Rejuvenated Aluminum GreenHouse - saved from the scrapyard.

[OffGridForGood]

I have been working (slowly) on modifications and installation of a 1960's Aluminum Greenhouse frame.
Occationally I have mentioned the Greenhouse in other threads and I few members have asked if I wouldn't mind sharing some of the process and progress on the forum. This sub-forum seemed appropriate - but if the Mods wish, move it to chit-chat/where it belongs.
The motivation:
We have a small greenhouse already but it is not easily controlled. We use it strictly for starter plants that will go into the garden each year.
What I really wanted was a larger greenhouse, with insulated glass units to allow extending the season and doing more than just starters.

A number of years ago, I was working on a large public building and noticed a glazing crew setting up to remove a huge skylight. The sealed glazing units were not very old it seemed and after some discussion I learned they were planned for replacement due to some underlying issue with the framing system. The glazing company indicated disposal of the old glass was actually a cost for them - tipping fees at the landfill. I offered to take the glass 'for free' as long as they didn't break them during removal. Some did break during removal but I ended up with several hundred panels, about 2-feet x 4-feet. I stored them in a seacan I have.

More recently I was offered the aluminum framework from a 1960's greenhouse - no glass - just the main arches and purlins, cost was just to match what the scrap value was on it. I checked over the pieces and there was no deterioration, so picked it all up.
This Greenhouse was covered with 1/4" single pane glass - super inefficient in my part of the globe. But I had this idea: modify it to suit those sealed units in the seacan.

Okay - this is the teaser, I will see if anyone follows this thread, and if interested I will make regular postings on the process and progress.
So that is where this all started, picking up the Aluminum, and dreaming...

 

[ohmboy]

I myself have been known to recycle aluminum. Cans that is.

 

[chopper]

I have been working (slowly) on modifications and installation of a 1960's Aluminum Greenhouse frame.
Occationally I have mentioned the Greenhouse in other threads and I few members have asked if I wouldn't mind sharing some of the process and progress on the forum. This sub-forum seemed appropriate - but if the Mods wish, move it to chit-chat/where it belongs.
The motivation:
We have a small greenhouse already but it is not easily controlled. We use it strictly for starter plants that will go into the garden each year.
What I really wanted was a larger greenhouse, with insulated glass units to allow extending the season and doing more than just starters.

A number of years ago, I was working on a large public building and noticed a glazing crew setting up to remove a huge skylight. The sealed glazing units were not very old it seemed and after some discussion I learned they were planned for replacement due to some underlying issue with the framing system. The glazing company indicated disposal of the old glass was actually a cost for them - tipping fees at the landfill. I offer to take the glass 'for free' as long as they didn't break them during removal. Some did break during removal but I ended up with several hundred panels, about 2-feet x 4-feet. I stored them in a seacan I have.

More recently I was offered the aluminum framework from a 1960's greenhouse - no glass - just the main arches and purlins, cost was just to match what the scrap value was on it. I checked over the pieces and there was no deterioration, so picked it all up.
This Greenhouse was covered with 1/4" single pane glass - super inefficient in my part of the globe. But I had this idea: modify it to suit those sealed units in the seacan.

Okay - this is the teaser, I will see if anyone follows this thread, and if interested I will make regular postings on the process and progress.
So that is where this all started, picking up the Aluminum, and dreaming...
View attachment 240145

I would like to follow the progression, Thanks for sharing.

 

[yodamota]

would like to see how this goes. I often look for any aluminum angle. Always on the look out for broken aluminum ladders...
Recently got some aluminum from a truck bed. Went around the top edge..

 

[OffGridForGood]

ok, it seems this may be of some interest.
Here goes.

The original GH was heated all winter every year, and was clad with 1/4" single pane glass.
The roof pitch is 6:12 and with heating there was really never any snow accumulation because it would slide off.
For my use though, I don't plan to heat it during the depth of winter meaning snow could collect.
The sealed glass units I have are quite heavy - at least five times the weight of the original glass.

