ghostimage
New Member
Hello. I would like to share my project that has started about 7 years ago. My Name is Alex and I came to this country 20 years ago pretty much after Ive graduated from college. (Economics and management major). However I always felt that in my country it was a trend back then, everybody was either economist, lawyer, or finance major. Oh well. I'm only mentioning it to acknowledge that i don't have formal technical education. I have never felt like economics was my cup of tea anyway. I was always interested in making things and having a hands on experience. Hence I am a general contractor in construction now. Ive been doing it for the past 20 years and have learned many trades along the way: framing, finish work, electrical, plumbing etc. And i think I'm pretty happy doing it most of the time lol.
About 7 years ago I had an opportunity to bring my parents here. And with them selling their apartment back home, gave us just enough money to build them a house here. As I had to work with limited budget, "best bang for the buck" was the motto for the project. I'm located in the rural part of NE Pennsylvania. Location not "best" suited for solar. To add insult to the injury the house lot is also located on the north slope of the mountain. In the normal conditions I would have settled for a grid. But the cost of the hook up was a "bit" crazy. I was quoted 50k. - 2500 ft of wooded area to run poles and cable and transformer or two. Needless to say it was not in the budget. So I went with solar. 12 Solarworld 275w sunmodules in two strings of 3S2P feeding two Schneider MPPT 60 150 charge controllers and Xantrex 3024 inverter with 120v single phase 30a. My battery bank was 8 12v AGM 255ah Apex batteries 2S4P for total of 1020ah. Not enough to run everything your heart desires but with certain considerations and few sacrifices just good to have all basic amenities. Things that that system would power are: refrigerator, well pump (120v grundfos 10g/m with 300f deep well), on demand waterheater, washing machine, tv and small computer, tons of lights and some other small 120v miscellaneous stuff like hairdryer and toaster. I also had a small 3500w generator to keep my batts charged during our short winter days.
Overall I was very happy with the setup. It performed with in my expectations and sometimes exceeded them. For seven years I hardly had any issues with it. I discount my parents ignorance to system capability. Well, lol, they are seniors with zero off grid experience, so my mom would sometimes push the inverter to the infinity and beyond. No matter how much Ive tried to specify that it is not grid tied and has it limitations. I don't think it ever sunk in lol. I don't blame them though, they are old school.
Last winter however my Inverter gave up. I think its Communication board crapped. The inverter would pass through AC from the generator to the panel but would not run of the Batt bank. I could not see it in the SCP and red light on the inverter would not go away no matter what ive tried. (spoke to xantrax tech service and no solution). The inverter was out of warranty with closest repair center 3h away in NJ and repeir estimate of 400-500$ for the part alone not including the repair cost. I was going to replace the Control board myself if the guy would order it for me. But everything considered I figured its time for an upgrade.
After some consideration Ive decided to go with XW 6848 Pro inverter. Ive already had my SCP, Mppts, So it made sense to stay with Schnider. Plus said inverter had some pretty gnarly specs and a 10y warranty to boot. So one cold March night I fired my genny and went at it. Ive torn apart my batt bank as of now it had to be 48v instead of 24v. That alone took me a good amount of time, those batts are heavy as hell. But when it came time to hang the XW. I realized that heavy could be of a totally different level. I actually tried to get a buddy of mine to come over and give me a hand. But he couldn't make it and given limited time that i had as well i did it myself (never again). After this wonderful midnight heavy lifting session all I had to do was some rough wiring. By the crack of dawn I had the inverter hooked up and running. Because i was press on time i didn't really had a chance to take photos of the progress which i sort of regret as it would be nice for posterity. While i was breaking Batt bank apart to my surprise i found out that my batteries were still in a decent shape for 7yo AGMs. Their resting voltage was about 12.7.5-12.8 between all 8 units. And as much as Id like to get new batt bank (and i will) I figured I'm going to squeeze all i can out of what Ive got.
Anyway I've been fine tuning this system and beside some operator errors here and there it was an outstanding performer. I'm talking strait inverter here. Because by the time summer rolled in I found out that one of my SCC having an issue. Few weeks ago I connected all my solar panels to my second charge controller and everything is functioning as it should. Since I have much more capable inverter and most of the sunny days my array produces way more then the house needs, I have hooked up a 240v, 2000w, 30g water heater to preheat cold supply to my on demand Reem Water Heater. A couple of solid state relays control the 240v line that feeds the WH and disconnect it if Batt volts drop below 52v for 50sec.
