answer your question.

1) yes. Everyone.
2) Yes. all of them.

Your system has its own consumption. It's significant. The DC regulator, MPPT and inverter all burn juice simply by being on even if they're not doing anything. Charge it up to full, turn everything on, power no loads and see how long it takes to go to 0%. You'll be able to calculate your idle consumption.

Your inverter peak efficiency is about 30% of max continuous, so for a 2000W inverter, peak efficiency is about 600W. It tapers off slowly as you approach 2000W, but it rapidly goes to shit as you approach 0W.

At only 78W, you're probably only around 60% efficient, AND the unit is probably burning ~30W on its own.

78/.6+30 = 160W consumed to power a 78W load = 49% net efficiency.

At 600W, you're at peak efficiency and the 30W burn is a smaller % of the load:

600/.9 + 30 = 697W consumed to power a 600W load = 86% net efficiency.

Please note that all computations and numbers are for example only. They are used to demonstrate the concept that inverters have progressively shittier efficiency as the loads decrease from 30% rated, and ALL systems consume power just by being on.

If you have a 78W load, you use a 200W inverter, not a 2000W inverter.

These are shitty choices to power small loads for days at a time.

Thanks for the quick and detailed response! I have been schooled and much appreciated. So nothing unusual about the issue being common to all in general.

Yeah.... I knew in advance that the support was problably located far east of the US mainland (Or west). I retired last year as a Support Manager for a software development R&D company so am well versed with support quality support levels, tools, and tactics.

I have been researching solar/storage systems for the past several months if not years. I have never been accused of *not* doing my homework for sure on anything I am interested in (especially before I purchase) but I have been accused many times of over engineering stuff. Well.... if it's not over engineered then it's not engineered properly I say

Thanks again!

 

[hamm55]

So I asked EcoFlow support directly about the idle consumption of the Delta Pro with inverter on/off and no load and got the response below.

1. When the AC Inverter is ON, the power loss will be 30W- 40W, 1% per hour.
2. When the AC Inverter is OFF, the power loss will be 10W - 20W, 0.5% per hour.

Factoring in the extra 30-40 watts consumed by the DP itself my runtime for a 78 watt load with a full battery was pretty much spot on. 3600/78w + (40w-max) = 30.5 hours. The Delta Pro display runtime showed 31 hours which would be damn close.

It would be really nice if all vendors/manufacturers would provide the idle consumption numbers as a general practice and also factor that into the bms firmware and runtime display. I suspect though most would see this a negative advertising for their products.

The idle consumption rate for the Delta Pro seems to be very respectable (imho). Does any one know of another solar generator that has a lower idle consumption rate? Just curious.

 

[Browneye]

Have a mini, but have not experienced that. Also have not tested for it either.
IIRC the pro has lifepo4 cells, the mini NCM, which may also be a factor. And the smaller unit may not have nearly the parasitic drain simply due to component size and capacity.

So far have been really happy with it, but have not used it extensively either. A few pots of coffee in the RV.

 

[sunshine_eggo]

IMHO, if you're buying cheap Chinese shit, assume a 45W/3000W inverter power idle consumption. This seems to be pretty consistent across the cheap stuff. Note that "cheap" doesn't mean inexpensive. It means cheaply made, which covers almost all Chinese inverters, AiO and solar generators.

If you see a power consumption figure, assume it's a minimum.

There are some exceptions. The pure PSW inverters (no charger) can sometimes have very low idle power consumption. IIRC, the Giandel that Will recommends is very low.

 

[hamm55]

IMHO, if you're buying cheap Chinese shit, assume a 45W/3000W inverter power idle consumption. This seems to be pretty consistent across the cheap stuff. Note that "cheap" doesn't mean inexpensive. It means cheaply made, which covers almost all Chinese inverters, AiO and solar generators.

If you see a power consumption figure, assume it's a minimum.

There are some exceptions. The pure PSW inverters (no charger) can sometimes have very low idle power consumption. IIRC, the Giandel that Will recommends is very low.

Agree about the CCS in general. I think the problem is that the manufacturers there are not held to tight standards on quality by the government as in the US and thus QA is lacking in general with exceptions. The problem with manufacturing here is the cost to the consumer.

The Delta Pro meets my requirements for a grab-and-roll portable solar generator for a bug-out situation, camping, etc and I can also so use it for critical load home backup needs for short term grid down capabilities. Additionally, I can also do load sharing connected full time via transfer switch to my house panel to get use out of it.

If/when the SHTF then it will take me about 5 minutes to unplug and load into my truck and head out to my BOBC.