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Revo II tripping breakers when 2 or more are in use

I'm just curious.
In the USA you use 4 wires yes?
L1(load), L2, N (neutral) and ground.
L1 =+120
L2 =-120 correct?

Outside the Americas they (we) use 2, maximal 3 wire.

We have L (Just Load, no + or -) and
have N (just Neutral, not ground!)
Additional safety can be ground wire, what is using the residual current device.
Usually used in wet room (bathroom) and kitchen / shed.
Most locations in de house have just 2 wires.
New homes do have 3 all over.
2 wires are considered to be safe for appliances, upto 2000 watt, unless it's to be used in wet room /kitchen /outside the house. (Where it possibly can get wet)
For those locations we have the residual current device that will safe your life if you accedently come in touch the Load wire (and the appliance is grounded)
(I talk about malfunctioning due to water or other error)

Sure a breaker will flip also on the other locations in that situation, but much much slower, you could be dead before it flips.

That's outside Americas.

Reading more and more about "your" style, it almost looks like you make a combination of ground and neutral wire, and name it mixed up what ever suits best at that time.

For the rest of the globe, ground and neutral are 2 different wires, both with own colour code, and usage.

Do you have 3 or 4 wires to a power socket?

If it's 3:. L1/L2 and ???
Ground/Neutral combo?

Then I start to understand where the confusion comes from.
You use 2 names for the same wire.
"We" don't.
"We" have 2 wires.
For AC or DC.
AC an L and N
DC an + and -
Both + and L are considered "hot"
Both - and N are considered "safe"

And a ground wire for the residual current device.

Only reason I'm mixing ground and neutral is to describe tests on OP's system, which has green ground wire going to (what I think is) neutral in his breaker panel.

Our wiring does vary by location, but typically 3 wires from the utility pole, fed by a center tapped transformer.
Center we call "neutral" and tie to a busbar. Usually we ground it (except maybe if utility had grounded it.) Neutral doesn't go through the meter.
The two end leads of the transformer are "hot", we might call them L1 and L2. Each goes though the meter to measure current and voltage. We put the through a main breaker and then attach individual or dual breakers.
The busbar at the main panel doubles as the ground busbar. It wires to outlets, so a fault in an electric drill to case sends current back through that wire, keeping voltage of case safe about zero and tripping the breaker.

If we have additional sub-panels, neutral and ground are separate in those, so neutral currents never go through ground wires.

We also have 3-phase. Utility has 3 separate transformers, not on the same core like a center-tapped transformer. They can be wired together as delta (for 480V typically), or 120/208Y. In the latter case, utility drop looks the same except it has one more wire L3. Each of L1, L2, L3 still has 120V to neutral, but now they are at 120 degrees rather than 180 degrees phase to each other. Voltage between any two is 208V.
 
Well that def has got me rethinking that one. I guess I'm going to have to call the company up and ask em exactly how much power can it handle.
I can tell you exactly:
The transformer can process 120V x 28A = 3360VA.
If you use it to feed a sub-panel and never draw more than 28A from either phase, you can't go wrong (as far as it's loading.)
If you draw more than 28A from one phase, e.g. 48A, that will ONLY work if you draw at least 20A from the other phase. 48 - 28 = 20.
 
no I am not feeding the grid. You have to be approved in this area and have to have the right equipment to do so. I have the settings turned off on the unit to keep it from backfeeding.

My aims 10k was always hooked up to the grid and used it to charge my batteries and power part of my home and shop.

Since the unit can do 100 amps at 240volt I'm probably gonna stick with that since it is meant for solar. Even though the square D transformer will probably work just fine and give no problems. Just doesn't look as good on the wall with all the other solar equipment
I really want to know if the inverter has a 2-pole relay that disconnect both "L" and "N" during grid failure, or if it only disconnects "L".
I could trace the photos you posted to see it had a pushbutton breaker only for "L".
Can you locate the relay that it uses to disconnect from grid, see if it interrupts both or just one?

That is going to make all the difference in the world whether this inverter backfeeds the grid during a power failure or not.
Used as intended in "Europe" (and the rest of the world who started using utility electricity after we Americans invented it ;) ), with "N" being neutral, it should be fine. But fed with L1 & L2 and used for either 120V or even 240V appliances in the US, I can come up with multiple ways for it to electrocute a lineman if it doesn't isolate all poles.