So I did some math, for the arch span, and the arch spacing.
To suit the glass I have, reducing the arch spans from 36 feet to 28 feet not only cuts a lot of snow/glass load off the structure, it also reduces height and will allow the glass I have to fit with room for an operable vent along the ridge of the GH.
So I got to work cutting the main arch sections - trimming off 4-feet from each side of the peak, and re-drilling holes to suit the connector plates.



I used a scrap block of wood and a metal cutting skill-saw (with blade for aluminum) and carefully marked each piece and cut it off at the same angle as the original.
Then using one of the connector plates as a template, I clamped a short piece of angle iron to the connector plate to hold it at the same off-set as the original joint. - the alum beams from each half of the arch don't touch at the peak, this is a 3-pin-arch so only the connector plates span the peak. Then I drilled the holes.


And for those wondering, yeah, I was able to leave all the pieces on the trailer while I cut and drilled each, one by one. Just moved them from one side to the other as each was cut and prepared. That way the pieces were at a comfortable height for working, and I didn't need to off-load and reload all the material - getting older so have to work smarter!

Edit: and YES! all tools shown were powered or charged via SOLAR - no Utility electrons were harmed during the making of this project...

 

[OffGridForGood]

After getting the rigid frames cut and re-drilled I confirmed the total span by laying two halves on the ground, bolting up the connector plates at the peak, and measuring the lower (parallel) sides - all good total out to out of 28-feet exactly.
My property has bedrock down just 30-36 inches - solid Canadian Shield - so for foundations I just dig to the rock, then drill and grout in some rebar directly into the rock. Then I set a sonotube over the rebar and pour concrete piers to suit whatever I am building. The shallow rock can be a pain sometimes, but for foundations it is like a 3-million- sq mile "footer"

I poured all the piers and set 5/8" L-bolts (anchor bolts) into each pier spaced to match the base plate holes.
Next up - standing the main frames.
This was done by bolting up the two halves, with each arch base near the pier. Then lifting the peak with my log loader plus an extension added to make it reach high enough for the frames.
Took a few pictures showing how I lifted the frames without hiring a boomtruck - or killing myself...



The Berco (my log loader) has a 2" truck receiver I bolted onto the last gusset plate near the grapple - then I made a few extensions out of 2"x2" aluminum box section to give me a few options for more reach, but less load capacity. The normal use for this trailer is collection of logs for the sawmill or my firewood processor, but it has been a great piece of equipment for everything from lifting these frames to hoisting solar panels to the roof of the shop.
Four of the five arches standing. The last arch is not ready, as it is the gable end and is made of lighter channel rather than H-beam material. Will stand it later once everything else is set level and braced.
Time to put the purlins between them - before a windy day comes along...

 

[OffGridForGood]

The original GH had 1/4" plate glass and was supported by specially made aluminum extrusions to support it, and allow a clamping extrusion to attach over top of the glass. The supports rested on top of the purlins and together lined up with the top of the main arch section surface.
I didn't pickup the original support extrusions for two reasons: they were far too light for my plans, and they were caked in adhesives that would require a lot of clean up before using them.
Pricing new aluminum channels for supports knocked me over when I saw the quotes, so in the end decided for this project treated wood will be the way to go, even though it means some extra work to separate the treated material from the aluminum with EPDM.
With a support material picked out, I could decide how I wanted to line up the purlins with the arches: the original offset the purlins, so the top of purlin was lower than the top of arch member by the thickness of the glass support extrusions. Using wood supports, it would be best to have the purlin line up with the top of arches flush. That way all the supports would lie on top of purlins or arches and line up in one level plane.
The original GH had the main arches 10'-5" on centre, to allow for five 2' wide glazing units plus an inch for each support extrusion and cap.
I wanted the arches closer together to carry the higher snow/glass loads, and the sealed glass units I have are 25.5" wide, so by using four instead of five, I ended up with the arches at 8'-7.5" (103.5") on centre with space allowed for my own capping method.
All this lead to a number of evenings processing the 40, 3" aluminum I-beams from 125" into 103" sections with new hole locations to line up with the top flange of the arch beam.

 

[ohmboy]

Edit: and YES! all tools shown were powered or charged via SOLAR - no Utility electrons were harmed during the making of this project...

