Well if you got 2 inverters, you would want bus bar that can do 600 amps. Is what I spitball mathed it. That's based on inverter I think pulling max or charging at max charging capacity. Fits in, with them having built in 300 amp surge protection. Batteries don't push their power, the inverter pulls it, is how I understood it to work.
New NHX 12 killowatt
- Thread starter menchelke
- Start date
dougbert
Solar Wizard
after installing my second XW Pro I wanted to test them. turned on the range/oven, pulling 13,400 watts sustained load. then I looked at the DC amp load - 299 amps - most I had ever pulled. Made me nervous as 2 XW Pro's can pull 17,000 watts for 30 minutes and 24,000 watts for 1 minute.
These XW Pro's CAN SURGE!
I knew my bus could not handle that, let alone my contactors in my battery controller, the ESP32 V2. That is where I started my new design for a 1000 amp bus, the result of which I posted back on this thread. With only one Battery Unit, I could only still draw 325 amps. But the new bus (Victron) can handle more after I add more Battery Units or swap to LFP batteries
At least now I know some of my system's limits and potential into the future
I have several posts in MY BUILD THREAD discussing this and what 4/0 cable I have and what I need. A very good exercise for me
Nice. I am definitely thankful to all the people that blow their systems up, so hopefully I don't!
JohnGyver
Solar Enthusiast
So are you thinking the built in 300A breaker on the NHX-12K is enough protection when tied to four Ruixu Lithi2 batteries through the Victron Lynx 1000A bus bar?
I feel everything is dialed in correctly in the wiring path that I set up. The fused and breaker'd 1/0 cable from each Ruixu battery to the bus bar, 1000A rated bus bar transferring battery power to the inverter, dual 1/0 marine grade OFC copper power and ground wires to inverter... each cable can carry 300A from what I understand... so dual cables should never strain under normal conditions on the one inverter with a 300A breaker on it. I am confident in this regard.... just iffy on the 300A NHX breaker being enough on its own.
Thanks menchelke!
John
JohnGyver
Solar Enthusiast
Wow, that oven has a larger draw than my Stage 2 EV charger! With my EV Ford Lightning charging, my two Ruixu batteries charging and my 5-ton AC running at the same time, I am drawing 20kw from the grid. An oven that pulls 13,400 all by itself is insane! That must be a nice "Mac-Daddy" oven you have there!
I think my oven pulls 6,000 watts or so when it's on... I am actually contemplating converting it to propane when the time comes to replace it, since we have a propane tap available at the oven. Now that I am on this solar journey I am seeking to kill or convert energy needs to the best possible solution, all things considered.
It sounds like that XW Pro is a beast of an inverter too... Very nice!
I can't offer any opinions on what's enough. I want to go overkill in protecting my system, but also I need keep it simple plans, and I can't read schematics, they make 0 sense to my brain, but pictures like u posted, with labels showing actual wire going from where to where, I can understand that. Whatever my defect is electrical symbols and stuff all get jumbled in my mind. All that to say, I have no hands on experience, and most anything is regurgitated from what I read here.
Anyway, I love the pics you posted, and I think your install looks super good, and even though my system will be offgrid, I want to use your pics of your install to relay to electrician what I am looking for in doing wiring from my batteries to my inverter and stuff. (hiring out the electrical as I said, it breaks my brain) I can understand disconnected but when I look, its like dyslexia and shit starts spinning like an acid trip, is all I can say to explain it.
But that said, I also use grok ai to help me work through my questions and this is what it said on subject of spds, and then t-class fuses.
"
Given your setup where the hybrid inverter integrates charge controllers, battery management, and various inputs/outputs, here's how you might approach SPD installation:
SPDs for DC Side:
- Solar Panel Inputs to Inverter:
- Type: DC SPDs for each MPPT input (since you have 4).
- Installation: Connect these SPDs between each positive and negative line of the MPPT inputs and ground at or very near the inverter's input terminals. This protects against surges coming from the solar panels.
- Battery Terminals:
- Type: Install a DC SPD at the battery connection points on the inverter.
- Installation: Between the battery positive and negative terminals where they connect to the inverter, ensuring the SPD is grounded. This protects both the batteries and the inverter.