(You'd think, with hydraulic power, the British would have invented the gasket. but no; they may have invented the Motorcycle, but the Japanese invented the gasket.)
 
You already start making a huge mistake at the moment you talk about "But, the neutral (which should be grounded)"

Perhaps in the USA.
If you use 3 wires and share the grounding wire and neutral.

In the rest of the globe do NOT EVER ground a neutral!!!!!


Back to the "manual"

"Consider for example a 30A 120/240V split phase supply.
The supply could be the grid, a generator or two stacked inverters.
Some of the loads connected are 240V, others are 120V. On each 120V leg the load should not exceed 30A. The
problem is that as soon as 120V loads are connected, the two legs will show a different current. This is because
the 120V loads on the two legs will never be balanced. A 120V 1200W hairdryer, for example, will draw 10A from
one leg. A 120V washing machine could even draw in excess of 20A from one leg. Between the two legs the
difference in current, or current unbalance, will therefore often be 20A or more. This means that the 30A supply
will not be used up to its full potential. By the time one leg draws 30A, the other leg may be drawing no more
than 10A, and increasing the 240V load, for example, will result in an overload of one leg while the other leg still
has spare capacity.
Theoretically, the total power that can be drawn from a 30A 120/240V supply is 30 x 240 = 7,2 kVA.
In case of 20A unbalance, the practical maximum will be 30 x 120 + 10 x120 = 4,8kVA, or 67% of the theoretical
maximum.
The solution is an Autotransformer.
By leaving the neutral of the split phase supply unused, and connecting an Autotransformer to create a new
neutral, as shown in figure 1, any load unbalance is ‘absorbed’ by the Autotransformer.
In case of a 30A supply, the load can be increased to 7,2kVA, and a 20A load unbalance will result in one leg
supplying 40A, and the other leg 20A. The 20A difference will flow through the neutral and the windings of the
Autotransformer. The current through both 120V wires of the split phase supply will be 30A
.

If I translate it to my "other side of the globe" understanding, they (Victron) acknowledge the possible problem for unbalance, and tell that the solution is their autotransformer.

Now, in their example they use 20A imbalance as the bottleneck.
It would be totally idiotic to make a device for 100A that increase the "problem number 20A" to just 28A.

I know we Duch* people see solutions where others see problems.
(Victron and I both are from the Netherlands)

I'm quite positive that you misread their information.
Or perhaps a Dutch way of writing that doesn't match USA way of thinking.

Additional 8A is not "the solution"
That would be not a solution at all!!

I'm positive that there is a lot more different under the hood then just the circuit breaker (what doesn't add an additional kilo)

I'm sure your local Victron sales representative can explain if you are limited to 28A or you can use 100A.

If it is 28A, using just 1 watt on 120v would limit the unit to 28*240= 6720 watt,+1 from the 120V.

That would be totally stupid and ridiculous design.

Victron have a good name for a reason.

Even if we don't fully understand how it works, you can be assured that if they state you can use 100A, total.
Being 1A at 240 and 99A at 120 volt, or the other way around.
Automatically balance...
That wording does imply 99.5A potential usage on 240 volt and 0.5A (60 watts) on 120volt.

We better let Victron explain in a way that is more clear for you.

For me it's clear enough what it can and can't do.

100A max, no matter 120 or 240volt, on what difference.
Continue about 90%
 
I really want to know if the inverter has a 2-pole relay that disconnect both "L" and "N" during grid failure, or if it only disconnects "L".
I could trace the photos you posted to see it had a pushbutton breaker only for "L".
Can you locate the relay that it uses to disconnect from grid, see if it interrupts both or just one?

That is going to make all the difference in the world whether this inverter backfeeds the grid during a power failure or not.
Used as intended in "Europe" (and the rest of the world who started using utility electricity after we Americans invented it ;) ), with "N" being neutral, it should be fine. But fed with L1 & L2 and used for either 120V or even 240V appliances in the US, I can come up with multiple ways for it to electrocute a lineman if it doesn't isolate all poles.


