Pack Will Not Balance

[Skypower]

NEEY 4TH 4A Balancer works very nicely and is Bluetooth controlled. https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005006462120118.html#:~:text=NEEY%204TH%204A,%C2%A012

There are clones of Neey. I have used them too and they are, as far as I can tell, out of the same factory. The earlier ones didn’t have start balances voltage “EqualizationVol” available but they all seem to have that now (4th generation). $102 from Amazon,delivered in a week and returnable.
https://a.co/d/hvVqt06 There is also the EnerKey from Amazon which looks different but works the same, has mounting holes, marked leads with eyelets, arrives in a day and is only $59. https://a.co/d/3Lcw11A

 

[Kornbread]

NEEY 4TH 4A Balancer works very nicely and is Bluetooth controlled. https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005006462120118.html#:~:text=NEEY%204TH%204A,%C2%A012

Am I seeing that correctly, from 1a-15a balancing current? @$128, the 10amp is more than the jk bms, but if these cells are really that far off from each other, maybe it's worth it?

 

[Kornbread]

If you don't change your password in time your JK BMS is going to lock you out...soon

Never got a reply. Will it really lock me out? I think this bms has been operating for a couple years.

 

[OffGridForGood]

Never got a reply. Will it really lock me out? I think this bms has been operating for a couple years.

I never took the chance ! lol
There was a thread about this a while back, and there is a way to reset the p/w but it was not easy.
I have takent the position to change the p/w within minutes/hours of starting up a new JK, and I use the same p/w for every BMS.

I didn't have this issue on the older JK's, it seems to be a change on the newer ones.

 

[Skypower]

It’s been a few weeks since last full charge so to prove to myself it wasn’t a fluke, I just did the second run to the top since the addition of the Heltec. As it entered absorb voltage it had a delta of 16 mv. Now the former problem child is better than the other batteries. Fifteen minutes later it’s at 5mv and the worst other battery is 23mv and falling. I’m calling it a win. The only problem is I might just do it to the other batteries because of my *¥!%€ OCD.

 

[Kornbread]

Andy gushes over the Neey 15amp balancer but I'm finding very little on the Neey 10amp balancer. The 10amp looks weeny next to the 15amp with its much heavier wires, connectors, and larger chassis. The 10amp can be had for ~$110. Add another $150 for the 15amp. Is it worth the extra $?

 

[Skypower]

Andy gushes over the Neey 15amp balancer but I'm finding very little on the Neey 10amp balancer. The 10amp looks weeny next to the 15amp with its much heavier wires, connectors, and larger chassis. The 10amp can be had for ~$110. Add another $150 for the 15amp. Is it worth the extra $?

10 amps is a ton of balance current. I know because when I’ve manually intervened with a power supply with 10 amps, you don’t need to hold the wires to the terminals very long before you need to pull them. 15 is probably overkill. Be careful about what you order on that site, be sure the item price doesn’t change at order window.

 

[BarracudaBob]

I have the 15A and 4A for 100 ah cells and the 4a is good enough. So I don't see why 10A wouldn't do it.

 

[Kornbread]

If the issues really are the cells, maybe bank #3could be the bad boy club, the runners/lazy cells in some of the other 'b' banks could go to bank #3 where they get balanced with a heavy hand, and the better cells in bank #3 could go to the other banks making life easier on the other plain jk bmses w/only 2amp balancing.

If it's really this particular jk bms's balancing that's the issue, turning the jk bms balancing off and adding the Neey would completely eliminate that issue.

Think I'll order the 10amp Neey. So far, I've had good luck on Aliexpres, but it's probably only a matter of time before going for a ride.

 

[Kornbread]

10amp balancer was supposed to be here Feb. 5-7. Now it says the balancer will ship in 13days and a refund will be issued if it's late. If it ships on time, it's still late.

Oh great, looks like there is a problem with the 10amp model https://diysolarforum.com/threads/neey-10a-balancer-red-led-flashing.75757/

@AshleyL @BartSolar Was there any resolution to the capacitor over-volt issue? What manufacture dates/software versions are affected/good?