SPDs for AC Side:
- Inverter AC Output:
- Type: An AC SPD should be installed at the AC output of the inverter.
- Installation: Connect this SPD between the live, neutral (if applicable), and ground lines right at the inverter's AC output before the wiring splits to go to the sub-panels.
- Sub-Panels in Buildings:
- Type: Install an AC SPD at each sub-panel since you have two separate buildings.
- Installation: Place these SPDs at the main breaker or the entry point of each sub-panel where the AC from the inverter enters, connected between live, neutral, and ground.
Additional Considerations:
- Grounding: Since all SPDs are connected to ground, ensure your grounding system is robust. Use multiple ground rods connected in parallel, placed at least 6 feet apart for effective surge dissipation.
- SPD Specifications: For the DC side, look for SPDs rated for the maximum DC voltage you might encounter (consider the open-circuit voltage of your panels in cold conditions). For AC, ensure the SPD matches your inverter's output voltage (likely 120/240V AC).
- Proximity and Wiring: Keep SPDs as close as possible to the equipment they protect to reduce inductance. Use the shortest wiring possible.
- SPD Quality: Consider brands known for quality in solar applications, like MidNite Solar, which might offer SPDs specifically designed for integrated systems like yours.
- Safety and Maintenance: SPDs will degrade over time or after significant strikes, so periodic checks or replacements might be necessary.
Placement of T-Class Fuses:
- Solar Panel Strings:
- Purpose: Protect against overcurrent conditions like short circuits in the wiring or from the panels themselves.
- Installation: Install T-class fuses in each string of solar panels before they converge into combiner boxes or directly into the inverter if there's no combiner box. For your system with 15,000 watts, you might have multiple strings feeding into the 4 MPPT inputs on your inverter. Each string should have its fuse. Choose a fuse rating that matches or just exceeds the maximum current output under full sunlight for each string but is below the wire's ampacity.
- Combiner Box (If Used):
- Purpose: If you're using a combiner box where strings converge before going to the inverter, fuses at this point can provide additional safety.
- Installation: Fuses would go between the string input and the combiner box's output to each MPPT channel on your inverter.
- Battery System:
- Purpose: Protect the battery bank from overcurrent situations, particularly from the inverter or any other device drawing power from the batteries.
- Installation: Install T-class fuses at the battery bank's positive connection to the inverter or any other equipment. Ensure the fuse rating matches the maximum charge/discharge current of your batteries without being exceeded by normal operations.
Considerations for T-Class Fuses:
- Rating Selection: The rating should be high enough to allow normal operation of your system but low enough to react to a fault. For example, if your strings can produce 10A under full sun, you might choose a 15A fuse to give some margin but ensure safety.
- Size and Type: T-class fuses are specifically designed for DC circuits with high interrupt ratings, which is essential for solar applications due to the potential for high short-circuit currents. They come in various sizes, so match them to your wire size and expected current.
- Fuse Holders: Ensure you use fuse holders rated for outdoor use if the fuses are installed externally or in areas exposed to weather.
- Accessibility: Place fuses in locations where they can be easily accessed for inspection or replacement without major disassembly.
- Compatibility: Make sure the fuses are compatible with your system's voltage (DC side, which could be around 400V or more for your setup, depending on panel configuration).
- Maintenance: Regular inspection is key. Fuses can blow due to transient events or degrade over time, so checking them periodically is wise.
Combined answer from Grok
Here's a comprehensive answer detailing how to integrate both SPDs (Surge Protective Devices) and T-class fuses for a robust lightning and overcurrent protection system for your off-grid solar setup:
System Overview:
- Solar Panels: 15,000 watts (multiple strings)
- Hybrid Inverter: 12 kW output, with integrated charge controllers, 4 MPPT inputs, battery connections, and AC output
- Battery Bank: 60 kWh
- Distribution: AC output from the inverter to two sub-panels in buildings 20 feet apart, with the inverter and battery bank equidistant from all components.
1. DC Side (Solar Panels, Batteries to Inverter):
- Solar Panel Strings to Inverter:
- T-Class Fuses:
- Placement: Install a T-class fuse in each solar panel string. If you have, say, 4 strings feeding into your 4 MPPT inputs, each string gets a fuse.