(You'd think, with hydraulic power, the British would have invented the gasket. but no; they may have invented the Motorcycle, but the Japanese invented the gasket.)
Some about the Revo II.

It have one pole breaker on the power in line (aka grid)
IMG_20201129_094136_copy_750x1000.jpgIMG_20201129_094316_copy_750x1000.jpgIMG_20201129_094128_copy_750x1000.jpg

To satisfy this question.

Not USA use only L and N, no L1 and L2.
And N is not ground.
It's neutral :)
 
In US house wiring, we do ground the neutral. At a single point.

It would be totally stupid and ridiculous design to take a 100A transformer and sell it as a 32A (28A continuous) transformer. But their 100A model and their 32A model are the same weight, to within 1 kg.

Victron is offering to let you have 100A of 240V loads, or various 120V loads, but never more than 28A (continuous) imbalance between 120V loads on one phase and 120V loads on the other phase. If you only stick one 20A or two 15A on each phase you'll be OK. If you put more than that and load them unevenly, the transformer will heat up and disconnect power.
 
Some about the Revo II.

It have one pole breaker on the power in line (aka grid)


To satisfy this question.

Not USA use only L and N, no L1 and L2.
And N is not ground.
It's neutral :)
If the Revo assembled for OP also has a one-pole breaker interrupting only the wire labeled "L" and not the wire labeled "N", it is a safety problem to use in the US, fed by 120/240V split phase (a center-tapped 240V transformer on the utility pole, with center-tap grounded.)

If OP connects a (non-isolating) autotransformer to that and creates 120/240V split-phase, with centertapped neutral grounded (as is required in the US), the system will backfeed into the utility grid during power failures.

If he connects a 240V appliance to the Revo and it conducts any current to ground, either because it has a fault, or because he plugs in a dryer with 3-prong plug, it will backfeed the utility grid. (New dryer outlets are 4-wire with L1, L2, N, ground. Old ones have L1, L2, ground, but they power the motor between Lx and ground.)

When used to power a 240V circuit during a blackout, the one of L1, L2 which goes to "N" of the Revo would be held at ground potiental (by utility transformer and all the neighbors appliances.) The other of L1, L2 would carry 240VAC. His 240V appliances would be happy, but any surge arrestors which protect against > 200V to ground would trigger. They may catch fire, may trip the breaker, may backfeed the grid by driving voltage into "N" of Revo.

Not good to use a Europe/rest of world device for US grid connection. Especially when it is an electric generator which has to disconnect from the grid, and when it deliberately sources power into the same wires that go to the grid (while trying not to backfeed.)

It's my job to see problems.
That's the only way to avoid running into disasters, and perhaps finding solutions before experiencing the problems.
 
In US house wiring, we do ground the neutral. At a single point.

It would be totally stupid and ridiculous design to take a 100A transformer and sell it as a 32A (28A continuous) transformer. But their 100A model and their 32A model are the same weight, to within 1 kg.

Victron is offering to let you have 100A of 240V loads, or various 120V loads, but never more than 28A (continuous) imbalance between 120V loads on one phase and 120V loads on the other phase. If you only stick one 20A or two 15A on each phase you'll be OK. If you put more than that and load them unevenly, the transformer will heat up and disconnect power.
That's what you are reading from the white paper.

I'm reading that you can do 99A on 120 and 1 A on 240 or any other possible combinations, as long as the total of 100A is not exceeded.

If you are right it's totally useless product.

Having any small 120V load would choke the 240 to absurd level.
 
If the Revo assembled for OP also has a one-pole breaker interrupting only the wire labeled "L" and not the wire labeled "N", it is a safety problem to use in the US, fed by 120/240V split phase (a center-tapped 240V transformer on the utility pole, with center-tap grounded.)

If OP connects a (non-isolating) autotransformer to that and creates 120/240V split-phase, with centertapped neutral grounded (as is required in the US), the system will backfeed into the utility grid during power failures.

If he connects a 240V appliance to the Revo and it conducts any current to ground, either because it has a fault, or because he plugs in a dryer with 3-prong plug, it will backfeed the utility grid. (New dryer outlets are 4-wire with L1, L2, N, ground. Old ones have L1, L2, ground, but they power the motor between Lx and ground.)

