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Orison plug and play battery

fafrd

Solar Wizard
Joined
Aug 11, 2020
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4,188
I just ran into this ‘plug and play’ battery being developed by Orison:


I’ve seen some posts on the Forum about whether these batteries can be used to provide backup power or not, but that is not my focus (nor is the question of whether the Orison battery is vaporware or not).

Forger about backup power and just focus on absorbing excess solar energy during the day by charging a battery like this and then using that battery power at night to offset consumption.

This Orison battery claims that it can do that but also claims:

’Installable indoors without utility approvals, construction or electrical permits. Ships to your door, install monitor, mount panel, then simply plug it in.’

It is clear to me what they are aiming for (and I believe it is a good idea), but my question is whether a battery-based power generator can be connected to an home outlet without needing a permit?

Anyone can plug a battery charger into any outlet without needing any permit or permission, but even if grid-tied and designed for zero-export, doesn’t any generator connected to the grid require a permit and review at least by the AHJ if not the utility?

I understand that it is always easier to ask for forgiveness than ask for permission, but I am specifically asking whether the company’s representation that even if you are a stickler for following the rules, their battery can be installed ‘without electrical permits’ can be accurate?

I’m guessing Orisin may be selling something they can’t actually deliver (in terms of the no-permit-needed plug-and-play capability) but would appreciate opinions from those more versed in the electrical code and the ‘rules’.
 
It’s interesting… likely requires a 240V outlet… so, not exactly plug and play… but if certified by ul, and does not backfeeed, or export, I can see it becoming legal.
 
It’s interesting… likely requires a 240V outlet… so, not exactly plug and play… but if certified by ul, and does not backfeeed, or export, I can see it becoming legal.
No, it seems to be compatible with 120 and 240, so you can plug two into 20A outlets on both legs and it will offset 120V split-phase consumption (as well as absorb either 120V AC solar power being generated on both legs or single-phase 240V AC solar power.

What you cannot do is use a single 120V battery on only a single leg and expect it to fully-absorb 240V single-phase solar power…

But what about my code / permit question? Any opinion?
 
Two 20A outlets on opposite phases nearby isn’t common… kitchens maybe…
The two outlets can be located anywhere. You can connect one to an outlet on one phase in one part of the house and a second to o outlet on the second phase in any other part of the house.

The ‘split-phase’ capability is enabled by the 240V grid signal (which synchronizes the output of the two split-phase 120V inverters without requiring any communication or proximity between them…
 
So, there are two boxes you mount? How is this achieved?
Yes, to do a split-phase 120V install you would need 2 separate AC-coupled batteries (one per leg).

But as far as ‘mounting’, the whole value proposition is that these are plug and play, so they just need to be plugged in.

If you’ve got existing outlets where you want them located, you can mount the on a nearby wall (again, 2 different walls if the outlets for the two legs are in different rooms.

If you want to mount 2 battered in the same room, it either needs separate outlets connected to each of the 2 legs already or a single outlet wilted to both legs (branch circuit) or you need to wire up new outlets as appropriate.

Again, each ‘box’ (battery) can be located in a different part of the house - there is no connection between them.
 
I understand that it is always easier to ask for forgiveness than ask for permission, but I am specifically asking whether the company’s representation that even if you are a stickler for following the rules, their battery can be installed ‘without electrical permits’ can be accurate?

Ultimately, that's up to the AHJ but it's misleading to say no permit required in general. Also, many if not most POCO's require an interconnection agreement for any inverter physically connected to their grid even if not exporting. Here is another company (https://craftstrom.com/) making similar misleading claims. I asked someone who works at a POCO and was told they would discontinue service if they found such devices in use. Now the challenge is for POCO's to find such violations. These companies are counting on clueless consumers and not getting caught.
 
Ultimately, that's up to the AHJ but it's misleading to say no permit required in general. Also, many if not most POCO's require an interconnection agreement for any inverter physically connected to their grid even if not exporting. Here is another company (https://craftstrom.com/) making similar misleading claims. I asked someone who works at a POCO and was told they would discontinue service if they found such devices in use. Now the challenge is for POCO's to find such violations. These companies are counting on clueless consumers and not getting caught.
Can’t speak to the ethics of all companies in this space (and it’s likely there are some bad apples), but least as far as Prison is concerned, I suspect that’s not right.

Getting customers to do something they shouldn’t be doing is a lawsuit in the making.

There are sheisters whose business plan is to set up shop, ship a lot of deficient product, and fold up shop to skip town and dissaoeae when the sh*t starts to hit the fan, but you rarely find companies that have put close to a decade into product development with that end-game in mind.

More likely to me that Orison was overly optimistic about how easily they could get approval for permit-less customer install and the fact they have not launched a product yet is due to that hangup (and certainly not technical challanges).
 
More likely to me that Orison was overly optimistic about how easily they could get approval for permit-less customer install and the fact they have not launched a product yet is due to that hangup (and certainly not technical challanges).

Looking at the comments on their Kickstarter site it seems to be more than just being overly optimistic ... repeated broken deadlines and delays for vague technical and non-technical issues ... it was supposed to have been completed and delivered to backers in 2016 ... incompetence/scam comes to mind ... it may all have started with overly optimistic intentions but 6+ years later it's more like a mini Theranos
 
Looking at the comments on their Kickstarter site it seems to be more than just being overly optimistic ... repeated broken deadlines and delays for vague technical and non-technical issues ... it was supposed to have been completed and delivered to backers in 2016 ... incompetence/scam comes to mind ... it may all have started with overly optimistic intentions but 6+ years later it's more like a mini Theranos
Could be. The number of Kickstarter-funded product delivery initiatives that never materialize is probably greater than the number that do.
 
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