Very fitting for a DIY solar forum.

The original GH had 1/4" plate glass and was supported by specially made aluminum extrusions to support it, and allow a clamping extrusion to attach over top of the glass. The supports rested on top of the purlins and together lined up with the top of the main arch section surface.
I didn't pickup the original support extrusions for two reasons: they were far too light for my plans, and they were caked in adhesives that would require a lot of clean up before using them.
Pricing new aluminum channels for supports knocked me over when I saw the quotes, so in the end decided for this project treated wood will be the way to go, even though it means some extra work to separate the treated material from the aluminum with EPDM.
With a support material picked out, I could decide how I wanted to line up the purlins with the arches: the original offset the purlins, so the top of purlin was lower than the top of arch member by the thickness of the glass support extrusions. Using wood supports, it would be best to have the purline line up with the top of arches flush. That way all the supports would lie on top of purlins or arches and line up in one level plane.
The original GH had the main arches 10'-5" on centre, to allow for five 2' wide glazing units plus an inch for each support extrusion and cap.
I wanted the arches closer together to carry the higher snow/glass loads, and the sealed glass units are 25.5" wide, so by using four instead of five, I ended up with the arches at 8'-7.5" (103.5") on centre with space allowed for my own capping method.
All this lead to a number of evenings processing the 40, 3" aluminum I-beams into 103" sections with new hole locations to line up with the top of arch.



View attachment 240470

Looking good!

 

[OffGridForGood]

Very fitting for a DIY solar forum.

Looking good!

Thanks ohmboy,
Next up a lot of: set tape caulking, carefully position glass unit, repeat.
I put up six more glass panels today before the rain started.

And last night I finally took a mini-exc and pulled the high-side down, and built up the low side earth, since I am on a bit of a grade here.
The natural grade at the NW corner is about 24 inches higher ground than the SE corner.
More pics will follow when the rain stops.

I also bought some aircraft cables - so I can remove my rachet straps and install permanent diagonal bracing.

 

[OffGridForGood]

Raining out, can't do any of my favourite projects: Time to plan more solar...for the GH ?
Here are some of my ideas, what do you think?
The ridge line runs due North/South and will end up 35 feet long - the glass will stop about 2 feet short of the ridge each side, and the idea is to make operable vented sections for the ridge line, to provide ventilation and allow excess heat to escape. What if I use solar panels built into operable frames for the ridge vent? Some smaller Wattage panels are narrow, maybe I can make up something to suit the dimensions?

 

[OffGridForGood]

I did some searching and there are serval options for some small-ish PV panels that would work to make a ridge vent cover, and do double duty as some solar PV for the GH. The ridge runs due North-South.
The current idea is to install the PV panels and re-purpose one of my MPP 6048's into the GH permanently to make 120/240 power for lighting, watering, operating vents, monitors etc. GH stuff. With 120-240 available in the GH, I could easily send power back to the main ESS via 240v AC instead of long runs of DC cable, which is not a trivial thing since the main solar power plant is 400 feet or so from the GH. This leads back to my interest in Sodium batteries - the wider temperature range they can tolerate compared with Lithium cells - too bad the voltages don't work very well with Sodium. Yet.

 

[Sparks-n-Splinters]

Very cool! That's quite the under taking. I like your thought on using the GH system to help power the main ESS. And kudos on all the repurposing of materials. I'm tuned in and looking forward to your progress.

 

[OffGridForGood]

Very cool! That's quite the under taking. I like your thought on using the GH system to help power the main ESS. And kudos on all the repurposing of materials. I'm tuned in and looking forward to your progress.

Thanks @Sparks-n-Splinters, -Sometimes I wonder if my ideas are greater than my available time & energy (ie getting old sucks! LOL)
I can only work on the GH after my regualar day is done, and weekends. Sometimes I get a few small items prepared during the day if I can spare some time.
Framing up for the next section of glass, but rain is coming.

 

[42OhmsPA]

This is awesome.
Following.

I need to find more land...