When used to power a 240V circuit during a blackout, the one of L1, L2 which goes to "N" of the Revo would be held at ground potiental (by utility transformer and all the neighbors appliances.) The other of L1, L2 would carry 240VAC. His 240V appliances would be happy, but any surge arrestors which protect against > 200V to ground would trigger. They may catch fire, may trip the breaker, may backfeed the grid by driving voltage into "N" of Revo.

Not good to use a Europe/rest of world device for US grid connection. Especially when it is an electric generator which has to disconnect from the grid, and when it deliberately sources power into the same wires that go to the grid (while trying not to backfeed.)

It's my job to see problems.
That's the only way to avoid running into disasters, and perhaps finding solutions before experiencing the problems.
I agree that it's not the best buy to use outside USA electricity generating equipment inside the USA and VV.

Especially when connected to the grid.

Stand alone, having only 240v appliances, and wire in the not USA way but the way the generator provide the power, "all" 240v will be happy.

If there are 120v appliances, and/or the wiring is not in the way of the generating device the autotransformer can be a local, not attached to the grid solution.

Adding the grid in this makes it complex to be able to follow all safety regulations.

If the generating device (Revo II in this situation) just feeds the autotransformer, there are no issues.

Recieving also power from the grid would probably require additional equipment.
I know of a special switch to go on or off grid ( blackout / brown outs)
But not both.

I'm sure there must be ways to make it work.

It would include an autotransformer, but also additional to prevent the grid to feed the Revo II, and the Revo II from feeding the grid.

Possible a "extra smart" autotransformer?

Victron should be able to tell how it can be made working within all regulations and be safe for users and equipment.

That is beyond my knowledge.

In June/July @Bleedingblue and I talked about the Revo II, and how I do like them.
I did inform them they are only 220-240 volts, not for standard USA.

I understood he was using just 240v, and no backfeeding to the grid.

If the Revo II just spits out his 240 and receive not USA stile 240v , equipment should work.

I'm not sure how to convert split phase 240 to non USA .

But the Revo II should not receive split phase.

It's output is not split phase, but 240 on load and 0 on neutral.

That could be converted again to split phase for the home.

If OP doesn't care about charging from the grid, the Revo's doesn't need it.

I don't use grid at all, except our own :)

That would probably be my setup.
Have the heavy users on the Revo II and let the LPG generator charge the battery if it goes to low.
That can be just lead acid settings, 48v.
It's charging and using at the same time, and the Revo II can set the battery level on what the generator should stop.

For low power stuff use the grid.

It's not difficult to have dedicated line from the Revo II to the air-conditioning units and hydrophonic system.

The rest are "peanuts".

Making the whole house compatible is making it a lot more complex.

OP have solar, 2 wind turbines and LPG generator for alternative energy, besides the grid.

Alternatively would AC to DC charger if he doesn't want or can use the LPG generator.

The "dry gen" start signal can be used to activate USA AC to 48v DC charger.

Not ideal, but in most cases the additional charge is not needed.
LPG, as it's already is available, would be the best option
 
It's my job to see problems.
That's the only way to avoid running into disasters, and perhaps finding solutions
Yes, thank you for this. (Not sceptical, really)

My job to see challenges and not problems :)

Together, while we often disagree, make a good team to provide working safe solutions.

Lucky we both do agree that the current setup is not ideal, and should not have been connected to the grid in the first place.

The installer made it work, probably beyond the local regulations and specifications of the Revo II.

I'm still amazed it did work.

@Bleedingblue
Can you tell what's wrong with the dead unit?
 
That's what you are reading from the white paper.

I'm reading that you can do 99A on 120 and 1 A on 240 or any other possible combinations, as long as the total of 100A is not exceeded.

If you are right it's totally useless product.

Having any small 120V load would choke the 240 to absurd level.
What are you reading? have a link?

Small load is OK. The 100A/32A model could still power a 60A 240V load together with a 120V 28A load. Just not one 120V 40A load.

