Question about Growatt AC IN

[uzernaam]

The Growatt 5000 inverter can use the AC input to supplement the solar power to assist in charging the battery or supplying AC loads.

The AC INPUT is labeled in the attached picture

Ground | L | N

...and it expects 230 volt input.

I could run red and black phase outputs from a double-pole breaker in my USA service panel to the L and N terminals of the inverter, but would this work if the neutral terminal is expecting 0V and the L terminal expecting 230V AC? Can the neutral terminal of the AC in actually swing between + and - 120V so long as the line terminal sees the same voltage but at opposite polarity?

Would the Growatt neutral terminal on the "AC INPUT" possibly short to ground if fed this way? Or do the L and N terminals simply pull current so long as there is a voltage difference between them, even such that it's OK if the N terminal is actually seeing 120V AC?

Also, the manual is not clear to me, but it seems you can change a programming setting for the AC input to work with as little as 90V AC, but it doesn't say why you would need this, or specifically if you need to do this when using on a split-phase utility such as in the USA.

Thanks!

 

[sunshine_eggo]

The Growatt 5000 inverter can use the AC input to supplement the solar power to assist in charging the battery or supplying AC loads.

The AC INPUT is labeled in the attached picture

Ground | L | N

...and it expects 230 volt input.

Because it's a euro-spec unit.

I could run red and black phase outputs from a double-pole breaker in my USA service panel to the L and N terminals of the inverter, but would this work if the neutral terminal is expecting 0V and the L terminal expecting 230V AC? Can the neutral terminal of the AC in actually swing between + and - 120V so long as the line terminal sees the same voltage but at opposite polarity?

Get a split phase unit.

Would the Growatt neutral terminal on the "AC INPUT" possibly short to ground if fed this way?

Yep.

Or do the L and N terminals simply pull current so long as there is a voltage difference between them, even such that it's OK if the N terminal is actually seeing 120V AC?

Nope.

Also, the manual is not clear to me, but it seems you can change a programming setting for the AC input to work with as little as 90V AC, but it doesn't say why you would need this, or specifically if you need to do this when using on a split-phase utility such as in the USA.

Some AC power sources are horribly inconsistent, unreliable and dirty. Typical consumer generators can vary ±10V and ±3Hz.

 

[mopat]

Is this SPF 5000 ES inverter? Not really for USA.

would this work if the neutral terminal is expecting 0V and the L terminal expecting 230V AC? Can the neutral terminal of the AC in actually swing between + and - 120V so long as the line terminal sees the same voltage but at opposite polarity?

No.
No.

 

[uzernaam]

Ok... this has got me flustered. I was told by the people that sold it to me that the model I bought would work in USA, and it was made specifically for us to create 240V (which is a setting option) and could be adapted to also supply 120V with a transformer.

 

[sunshine_eggo]

Did you buy this from watts247.com?

 

[uzernaam]

Signature Solar in Texas.

Now that I look at Growatt's website, they have a USA model but Signature Solar doesn't sell it. WTF.

 

[sunshine_eggo]

SPF 5000 ES – 5kW 230V output ONLY, 450V MPPT 4.5kw, batteryless/optional operation, European model- 1 yr Old Demo Models, fully functional – Watts247 Wholesale

watts247.com

SPF 5000 ES – 5kW 230V output ONLY, 450V MPPT 4.5kw, batteryless/optional operation, European model – Ships now​

$865.00

Please note NO 120V OUTPUT, ideal for use on 230V Mini Split Air conditioners, Well Pumps, Pool Pumps etc, wont magically make 120V by connecting it to your breaker box.


It can be made to work for special-use applications as listed, but it becomes a single phase 240V-only scenario. Yes, you can feed it with L1 and L2 from 120/240, but you ONLY get L/N 240VAC out.

I have no clue how to properly ground it since you can't tie into your existing ground.

 

[sunshine_eggo]

Signature Solar in Texas.

Then you need to call them with these questions.

 

[uzernaam]

SPF 5000 ES – 5kW 230V output ONLY, 450V MPPT 4.5kw, batteryless/optional operation, European model- 1 yr Old Demo Models, fully functional – Watts247 Wholesale

watts247.com

SPF 5000 ES – 5kW 230V output ONLY, 450V MPPT 4.5kw, batteryless/optional operation, European model – Ships now​

$865.00

Please note NO 120V OUTPUT, ideal for use on 230V Mini Split Air conditioners, Well Pumps, Pool Pumps etc, wont magically make 120V by connecting it to your breaker box.


It can be made to work for special-use applications as listed, but it becomes a single phase 240V-only scenario. Yes, you can feed it with L1 and L2 from 120/240, but you ONLY get L/N 240VAC out.

I have no clue how to properly ground it since you can't tie into your existing ground.

Maybe an isolation transformer. But I shouldn't have to use one in the first place if I was indeed sold the USA model...