- Rating: If each string produces 10A under full sun, use a 15A T-class fuse. This protects against overcurrent due to faults in the wiring or panels.
- Connection: The fuse should be connected in-line on the positive conductor of each string before it reaches any junction or combiner box.
- SPDs:
- Placement: Install a DC SPD at each MPPT input on the inverter.
- Rating: Choose SPDs that can handle the maximum open-circuit voltage of your panels in cold conditions (e.g., 600V DC) with a high joule rating.
- Connection: Connect the SPD between the positive and negative of each MPPT input and ground. This protects against voltage surges from lightning or other sources.
- T-Class Fuses:
- Battery Connection to Inverter:
- T-Class Fuses:
- Placement: Install a T-class fuse on the positive cable from the battery bank to the inverter.
- Rating: If your battery bank can handle 100A discharge, you might opt for a 125A fuse to allow for normal operation while ensuring protection.
- Connection: This fuse should be placed close to the battery bank but before the connection to the inverter.
- SPDs:
- Placement: Install a DC SPD at the battery terminals where they connect to the inverter.
- Rating: Ensure the SPD matches the battery voltage (e.g., for a 48V system) and has adequate surge protection capacity.
- Connection: Connect between the positive and negative battery lines and ground at the inverter side.
- T-Class Fuses:
- Inverter AC Output:
- T-Class Fuses or Circuit Breakers:
- Placement: Install an AC-rated circuit breaker or fuse at the AC output of the inverter.
- Rating: For a 12 kW output at 240V, you're looking at roughly 50A, so a 60A breaker would be appropriate.
- Connection: This breaker should be the first component after the inverter's AC output, protecting the wiring to the sub-panels.
- SPDs:
- Placement: Install an AC SPD at the inverter's AC output.
- Rating: Match to your AC system voltage (120/240V) with a suitable joule rating for lightning protection.
- Connection: Connect between the live, neutral (if present), and ground lines at the inverter's output.
- T-Class Fuses or Circuit Breakers:
- Sub-Panels in Buildings:
- T-Class Fuses or Circuit Breakers:
- Placement: Use AC-rated breakers at the main service of each sub-panel for overcurrent protection.
- Rating: Depending on the load, 30A or 50A breakers might be appropriate for each sub-panel.
- Connection: These should be installed at the entry point of each sub-panel.
- SPDs:
- Placement: Install an AC SPD at each sub-panel.
- Rating: Ensure these match the sub-panel's voltage rating and have sufficient surge capacity.
- Connection: Connect between the live, neutral, and ground at each sub-panel.
- T-Class Fuses or Circuit Breakers:
- Order of Installation: On both DC and AC sides, fuses or breakers are installed first (closer to the power source) for overcurrent protection, followed by SPDs for surge protection.
- Grounding: All SPDs need to be grounded effectively. Use multiple ground rods spaced apart and connected in parallel for a low impedance path to ground. Ensure that the grounding for the inverter, batteries, and sub-panels are interconnected.
- Proximity and Wiring: Minimize wire length between components to reduce inductance. SPDs should be as close as possible to the equipment they protect.
- Maintenance: Regularly inspect both fuses and SPDs. Replace fuses after they blow and check SPDs for signs of degradation or after known surge events.
- Quality and Compatibility: Choose fuses and SPDs from reputable manufacturers designed for solar applications, ensuring ratings match your system's specifications.
dougbert
Solar Wizard
back in 1998, we (I) upgraded the old circuit for that to 40 amp breaker and #8 awg from the grid, with old 3 wire receptacle without ground - the oven connects its local ground to the neutral wire - yeah, truth, that is why the NEC changed in the 90s to require a 4 wire circuit
Recently I added a new circuit from my CLP to run the oven on the solar CLP. I installed a 14-50r and #6 awg to that new circuit. I replaced the old grid circuit receptacle also with a 14-50r, still with #8 awg. Finally replaced the 3 wire pigtail of the oven (bought in the 90s but still looks great, GE BTW) with a 4 wire pigtail 14-50p. That way I can plug the oven into the grid directly or in to the solar circuit (my default now)
so now I have:
Grid receptacle: 40 amp breaker on #8 conductor (can update to 50 amp breaker)
Solar receptacle: 40 amp breaker on #6 conductor (could also update to 50 amp, but my panel is only 100 amp)
So I agree, 13,400 (55 amp draw) on a 40 amp breaker was a lark. didn't leave it on long enough to trip the 40 amp (9600 watts)
As I am upgrading my main subpanel, I will be replacing the grid circuit with a new run of #6 awg and to a 50 amp breaker, leaving the solar circuit as is.