I want to give this guy some props as he give a great explanation to how set up a cascading solar dump using thermostat on the water heater. Just brilliant and simple solution.
Ive seen this video floating around a couple of threads but i think it deserves to be exposed.
Things that I've added to my set up so far that i think were useful. As I've mentioned before my battery bank is 48v now, 4S2P 510ah with 255ah or ~12kw usable power. Because i have 4 "cells" per string I have noticed that under load not all of them drain or charge equally. Given they are old batts i figured it is ok but wanted to remedy the situation non the less. So I found this Battery balancer for 48v agm bat banks: POWMR Battery Balancer and installed 2 on each string. That helped thing a ton, all individual batteries now with in 0.1v with in each other. I think its worth 110$ for longevity. Ive also installed 2 desulfators and a cheap battery monitor on each 12v cell. I also installed a Renogy Shunt close to the Batt Terminals for an easy check on my Batt Bank. Im still not sure if the desulfators work but but i don't think the hurt, time will tell. With this few thing though i can see how my batts are doing without checking everything with multi meter. I do understand that the numbers are not exactly accurate but for the ball park it is ok.
Thing that are on the list of future upgrades:
a) another large Solar array. I've already ordered Conext mppt 100 600, and currently looking for some panels to feed it. I would like to have around 5kw worth of panels. I have zeroed on some deals but i think Ill start another thread for that one as i would like some ideas and input on the subject.
b) second XW 6848 pro. - redundancy and increased capacity as i would like to run as much as possible of the system without a need for propane (backup only). I'm still on the fence if i should split my 120v and 240v loads between the two XWs and avoid an unbalanced 240v. It is not too bad now. but my Pump is 120 and so is air compressor. Ive been toying with the idea of getting a 3000w step down transformer to run my heavy 120 loads of of it. Please advise.
c)build a decent size Lifepo4 batt bank. Debating between DIY and prebuild (EG4 etc.) each has is strength and weakness. I might just do both as i already have 2 Seplos 150a 16s BMS. I hear some mixed thing about it. But from what I understand that it is possible to make it talk to my Insight Home or Combox that I also have but don't use anymore as it is obsolete.
Basically that's where I am at right now. I apologize for a long story and any mistakes I've made. English is my second language so please don't judge to harshly. As usual I am open for questions, critiques and suggestions.
Thank you
Sincerely, Alex.
About 7 years ago I had an opportunity to bring my parents here. And with them selling their apartment back home, gave us just enough money to build them a house here. As I had to work with limited budget, "best bang for the buck" was the motto for the project. I'm located in the rural part of NE Pennsylvania. Location not "best" suited for solar. To add insult to the injury the house lot is also located on the north slope of the mountain. In the normal conditions I would have settled for a grid. But the cost of the hook up was a "bit" crazy. I was quoted 50k. - 2500 ft of wooded area to run poles and cable and transformer or two. Needless to say it was not in the budget. So I went with solar. 12 Solarworld 275w sunmodules in two strings of 3S2P feeding two Schneider MPPT 60 150 charge controllers and Xantrex 3024 inverter with 120v single phase 30a. My battery bank was 8 12v AGM 255ah Apex batteries 2S4P for total of 1020ah. Not enough to run everything your heart desires but with certain considerations and few sacrifices just good to have all basic amenities. Things that that system would power are: refrigerator, well pump (120v grundfos 10g/m with 300f deep well), on demand waterheater, washing machine, tv and small computer, tons of lights and some other small 120v miscellaneous stuff like hairdryer and toaster. I also had a small 3500w generator to keep my batts charged during our short winter days.
Overall I was very happy with the setup. It performed with in my expectations and sometimes exceeded them. For seven years I hardly had any issues with it. I discount my parents ignorance to system capability. Well, lol, they are seniors with zero off grid experience, so my mom would sometimes push the inverter to the infinity and beyond. No matter how much Ive tried to specify that it is not grid tied and has it limitations. I don't think it ever sunk in lol. I don't blame them though, they are old school.
