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Possible To Off-Grid In Condominium Without Touching Common Electrical/Meter Room in California?

Hi Mopat:
Thank for your excellent questions.
how wide? how many square feet open? how many units share this roof square footage?
It varies in both of the the 2 buildings, with 1 bedroom and 2 bedroom units, averaging about 40', for both buildings. Building A totals 24 units in 2 floor levels, and has about 11,000 sf of flat unshaded roof. Building B totals 37 units in 3 levels, plus the Rec Room/common/utility/pool/spa/elevator, and has about 13,000 sf of flat unshaded roof.
how many? just for you or all tenants of building sharing roof?
Building A has enough stanchions for about a 21kw array in 2011 panel-efficiency terms, so I am guessing more like 25-36kw in 2021? One end of the stanchions is right above my unit's ceiling/roof, and we're on the top level of Building A. Unfortunately as I stated previously, Building A's tiny electrical closet has zero room for any new equipment, and almost no room for even conduits or cables - that's why I posed this question about locating all of my personal condo's equipment inside and on the roof of my condo.
OK, how much solar satisfies your "extravagantly" desire?
Ha ha, well, I honestly have not gotten that far yet - very deliberately. I'm first striving to learn what the basic code/utility-compliant options are for my personal condo, and what those options' practical logistics would be.
I am guessing about 10-12kW for our 2 bedroom condo (with 12-14kWh battery bank?), plus what ever panels/battery are appropriate for an entry-level Tesla Model 3?
 
That's all that would be needed on a per unit install. In fact, it's something you might talk to the loan officer about as a co-op feature. If there are a lot of units, the bank would have a vested interest to package the deal for the co-op
Hi again Svetz:
Thanks so much for your co-op idea - it is excellent, and may be very helpful for other condo complexes. Unfortunately, the building that I live in has a ridiculously tiny electric meter closet with zero room for any added equipment, and almost no room for even any added conduit or cables.
While I imagine I could have a new electrical room built as part of the co-op's scope, it would be prohibitively expensive excavating into the hillside for a new room.
PS, I left a message with my Enphase Regional Commercial Product Rep several days ago, but have not yet heard back. I'll keep y'all posted - I love your idea of working directly with them as a case study for financing.
 
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...the building that I live in has a ridiculously tiny electric meter closet with zero room for any added equipment...
Not a condo/code expert... but with microinverters and the drawing in #13, there's no technical need to put anything in the electrical closet.

The microinverters go under the solar panels, their output goes directly into a meter which could be anywhere the utility can connect to it. It doesn't even have to be on the same building. It could be on an outside wall, on a poll 50 yards from the building, or on the roof with the panels. Used to be the meters were all read visually so had to be eye-level and easy to spot. But now they're read via RF. Legally wherever it goes probably just can't be any less difficult to get to for the utility than your electrical closet.

RSD is built into microinverters, so no need for a manual switch for the fire department as with other inverters. Residential vs. Condo codes might be different, so you might need special visible labeling or ground-accessible components, something you'd need to check into. You do want a few additional things (e.g., envoy combiner box) just to make working on the system easier, but things for your benefit can be hidden out-of-sight (e.g., on the roof).

If someone is worried about the esthetics of a meter not hidden by the closet or a conduit running down the outside of the building, you can get around that too; with some creativity it can even make the property more appealing. See Camouflaging Eyesores.

... I'll keep y'all posted - I love your idea of working directly with them as a case study for financing....
Please do, I for one would love to hear about it.
 
24 units in 2 floor levels, and has about 11,000 sf of flat unshaded roof
11000/24= 450 square feet per unit, building A
13000/37= 350 square feet per unit, building B

Civil Code § 4746 addresses this concern by permitting an association to require the applicant/homeowner to submit a “solar site survey showing the placement of the system” and the “equitable allocation of the usable solar roof area among all owners sharing the same roof, garage, or carport.” This is to prevent any one homeowner from monopolizing the entire area for his or her System to the detriment of his or her neighbors who may want to install System in the future. Association may therefore restrict the applicant’s System to that homeowner’s equitable share of the roof space. For example, if there are five (5) units under the same roof, then only 1/5th of usable roof area may be utilized for any individual homeowner’s System. For some condominium communities, this may result in homeowners not being able to install Systems simply because the usable area allocated to them (and thus the number of solar panels they may have) is not large enough.
 
11000/24= 450 square feet per unit, building A
13000/37= 350 square feet per unit, building B

Civil Code § 4746 addresses this concern by permitting an association to require the applicant/homeowner to submit a “solar site survey showing the placement of the system” and the “equitable allocation of the usable solar roof area among all owners sharing the same roof, garage, or carport.” This is to prevent any one homeowner from monopolizing the entire area for his or her System to the detriment of his or her neighbors who may want to install System in the future. Association may therefore restrict the applicant’s System to that homeowner’s equitable share of the roof space. For example, if there are five (5) units under the same roof, then only 1/5th of usable roof area may be utilized for any individual homeowner’s System. For some condominium communities, this may result in homeowners not being able to install Systems simply because the usable area allocated to them (and thus the number of solar panels they may have) is not large enough.
And don't forget that USABLE space is going to substantially less than gross square footage. Codes dictate walking spaces for maintenance, fire access etc. Then you have plumbing and heating vents to work around
 
The microinverters go under the solar panels, their output goes directly into a meter which could be anywhere the utility can connect to it.
Hi Svetz, thanks again. I understand about the potentially flexible placement during operation when everything is working properly, but I have verified that our utility (SDG&E) requires that they have convenient physical access to the meter to service it when something goes wrong, and also so that they can physically verify that no one has tampered with the meter, or with its signal.
No response from Enphase yet.
Cheers mate.
 
11000/24= 450 square feet per unit, building A
13000/37= 350 square feet per unit, building B
Association may therefore restrict the applicant’s System to that homeowner’s equitable share of the roof space.

Hi again Mopat, excellent references and clarity. Yes, each of us will be restricted to equitable shares as you describe. Yes, each unit has two stink vents on the perimeter, and will require access isles for service and fire safety. I estimate that that would allow approximately 350sf per unit on Building A, which should be plenty. On Building B, about 250sf/unit which could be adequate with current high-efficiency panels, I believe (comments welcome).
Thanks again!
 
Hi again Mopat, excellent references and clarity. Yes, each of us will be restricted to equitable shares as you describe. Yes, each unit has two stink vents on the perimeter, and will require access isles for service and fire safety. I estimate that that would allow approximately 350sf per unit on Building A, which should be plenty. On Building B, about 250sf/unit which could be adequate with current high-efficiency panels, I believe (comments welcome).
Thanks again!
These guys sell a system that switches solar to each unit in turn, and keeps track...


You don't want to sell back, the IOU will eat your lunch.

On the other hand, solar can't compete with the EV rate... so let the IOU charge the car, and build solar for household demand.
 
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