it is, the EG4 products cannot get near its surge abilities. but that is okay, design for them properly
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JohnGyver
Solar Enthusiast
Wow, I am honored! I hope to post many more as our system continues to develop. If there are any specific pics that you want just let me know. I will be more than happy to capture them and post back. Also, if your electrician says something along the lines like "that's not up to code".... LOL, please let me know! I am trying to do a great job on my home solar system, but I am by no means and electrician. So, there may be some issues with what I have done out of 'not knowing what I don't know'.
I have been using Chap GPT for some answers as well... and in discussion with Ian @ Watts and Adam De Lay about the fusing stuff.
In a nutshell, what is 'in the works' or has already been done;
* Siemens 140,000a SPD added to main panel w/ older secondary Eaton SPD left on for additional protection,
* Siemens 140,000v SPD planned for Well House sub panel and Critical Loads Panel
* All solar panel strings will have a Midnite Solar 300v DC SPD
* Ruixu batteries already has a fuse and breaker on each unit
* NHX-12K internal breakers @ DC battery, AC grid, AC loads terminals
* Home Grounding system heavily upgraded from 'ineffective' 55-year-old setup - Added second ground bar 10' away, all new connections, added second 6 gauge run from main panel to 1st ground rod to second ground rod, so dual rods, dual ground wires. Note - Old ground wire was loosely attached to old ground bar on a rusted-out ground clamp.
* DC breaker and Fuses installed at each array in waterproof conduit box
* DC breaker and Midnite Solar DC SPD installed at the inverter shed
* Soft start added to 5-ton AC system (Soft start acts as a sacrificial device), plus it helps the inverter with in-rush surge
* Considering Victron Lynx Power In fuse modification to add a 250A Mega fuse to each battery connection inside the bus bar for added protection
* Still on the fence about the Class T fuse between inverter and battery bank. Lack of access and cost of fuse are key challenges. As I work on system, I will look for a solution to make this possible work in my tiny shed.
I need to look into adding an SPD to the battery bank, but is that Midnite Solar 300v DC unit enough for the entire bank at the inverter?
This weekend will be a huge push as I found a local contractor to trench 300 feet of conduit runs for $450. The trencher would cost me $250 to rent, plus the hassle to pick up, return, washing it and fueling up.... so, the extra $200 for the work is well worth the expense! That being said I will be fully prepped with the wiring for four 4.8kw solar arrays once I get the other 3 array locations wired up! Then I need to build two 'lean to' solar panel patio covers on my rear garage (AKA - The Goat Barn) and one 'Solar Pergola' for the final array. But that trenching is what scares my 53-year-old butt the most.... that back breaking stuff is what really slows me down. I will be extremely happy once the wiring & conduit is done by the end of the weekend!!! I am starting to see the light at the end of the tunnel!
John
I hear ya. I am a bit younger at 44 this year. But I have had 5 back surgeries, multiple on the knee. I get about half an hour of work a week if I am lucky, if its cold maybe less.Wow, I am honored! I hope to post many more as our system continues to develop. If there are any specific pics that you want just let me know. I will be more than happy to capture them and post back. Also, if your electrician says something along the lines like "that's not up to code".... LOL, please let me know! I am trying to do a great job on my home solar system, but I am by no means and electrician. So, there may be some issues with what I have done out of 'not knowing what I don't know'.
I have been using Chap GPT for some answers as well... and in discussion with Ian @ Watts and Adam De Lay about the fusing stuff.