Sometimes I wonder if my ideas are greater than my available time & energy (ie getting old sucks! LOL)

It just takes longer because we are more precise. Lol

 

[Sparks-n-Splinters]

I feel ya on the great ideas. But it sure does make you feel accomplished when a project is finished and put to use. I've got a green house build in mind, but it'll have to wait until the barn is finished, the house is built and the garden is fenced.
Keep up the good work!

 

[OffGridForGood]

It just takes longer because we are more precise. Lol

I am going to use this phrase - with permission...

I've got a green house build in mind, but it'll have to wait until the barn is finished, the house is built and the garden is fenced.
Keep up the good work!

You looking over my shoulder ?? - I am putting up a new Barn while working on the GH, but at least the garden got fenced first, -the Deer would consume the whole works in a night or two otherwise! - in the backdrop of the GH pics you may spot some dwarf goats inside a fenced area - that is my garden expansion for next year and it is their job to gobble up any grass and saplings - although they seem more interested to watch me put up glass by myself, and beg for attention. LOL.
There is no end to the work and the plans, that is certain.
If I am not building a project, then I am planning one, although I gotta admit, I am getting "more precise" (slower) these days.

 

[BudT]

Subscribed. Those old greenhouses are cool. My aunt and uncle had one when I was a kid. I helped a buddy dismantle one a few years back, pretty tedious to say the least. Looks like the one you scored is commercial grade, I'm jealous.

 

[Sparks-n-Splinters]

We just bought our land, so starting from scratch. since the 9th of May we've cleared about an acre of 42 trees built the roof of 1/2 our barn (Had to get some workspace with shade) set up compost bins and a few raised beds. septic, and the list goes on. No end of projects that's for sure.

The only animal starring at us is a couple mountain lions., from the look in their eyes, I don't think they are vegetarian.....

That's going to be one great looking GH when your done!

 

[OffGridForGood]

We just bought our land, so starting from scratch. since the 9th of May we've cleared about an acre of 42 trees built the roof of 1/2 our barn (Had to get some workspace with shade) set up compost bins and a few raised beds. septic, and the list goes on. No end of projects that's for sure.

The only animal starring at us is a couple mountain lions., from the look in their eyes, I don't think they are vegetarian.....

That's going to be one great looking GH when your done!

Thanks, for the encouragement, a homestead is a pile of work S-n-S, -great to hear ya got a good start on your own spread.
I will tell you, we started 23 years ago on this journey - and it hasn't ever felt "finished" yet. lol.
Not saying ya got 23 years of work to do, just the way it went for us, raising our kids along the way, and that working far away thing I did.
I will say it is very satisfying to work hard for yourself, and see the results, no matter the schedule, life's a journey...

-No mountain lions here, (thank-goodness!), we have black bears, coyotes, wolves Lynx, Pine Martens. (damn Martens...they got a taste for my Turkeys)

 

[OffGridForGood]

It just takes longer because we are more precise. Lol

surfing the DIY Solar Forum for endless hours...enjoying every minute of it too!

 

[Sparks-n-Splinters]

Thanks, for the encouragement, a homestead is a pile of work S-n-S, -great to hear ya got a good start on your own spread.
I will tell you, we started 23 years ago on this journey - and it hasn't ever felt "finished" yet. lol.
Not saying ya got 23 years of work to do, just the way it went for us, raising our kids along the way, and that working far away thing I did.
I will say it is very satisfying to work hard for yourself, and see the results, no matter the schedule, life's a journey...

-No mountain lions here, (thank-goodness!), we have black bears, coyotes, wolves Lynx, Pine Martens. (damn Martens...they got a taste for my Turkeys)

23 years and it does not sound like you have burnt out. Glad to hear your still at it! Many have tried to tell me "it's not worth all the work", or I'll be burnt out before the end of the first year.

I could not agree more about the satisfaction of working hard for yourself. It is a sense of accomplishment and freedom I think more folks should strive for.

No martens here, but the rest are here along with feral hog. 400 lbs of wild bacon!! heard them twice now and charged into the woods to find them only come up empty. Still learning their habits.

Anyway, my hat is off to you for a successful homestead. looking forward to watching your green house poject