 

[AshleyL]

10amp balancer was supposed to be here Feb. 5-7. Now it says the balancer will ship in 13days and a refund will be issued if it's late. If it ships on time, it's still late.

Oh great, looks like there is a problem with the 10amp model https://diysolarforum.com/threads/neey-10a-balancer-red-led-flashing.75757/

@AshleyL @BartSolar Was there any resolution to the capacitor over-volt issue? What manufacture dates/software versions are affected/good?

Nope, no resolution.

I just setup a switch to disconnect the Neey 10A and only turn it on when the battery pack is really out of balance.

To add more woe.....one of my supposely working Enerkey 10A has problem. Apparently the Enerkey cannot hold charge in the supercapacitor properly. I had to lower the balancing current from 10A to 6A.....then to 4A and this week 1A. Guess it is dying?

 

[Skypower]

Snagged a couple of EnerKey 4 ampers to test. They use 22AWG unlike the Neey’s 20. Knowing that 22 is very problematic for crimping and since I didn’t do it, I decided to tag the end of the barrel/stands with some solder to guarantee conductivity and moisture out. Going pull the Heltec off and put the EnerKey on this weekend.

 

[Skypower]

Nope, no resolution.

I just setup a switch to disconnect the Neey 10A and only turn it on when the battery pack is really out of balance.

To add more woe.....one of my supposely working Enerkey 10A has problem. Apparently the Enerkey cannot hold charge in the supercapacitor properly. I had to lower the balancing current from 10A to 6A.....then to 4A and this week 1A. Guess it is dying?

That would be my guess. How old is it?

 

[AshleyL]

That would be my guess. How old is it?

The problematic Enerkey 10A = bought on May 2024 as per aliexpress record.

The initial workaround is to lower the balance current from 10A to 6A, then to 4A and this week 1A. Dying maybe?

Normally, it will take 10 - 15 second to charge the supercapacitor with power from highest cell at 10A and 5-8 second to discharge it to lowest cell.
Now, if I set the at 10A, it charges the supercapacitor with power at 5A - 6A for 2 seconds and immediately discharge 1.5 - 2A to lowest cell in 1 second, rinse and repeat.

Had to lower the balance current so it "works" properly.

My recommendation = stick with the default 5A on the 10A product, less heat on the board. Cause balancing at 10A is causing the board to heat up a lot.

I reduced all my 10A balancers back to 5A now other than the problematic one.

 

[Skypower]

The problematic Enerkey 10A = bought on May 2024 as per aliexpress record.

The initial workaround is to lower the balance current from 10A to 6A, then to 4A and this week 1A. Dying maybe?

Normally, it will take 10 - 15 second to charge the supercapacitor with power from highest cell at 10A and 5-8 second to discharge it to lowest cell.
Now, if I set the at 10A, it charges the supercapacitor with power at 5A - 6A for 2 seconds and immediately discharge 1.5 - 2A to lowest cell in 1 second, rinse and repeat.

Had to lower the balance current so it "works" properly.

My recommendation = stick with the default 5A on the 10A product, less heat on the board. Cause balancing at 10A is causing the board to heat up a lot.

I reduced all my 10A balancers back to 5A now other than the problematic one.

What is getting hot, the cap or a component?
They sell a lot of super capacitors on Amazon and EBay. Perhaps surgery is in order?

 

[AshleyL]

What is getting hot, the cap or a component?
They sell a lot of super capacitors on Amazon and EBay. Perhaps surgery is in order?

The transformer, MOSFET and the supercaps as per normal operation.

With the problematic Enerkey 10A, if I set balancing current between 2 - 10A, the board doesn't heat up at all (room temp of 28'C), meaning it doesn't work. When I measure it via CT multimeter, seems like entire power short-circuited 5A - 6A from ground to last cell.
But when I set it to 1A, there is the usual balancing operation as per measured via CT and the board heats up to 35'C. Definitely board failure or MOSFET switching issue?