In a nutshell, what is 'in the works' or has already been done;
* Siemens 140,000a SPD added to main panel w/ older secondary Eaton SPD left on for additional protection,
* Siemens 140,000v SPD planned for Well House sub panel and Critical Loads Panel
* All solar panel strings will have a Midnite Solar 300v DC SPD
* Ruixu batteries already has a fuse and breaker on each unit
* NHX-12K internal breakers @ DC battery, AC grid, AC loads terminals
* Home Grounding system heavily upgraded from 'ineffective' 55-year-old setup - Added second ground bar 10' away, all new connections, added second 6 gauge run from main panel to 1st ground rod to second ground rod, so dual rods, dual ground wires. Note - Old ground wire was loosely attached to old ground bar on a rusted-out ground clamp.
* DC breaker and Fuses installed at each array in waterproof conduit box
* DC breaker and Midnite Solar DC SPD installed at the inverter shed
* Soft start added to 5-ton AC system (Soft start acts as a sacrificial device), plus it helps the inverter with in-rush surge
* Considering Victron Lynx Power In fuse modification to add a 250A Mega fuse to each battery connection inside the bus bar for added protection
* Still on the fence about the Class T fuse between inverter and battery bank. Lack of access and cost of fuse are key challenges. As I work on system, I will look for a solution to make this possible work in my tiny shed.
I need to look into adding an SPD to the battery bank, but is that Midnite Solar 300v DC unit enough for the entire bank at the inverter?
This weekend will be a huge push as I found a local contractor to trench 300 feet of conduit runs for $450. The trencher would cost me $250 to rent, plus the hassle to pick up, return, washing it and fueling up.... so, the extra $200 for the work is well worth the expense! That being said I will be fully prepped with the wiring for four 4.8kw solar arrays once I get the other 3 array locations wired up! Then I need to build two 'lean to' solar panel patio covers on my rear garage (AKA - The Goat Barn) and one 'Solar Pergola' for the final array. But that trenching is what scares my 53-year-old butt the most.... that back breaking stuff is what really slows me down. I will be extremely happy once the wiring & conduit is done by the end of the weekend!!! I am starting to see the light at the end of the tunnel!
John
I do still need to track down the spds and fuses, I haven't picked any of that up yet. Got 8 holes to dig, I have to jack the containers up as the delivery guy just had a flat bed roll off style delivery and they won't bring their yard fork lift onsite to customer to lift em, so I would have to rent a crane or something, so what I am doing is I got whole thing floating on jack stands and blocks higher than where I want it to sit level, I got laser level for checking (have to do at night) I got some adjustable deck leveling plastic deck supports that can spin to adjust height, and I built a frame for my concrete forms. So I jack it up on jack stands then dig hole under each corner as container floats, use my concrete forms to float my concrete pour forms (using old cat litter square buckets) pouring my piers, probably just 2 on one end, level with the laser, wait another week or 3 or so, set container down, lift other side higher, as it's a bit lower, and then dig out it's holes and pour level with the 2 that are done, set box back down, and then anchor it with some anchors.
Electrician will then ground that one to the battery room, which isn't building itself, so I got to do that, and then I also got 900 ft of angle iron 1.5x1.5 and got to build and weld my solar racks.
In this state, if there is any way possible a gas/electrical/whatever line is anywhere near the property, we have to call DigRite before digging. You would be surprised how many gas lines run through this farm country.This weekend will be a huge push as I found a local contractor to trench 300 feet of conduit runs for $450. The trencher would cost me $250 to rent, plus the hassle to pick up, return, washing it and fueling up.... so, the extra $200 for the work is well worth the expense! That being said I will be fully prepped with the wiring for four 4.8kw solar arrays once I get the other 3 array locations wired up! Then I need to build two 'lean to' solar panel patio covers on my rear garage (AKA - The Goat Barn) and one 'Solar Pergola' for the final array. But that trenching is what scares my 53-year-old butt the most.... that back breaking stuff is what really slows me down. I will be extremely happy once the wiring & conduit is done by the end of the weekend!!! I am starting to see the light at the end of the tunnel!
John
I'd lay extra large conduit in the trench and a pulling string. By now, you know the cycle
JohnGyver
Solar Enthusiast
Well, this weekend's trenching project is a big bust. The contractor claimed that he lost his trenching machine while in route to my home. That put me into "do it myself" mode in which I headed to Lowes to rent the same trencher that I used last year for a water line project. Got it home, trenched 30 feet out of 300.... stopped because it wasn't trenching too well in our Texas clay dense soil (soil is a term I use loosely... because its just simply clay). Ate a quick lunch and then I came out to restart the machine and the motor pull cord snapped rendering the unit useless. So I had to pack it up and truck it back to Lowes 30 minutes away. SO FRUSTRATING!!!