More from the datasheet I linked:

"Ground relay for use with Multi or Quattro Inverter/Chargers included
When operating in inverter mode, the neutral output of the inverter/charger must be connected to ground to guarantee proper functioning of a GFCI. In case of a split phase supply the neutral must be grounded. For this purpose a grounding relay is built in the autotransformer’s enclosure. The relay is controlled by the 230/240V Multi or Quattro. (The internal grounding relay in the 230/240V Multi or Quattro must be disabled)

Temperature protected
In case of overheating, the Autotransformer is disconnected from the supply. Reset is manual.

An alternative to stacked inverters
The alternative to stacking two 120V inverters to provide a 120/240V split phase supply is a 240V inverter with an additional Autotransformer.

Two stacked 120V 3kVA inverters will supply up to 25A to each 120V leg. If the load on one leg is less than 25A, the maximum load on the other leg is still limited to 25A.

One 240V 5kVA inverter with a 32A Autotransformer will supply up to 21A of balanced load to each 120V leg. Fewer loads on one leg will however result in more power being available on the other leg, with a maximum unbalance of 32A. Therefore the load can be up to 38,5A on one leg if the load is not more than 3,5A on the other leg (maximum unbalance: 38,5 – 3,5 = 35A). If load unbalance is to be expected, a lower power 240V inverter with autotransformer will therefore be preferable to the stacked inverter solution."


Note this Victron document talks about connecting neutral to ground.

Note "maximum unbalance of 32A"
 
Yes, thank you for this. (Not sceptical, really)

My job to see challenges and not problems :)

Together, while we often disagree, make a good team to provide working safe solutions.

Lucky we both do agree that the current setup is not ideal, and should not have been connected to the grid in the first place.

The installer made it work, probably beyond the local regulations and specifications of the Revo II.

I'm still amazed it did work.

@Bleedingblue
Can you tell what's wrong with the dead unit?
Good chatting/debating the topic with you. We might spot something the other missed.

Oh by the way, I work for the Dutch. It seems I have skills they need.

An isolation transformer, 240V in, 120/240V out could work for him safely.
A 120/240V auto-transformer (at least if with grounded neutral, a feature that Victron provides) would backfeed the grid during power failures.
Without grounded neutral, his electrical outlets would have neutral driven to 120VAC and line either zero or 240VAC. GFCI would interrupt "line" but leave "neutral" hot at 120V, capable of electrocuting him.
 
I dont understand why we are debating the use of an autotransformer....I mean that sounds like the gold plated option for throwing good money after bad and not useing the same money to replace the hardware with stuff that is actually meant to run on US standards.
 
Good chatting/debating the topic with you. We might spot something the other missed.

Oh by the way, I work for the Dutch. It seems I have skills they need.

An isolation transformer, 240V in, 120/240V out could work for him safely.
A 120/240V auto-transformer (at least if with grounded neutral, a feature that Victron provides) would backfeed the grid during power failures.
Without grounded neutral, his electrical outlets would have neutral driven to 120VAC and line either zero or 240VAC. GFCI would interrupt "line" but leave "neutral" hot at 120V, capable of electrocuting him.
I agree.

I don't know USA style.

"We" have a main entry of the grid.
Usually protected by one 32A breaker that is sealed.

This is for regular household.

After this 32A the involvement of the company that delivers "grid" stops.

We split it into groups, each of them protect by 16A Breaker.
At 220v, that's roughly 3500 watt maximal.

Normal household have one or two groups for kitchen, 2 groups for washer and dryer.
Living room different group, 1/2 of the bedrooms (together 2 groups)
Bathroom one group and shed/ outdoors one group.
If one device have a problem, only one breaker flips, the rest of the house still have electricity.

Larger households work the same, except they have 2 x 32A going into the home.

Even larger would be 3 X 35A, also known as 3 phase.

Like I wrote, I like to think in solutions.
It's not difficult to make one or more group getting only electricity from the Revo II, and one or more grou getting only from the grid.

There are switches that automatically fall over when there is no power, and connect to the alternative source.

While normally used to connect generator when the grid goes down, it just as well can connect to the grid when the generators go down.

This way th the power from the Revo is isolated from the rest of the home, and when the batteries are empty, the switch makes it fall back to the grid.