Oh, this frustrates me as it's already installed.

 

[sunshine_eggo]

Oh yeah. if you want to add an autotransformer, you can get split phase out of it.

Hopefully @Signature Solar (@SignatureSolarUS ?) will chime in here and explain it to all of us.

 

[uzernaam]

Oh yeah. if you want to add an autotransformer, you can get split phase out of it.

Hopefully @Signature Solar (@SignatureSolarUS ?) will chime in here and explain it to all of us.

I already have it wired for split phase out.

Question is - how do I get AC in from grid without something exploding?

 

[sunshine_eggo]

I already have it wired for split phase out.

How? It can't put split phase out. Do you have a transformer? How is it grounded?

Question is - how do I get AC in from grid without something exploding?

Exactly. You could feed it with L1 and L2, but the N&G can't meet between the two at any point in or out.

 

[mopat]

Solar Edge SEAUTO-TX-5000 Mid-Point Transformer for true 120V/240V Split Phase Electricity!

 

[sunshine_eggo]

GROWATT 5kW 5000ES (USA Model) OFF GRID INVERTER & Growatt Transformer Kit

5000W LVM- ES Off-Grid 240V GROWATT Inverter with Solar Charge Controller + integrated GROWATT Split Phase Transformer for true 120V/240V Split Phase Electricity! The GROWATT SPF 5000W LVM-ES is the all-in-one inverter/charger you need to take control of your energy bill. The 5000ES can work...

www.signaturesolar.com

?

 

[automatikdonn]

I have this exact setup and I take in 240V and connect to 240V out and then it hits the midpoint transformer.

Here are some links

Design Review - Growatt SPF 5000 ES Grid Backup & Neutral Bonding

This seems to be a very popular setup, but thus far, nobody seems to have cracked the DaVinci code of safely using a Growatt SPF 5000 ES with a SEAUTO-TX-5000 Auto-Transformer and using the AC input of the Growatt in a 'utility first' configuration. Signature Solar has posted a schematic that...

diysolarforum.com

 

[Struc]

Wow... lots of misinformation in this thread... Are we talking politics here?

Quick answer to the specific question: Yes, you can take a double pole breaker from your USA service panel, wire the 2 hot leads to the L and N terminal. They are labeled that way due to the European Spec, but it will take in 240v just fine.

The wiring after that is covered in the post before mine.

 

[uzernaam]

Struc -

Unless I'm losing my mind I saw DavidPoz (Youtube) connect the AC IN of his Growatt to utility mains in a video, and it worked.

I just want to be 100% sure that there are no stray voltages, shorts, or bonding no-nos.

At this precise point in time I'm not 100%.

How? It can't put split phase out. Do you have a transformer? How is it grounded?



Exactly. You could feed it with L1 and L2, but the N&G can't meet between the two at any point in or out.

Attached is a diagram of my connections so far:

 

[sunshine_eggo]

Wow... lots of misinformation in this thread... Are we talking politics here?

Quick answer to the specific question: Yes, you can take a double pole breaker from your USA service panel, wire the 2 hot leads to the L and N terminal. They are labeled that way due to the European Spec, but it will take in 240v just fine.

The wiring after that is covered in the post before mine.

I'd like to think I would have provided less misinformation if I was aware there was already a grounded split phase transformer on the output.

Struc -

Unless I'm losing my mind I saw DavidPoz (Youtube) connect the AC IN of his Growatt to utility mains in a video, and it worked.

I just want to be 100% sure that there are no stray voltages, shorts, or bonding no-nos.

At this precise point in time I'm not 100%.


Attached is a diagram of my connections so far:

You're good. The transformer with the path to ground takes care of it. It wasn't clear you had that at the outset, or I wouldn't have confused you. For paranoia's sake, check for voltage between transformer ground and mains ground before connecting.

 

[Struc]

Unless I'm losing my mind I saw DavidPoz (Youtube) connect the AC IN of his Growatt to utility mains in a video, and it worked.

Looks like Mr. Breakfast answered most of it, but...

I'm not sure David Poz ever hooked up an input to it in any of his videos, but he certainly mentioned you could. Pretty sure he only hooked up batteries and solar. I could be wrong.

The 240v input will charge batteries, or run the loads when you don't have solar/battery power, etc. All kinds of options in the settings on how the grid power will interface with the unit.

 

[uzernaam]

What I'm afraid of is since 240V AC in the USA isn't a 0V Neutral and a 240V hot, but rather a pair of 120V hots in opposite polarity, it would be equivalent to feeding the neutral AC input terminal of the inverter with 120VAC instead of 0V. If this terminal looks like a short to ground because of being bonded, then I can't use the AC input at all in the USA without an isolating transformer.

What the inverter expects:
G L N
0V 230V 0V


What I have:
G L N
0V -120V +120V