The contractor called and said that he had access to another machine and could come out next weekend, so I scheduled with him for early Saturday morning... with a 2pm wedding right behind it. So I hope to be able to pull it off next weekend.
Not sure what kind of soil you have but I purchased a Ryobi 40v 8" auger that works very well, even in our Texas clay. It is a back saver and pays for itself... at least for me it has. I have to rebuild 300 plus feet of farm fencing, solar tilt array (done), solar pergola, solar lean-to (x2), windmill anchor system to keep the wind from blowing it over,.... and the best part, it is fueled from solar production!
I saw Rodney Hunt use it for his tilt array in his build video... so I sold the old Harbor Freight gas powered PITA unit and purchased the Ryobi auger. I WISH they made a 40v trencher too! LOL, Boy that would be a DIY dream tool to have as part of the Ryobi eco system!I hope to get that wiring trenched and buried next weekend. We will see if that contractor comes through. After messing around with that 30 feet of trenching... it solidified the fact that I don't want to mess around with that kind of work. That 30 feet was back breaking even with the dumb trencher that Lowes rented me.
JohnGyver
Solar Enthusiast
In this state, if there is any way possible a gas/electrical/whatever line is anywhere near the property, we have to call DigRite before digging. You would be surprised how many gas lines run through this farm country.
I'd lay extra large conduit in the trench and a pulling string. By now, you know the cycle
Unfortunately, the two solar runs to the back barn is all that I will need to ever run out there. It has a sub panel installed already plus the 3/4" water line and internet cable (wifi for goat and chicken cameras) that I ran last year. The 4 solar strings that I am running as part of the 1st inverter installation is all encompassed in this trenching expense. If/when I start a second NHX-12k inverter install, those solar panels will likely be installed along my north fence line, in the opposite direction of the goat barn 300+ feet away. That will be a trenching project for another day. Especially since I will likely have to take down a huge pecan tree to clear a great solar window for those panels first.
If there is anything else I should consider running in that trench let me know! Once that trench is dug I can add in whatever to run it back to the barn before back-filling it. Would there be a need for a solar related Cat5 cable maybe? If you think of anything I am all ears!
Thanks Korn!
John
JohnGyver
Solar Enthusiast
dougbert
Solar Wizard
yep, was me. they are doing a great job
JohnGyver
Solar Enthusiast
Here is an updated pic of the NHX-12K wiring bay with a note about install.
I just got done pre-wiring the NHK-12K solar portion of the main wiring compartment to the solar disconnect box 2 feet away, in prep for future solar arrays. The solar wiring that I used is 10 gauge... which seems to be the maximum size allowed into the terminals. With all 4 strings populated the side-by-side wiring is very tight. I originally started off by using ferrules on each wire... that was great for one array, but when stacked side by side there was no way they would fit multiple wires together without bulging ad added pressure to the connections. So I remove the ferrules and the wire directly attached seemed to work better anyway. I am using 10 gauge TEMCO wire by the way... which is very good quality wire. I don't have any 8 gauge to test, but I doubt that it would fit cleanly in the solar connection points inside the NHX-12K.
Here is a pic;
Even the white heat shrink that I added to label each PV wire made it tighter. I kept it on so each wire had a little more buffer between each other
Just a heads up before anyone else gets 'ferrule happy' like I did and pre-terminated every wire with ferrule before installing them.
John
I just got done pre-wiring the NHK-12K solar portion of the main wiring compartment to the solar disconnect box 2 feet away, in prep for future solar arrays. The solar wiring that I used is 10 gauge... which seems to be the maximum size allowed into the terminals. With all 4 strings populated the side-by-side wiring is very tight. I originally started off by using ferrules on each wire... that was great for one array, but when stacked side by side there was no way they would fit multiple wires together without bulging ad added pressure to the connections. So I remove the ferrules and the wire directly attached seemed to work better anyway. I am using 10 gauge TEMCO wire by the way... which is very good quality wire. I don't have any 8 gauge to test, but I doubt that it would fit cleanly in the solar connection points inside the NHX-12K.