Last winter however my Inverter gave up. I think its Communication board crapped. The inverter would pass through AC from the generator to the panel but would not run of the Batt bank. I could not see it in the SCP and red light on the inverter would not go away no matter what ive tried. (spoke to xantrax tech service and no solution). The inverter was out of warranty with closest repair center 3h away in NJ and repeir estimate of 400-500$ for the part alone not including the repair cost. I was going to replace the Control board myself if the guy would order it for me. But everything considered I figured its time for an upgrade.
After some consideration Ive decided to go with XW 6848 Pro inverter. Ive already had my SCP, Mppts, So it made sense to stay with Schnider. Plus said inverter had some pretty gnarly specs and a 10y warranty to boot. So one cold March night I fired my genny and went at it. Ive torn apart my batt bank as of now it had to be 48v instead of 24v. That alone took me a good amount of time, those batts are heavy as hell. But when it came time to hang the XW. I realized that heavy could be of a totally different level. I actually tried to get a buddy of mine to come over and give me a hand. But he couldn't make it and given limited time that i had as well i did it myself (never again). After this wonderful midnight heavy lifting session all I had to do was some rough wiring. By the crack of dawn I had the inverter hooked up and running. Because i was press on time i didn't really had a chance to take photos of the progress which i sort of regret as it would be nice for posterity. While i was breaking Batt bank apart to my surprise i found out that my batteries were still in a decent shape for 7yo AGMs. Their resting voltage was about 12.7.5-12.8 between all 8 units. And as much as Id like to get new batt bank (and i will) I figured I'm going to squeeze all i can out of what Ive got.
Anyway I've been fine tuning this system and beside some operator errors here and there it was an outstanding performer. I'm talking strait inverter here. Because by the time summer rolled in I found out that one of my SCC having an issue. Few weeks ago I connected all my solar panels to my second charge controller and everything is functioning as it should. Since I have much more capable inverter and most of the sunny days my array produces way more then the house needs, I have hooked up a 240v, 2000w, 30g water heater to preheat cold supply to my on demand Reem Water Heater. A couple of solid state relays control the 240v line that feeds the WH and disconnect it if Batt volts drop below 52v for 50sec.
I want to give this guy some props as he give a great explanation to how set up a cascading solar dump using thermostat on the water heater. Just brilliant and simple solution.
Ive seen this video floating around a couple of threads but i think it deserves to be exposed.
Things that I've added to my set up so far that i think were useful. As I've mentioned before my battery bank is 48v now, 4S2P 510ah with 255ah or ~12kw usable power. Because i have 4 "cells" per string I have noticed that under load not all of them drain or charge equally. Given they are old batts i figured it is ok but wanted to remedy the situation non the less. So I found this Battery balancer for 48v agm bat banks: POWMR Battery Balancer and installed 2 on each string. That helped thing a ton, all individual batteries now with in 0.1v with in each other. I think its worth 110$ for longevity. Ive also installed 2 desulfators and a cheap battery monitor on each 12v cell. I also installed a Renogy Shunt close to the Batt Terminals for an easy check on my Batt Bank. Im still not sure if the desulfators work but but i don't think the hurt, time will tell. With this few thing though i can see how my batts are doing without checking everything with multi meter. I do understand that the numbers are not exactly accurate but for the ball park it is ok.
Thing that are on the list of future upgrades:
a) another large Solar array. I've already ordered Conext mppt 100 600, and currently looking for some panels to feed it. I would like to have around 5kw worth of panels. I have zeroed on some deals but i think Ill start another thread for that one as i would like some ideas and input on the subject.
b) second XW 6848 pro. - redundancy and increased capacity as i would like to run as much as possible of the system without a need for propane (backup only). I'm still on the fence if i should split my 120v and 240v loads between the two XWs and avoid an unbalanced 240v. It is not too bad now. but my Pump is 120 and so is air compressor. Ive been toying with the idea of getting a 3000w step down transformer to run my heavy 120 loads of of it. Please advise.
c)build a decent size Lifepo4 batt bank. Debating between DIY and prebuild (EG4 etc.) each has is strength and weakness. I might just do both as i already have 2 Seplos 150a 16s BMS. I hear some mixed thing about it. But from what I understand that it is possible to make it talk to my Insight Home or Combox that I also have but don't use anymore as it is obsolete.
Basically that's where I am at right now. I apologize for a long story and any mistakes I've made. English is my second language so please don't judge to harshly. As usual I am open for questions, critiques and suggestions.
Thank you
Sincerely, Alex.