Sigh, maybe I just call it a day and get Heltec 5A plus A30-U1 instead, way cheaper and less headache.

 

[BarracudaBob]

.

 

[Skypower]

The Heltec only delivers 5 amps at 100mv or more delta. Once it’s down to to 20mv it’s 1 amp at best. The smaller the delta the less current it has. If you can wait a few days I’ll be testing the 4 amp EnerKey, see what it’s default current is and open one up if it isn’t glued for a couple of pictures.

 

[Skypower]

Just looked at Amazon about the 4A EnerKey ,they are down to 10 left. After that it’ll probably be the China syndrome.

 

[Skypower]

I did a side by side of a two different 4 amp active balancers, Neey(clone?) on the left and a EnerKey on the right. Overall capacitance is the same just different form factors. A while back I had opened the Neey and tagged a small bead of shoe goop across the tops of the caps so they weren’t flapping around in a mobile project. Since this Neey is a 3rd generation and doesn’t have the ability to control my preferred 3.43 start balance voltage, it’ll likely never be used ( balance on/off though app only) The case construction of the EnerKey is superior. Install next.

 

[Skypower]

Well it’s installed and working. May have shot myself in the foot.(Hey, whats that yellow flashling light) Didn’t realize that it was balancing for an hour at 63% SOC. They didn’t have a bad delta to begin with but I know it might throw it out at the top. Now I can’t compare it as easily to the Heltec. Gotta wait a week without getting to full charge for apples to apples. I will take it to full charge tomorrow to watch it first time around. The EnerKey app is a little different/weird from the GeeWe. Has some unknown features. Stop DifVol setting can’t be changed and defaults back to 0.00 regardless of higher or lower than Startup value so I let it be. Don’t know what it does, probably don’t need it. Only changed StopVol and RunVol and that’s probably all it needs to work. Don’t know why it even needs Soc value. Default current was 4 amps. Renaming the device always returns to the default once the phone reconnects. No big deal, just got a lot of devices showing.

 

[AshleyL]

Well it’s installed and working. May have shot myself in the foot.(Hey, whats that yellow flashling light) Didn’t realize that it was balancing for an hour at 63% SOC. They didn’t have a bad delta to begin with but I know it might throw it out at the top. Now I can’t compare it as easily to the Heltec. Gotta wait a week without getting to full charge for apples to apples. I will take it to full charge tomorrow to watch it first time around. The EnerKey app is a little different/weird from the GeeWe. Has some unknown features. Stop DifVol setting can’t be changed and defaults back to 0.00 regardless of higher or lower than Startup value so I let it be. Don’t know what it does, probably don’t need it. Only changed StopVol and RunVol and that’s probably all it needs to work. Don’t know why it even needs Soc value. Default current was 4 amps. Renaming the device always returns to the default once the phone reconnects. No big deal, just got a lot of devices showing.

View attachment 276786View attachment 276787

........no one here informs you not to start balance before 3.45v and stop balance at 3.40v?

 

[Skypower]

........no one here informs you not to start balance before 3.45v and stop balance at 3.40v?

Good catch. I had already changed it this morning. See my edit above

 

[Skypower]

Just finished a full charge. Nothing scientific, just subjective, but it seems that the EnerKey’s balancing is quicker than the Heltec by about half the time. Watching the EnerKey and JK apps it seems like moving balance trigger voltage on the JK to 15mv was about the optimum to avoid conflict/counter productivity between the two balancers. Occasionally they would team up on the same set of cells yet not over do it that way. This also reduces the workload on the JK to let the EnerKey finish the job. Most of you don’t need this kind of balancing power, however if you have questionable cells and/or weird charging schedules, it just might make sense. I’ll probably be doing the same thing to one other battery this evening.

 

[Skypower]

Installed a second EnerKey.
The hardest part is trying to make the wire not look like a bird nest.