Here is a pic;
Even the white heat shrink that I added to label each PV wire made it tighter. I kept it on so each wire had a little more buffer between each other
Just a heads up before anyone else gets 'ferrule happy' like I did and pre-terminated every wire with ferrule before installing them.
John
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Good info. Mind posting what ferrules you used? I know you said not to, but I had planned on doing it, but they were straight ferrules like this, with a hex crimper. Or square. I hadn't actually decided, was planning it, and may hold off now that you have experience. Just wishing for more info is all.
Attachments
dougbert
Solar Wizard
I got these for my needs
JohnGyver
Solar Enthusiast
My ferrules had a yellow plastic shroud on them. If you use a ferrule without the plastic protective wire cover that should work. I would suggest a square crimping ferrule since the inside of the clamping area is a squared area... which means more surface area contact of the connection. The TEMCO wires are very stiff, so they fit in nicely and the spring-loaded clamping area of the connection bites well. A ferrule adds a layer between the biting surface of the connection port and the 10-gauge wire with a completely different material. I opted to not use the ferrule since wire sandwiched in that port should make for greater surface contact without incorporating a third layer of material that will likely add some resistance to the connection. In theory, the direct connection of the wire and the terminal port should make for a better 'direct' connection. If this were fine stranded wire that is very flexible, then you would have to use a ferrule for this type of connection to work. In this case, a ferrule is overkill with the possibility of having an adverse effect with added resistance of the ferrule itself. That is why I didn't use it. Even when crimped on with a square ferrule crimper, I could slide that ferrule right off the solar wire with minimal effort.
I am still using ferrules on the DC breakers, but that is because they are screw down connectors that compress the ferrule when tightened. The yellow plastic body of the ferrule helps keep a finger away from accidently touching a LIVE DC wire at the connection.... so, it helps in a 'protective' manner at that particular connection.
I did get a quick zap from 300+ volts at the solar array a while back. I am all about extra protection after that. Luckily that was NOT a zap at high noon with 450+ volts.... or else I might not be typing this today. It was later in the evening when the DC voltage was dropping off. It did give me that 'safety' reminder that we all need when playing with our solar toys!
John
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JohnGyver
Solar Enthusiast
Oh, and I purchased the TEMCO 10-gauge solar wire directly from TEMCO as they give a 10% discount for buying direct with free shipping.
All other wire was purchased from Nassau National Cable.... good prices at the length that you want in every color that you need. Prices are cheaper by the foot than the big box stores... but in all colors, all sizes, all grades, which the big box stores didn't carry any 3 gauge and only had 2 gauge in black. I am too OCD to use a black wire for everything, so Nassau really helped me pull it all together.
All other wire was purchased from Nassau National Cable.... good prices at the length that you want in every color that you need. Prices are cheaper by the foot than the big box stores... but in all colors, all sizes, all grades, which the big box stores didn't carry any 3 gauge and only had 2 gauge in black. I am too OCD to use a black wire for everything, so Nassau really helped me pull it all together.
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Nice. Do your Mini Splits already have soft starts, or is that just planned? I have 2 of the eg4 9k non hybrid units, and 1 of the 12k solar hybrid units, but I changed my panel mounting before I got started. I have 39 panels. I was going to do 18 x 2 on top of the two shipping containers, but make it 4 strings of 9,
But now, I want to do 3 strings of 10 and one string of 9, just all to the inverter. I think I hit the sweet spot of voltage in for the inverter with 4 panels. I ordered a pallet and a mini split and the mini split panels were damaged in shipping and sig replaced them. However, I think original 4 might still work, (haven't tested them yet, but I epoxied the frames, and plan to test them. Or I could take the 3 and hook them to the 12k mini split, and go back to using 9 panel strings. But since I am going ground mount, I figure I can reach and do things much easier with 4 rows of 10 panels, than trying to double them up on a taller rack. I like the idea of being able to easily reach everything if it needs replaced
But now, I want to do 3 strings of 10 and one string of 9, just all to the inverter. I think I hit the sweet spot of voltage in for the inverter with 4 panels. I ordered a pallet and a mini split and the mini split panels were damaged in shipping and sig replaced them. However, I think original 4 might still work, (haven't tested them yet, but I epoxied the frames, and plan to test them. Or I could take the 3 and hook them to the 12k mini split, and go back to using 9 panel strings. But since I am going ground mount, I figure I can reach and do things much easier with 4 rows of 10 panels, than trying to double them up on a taller rack. I like the idea of being able to easily reach everything if it needs replaced
If it's an 'inverter style' minisplit, it ramps up instead of an instant full power on. In other words, it has its own soft start.
dougbert
Solar Wizard
Nassau National Cable has become my 1st choice conductor source, shipping is a bit high, but all in all final price is good
42OhmsPA
Who likes Electrical Gremlins?
Check out shopwirenco too. I was extremely happy with them.
JohnGyver
Solar Enthusiast
I do not have any mini-splits in my home. I do have a 5-ton American Standard Silver Series with a soft-start that I added for use my propane generator... not knowing at the time that I would be embarking on a solar adventure. So I am glad that I added the soft-start now that solar has come along. I may add a mini-split upstairs at some point just to help better balance our AC. Our two story home should have been built with a dual AC setup, one dedicated for upstairs.... but that is a challenge (AKA - another project) for another day! I plan on running everything through my inverter/inverters so its basically a dedicated power plant for everything in my home.
In my setup I currently have 1 string on MPPT1 that consists of 12 Hyperion 400/500 watt bifacial panels that is running around 444v, rated at 4.8kw of production. So far the best output has seen about 4500 watts. I plan to do the exact same on all 4 MPPT's so everything is balanced with the same capability. As of now I plan on 3 southern facing arrays and one west facing array to help with late afternoon power needs. I am stoked with the production of just one array, tied into one inverter and two batteries it is completely holding us over until 9pm pretty easily, which is when "Free Nights" kicks in at 9pm. I cannot imagine what 4 full arrays and 4 Ruixu batteries will be able to do on a daily basis. All of my arrays will be easy to manage... my first is a tilting array, two will be lean-to's off the goat barn and the final one will be a solar pergola. High enough off the ground to maximize solar capture, low enough to reach with a standard A-frame ladder. Not one solar panel is going on my roof.... I hate going on my roof now that I am older. My place is on a couple of acres, so I have the option to do solar on structures instead of on the roof of my home.... although the towering Oaks and Pecan's on my property and my neighbors all around make for a lot of shading. My solar windows are much smaller than panels with a wide open skyline.
Here is a pic of my tilt array... I have posted on other threads but not on this one.
The underbelly of the beast.... 6x6x10 posts, 2x6x12 framing with Unistrut mounting through the backside of the frame bolts through factory bolt holes so all panels are touching each other. All tilting on 7/8" bolts... very balanced, easy to control seasonal tilt angle.
I added 3 linear actuators to take the manual tilt adjusting out of the equation and made it motorized with a remote control function that I can adjust from inside my home. In the future I hope to find something that can be app controlled with solar tracking so I don't have to adjust it at all... the controller could do it automatically daily, instead of me having to adjust it every month or two manually. One huge benefit that I was not expecting is that these motors actually added to the tilting array's stability immensely. My solar panel platform had a good amount of jello-like wobbliness to it when pushed on one corner... after the 3 actuators were installed it became rock solid... with zero wobble. So I have no worries when we get wind... unless a hurricane pops up then it gets flattened and 4 corner legs will get installed to limit the wind effects.
I have to give a shout out to YouTube for this inspiration, specifically with Rodney Hunt, Tech4U and Bud's Life (I think he was the first one to do this) YouTube channels.... after watching all of these guys videos 100 times I finally got off my butt and started building. This array was my start to this project.
My future lean-to's and pergola will have the same look and feel as this array with the same solar panel orientation so everything is 'same-same' throughout my solar system build. All panels will be Hyperion 400/500 watt bifacials as well.
This was super hard work by the way. Each post has 400 pounds of concrete poured into it.... digging holes that big/deep and mixing that much concrete in July and August is for 20 year olds! Not sure how I lived through it without getting heat-stroke... but I did!
I cannot wait until I get at least 3 arrays up and running.... I think that is when the NHX-12K inverter will really sing!
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