No need for autotransformer.
No losses.

And the Revo II does what it was bought for, power the hydrophonic system and air-conditioning units.

The rest of the house just stays normal to the grid :)

As easy as possible.

Yes, if you need 120v in the hydrophonic system, you would need to make additional line to the greenhouse for 120v.

As long as you don't join the 2 different lines... Not a problem at all.
They (Revo II and grid) doesn't know that the other exist.

No power into the Revo II.
Only power out.
 
We used to have a fusebox. 30A 120/240V service, four 30A fuses.
Then upgrade to 50A breaker panel.
Then upgrade to 100A breaker panel.
Then upgrade to 200A breaker panel.
Now California is in the process of banning evil natural gas. All houses (not just some) built in the future will be 100% electric, water heater, stove, furnace, everything.
First year after that kicked in, utility grid collapsed. They hadn't even decommissioned the natural gas peaker plants they planned to.
Our children will be shivering in the dark. The promised Global Warming can't come fast enough.

You don't lead the world in electric consumption, or per-capita consumption.
But neither does the US. Apparently China leads in total, and Iceland in per-capita:

 
I dont understand why we are debating the use of an autotransformer....I mean that sounds like the gold plated option for throwing good money after bad and not useing the same money to replace the hardware with stuff that is actually meant to run on US standards.
One inverter is about 560 USD, exclusive shipping and tax.

There are 5..

Additional unit $650, if needed at all.

Why not throw away the perfect good functional Revo II??

Perhaps because they cost over $3000, and are capable of delivering +25kw together.

Unless you like to sponsor...
That is a really good reason ?
 
We used to have a fusebox. 30A 120/240V service, four 30A fuses.
Then upgrade to 50A breaker panel.
Then upgrade to 100A breaker panel.
Then upgrade to 200A breaker panel.
Now California is in the process of banning evil natural gas. All houses (not just some) built in the future will be 100% electric, water heater, stove, furnace, everything.
First year after that kicked in, utility grid collapsed. They hadn't even decommissioned the natural gas peaker plants they planned to.
Our children will be shivering in the dark. The promised Global Warming can't come fast enough.

You don't lead the world in electric consumption, or per-capita consumption.
But neither does the US. Apparently China leads in total, and Iceland in per-capita:

You might not have heard from it, but the Netherlands are having earthquakes... Way to many.
Human created by pumping out Gass from the soil...

Guess what? No pressure means that the earth will collapse in that location...

I hope not totally...
It is resetting, the damage is about the whole North of Netherlands.

So, all new homes in Netherlands are being equipped with only electrity, no longer Gas

All the homes in the north are slowly changed to electricity only.

The rest probably will follow.

Funny fact: we are still taking gas out if the soil!!!
Sure not as much as it used to be.
But still...

I don't know how things work for oil field.
But for gas... The soil will re-settle, and all buildings on top of that soil will have issues.

Netherlands have sand and clay soil.
Rocky soil probably will be fine.

Sounds to me that someone looked at Netherlands and decided to be ahead of this desaster.

All went well for +60 years or so.
"We" made billions selling the gas.

Now it costs billions.
Some villages have 70% of the houses damaged, 20% beyond repair and unsafe to live in...

My friend needed to leave her (rental) home after she discovered cracks.
Diagnostic took months, once finished, she needed to leave within 24 hours....
First a hotel, then temporary home.
That was last year.
Her new home should be ready summer 2021.

Hotel, relocation, and all was paid by the house company, who will collect from the Gass company and the state..
 
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I can tell you exactly:
The transformer can process 120V x 28A = 3360VA.
If you use it to feed a sub-panel and never draw more than 28A from either phase, you can't go wrong (as far as it's loading.)
If you draw more than 28A from one phase, e.g. 48A, that will ONLY work if you draw at least 20A from the other phase. 48 - 28 = 20.


I called up Northern Arizona wind and solar who sells it. He told me that at max all the power it would do is around 14,000 watts. I would routinely go over that amount no problem in the summer.
So I ended up buying a 25kva transformer. Ya it was a lot higher but I need something to get going.
Yes, thank you for this. (Not sceptical, really)

My job to see challenges and not problems :)

Together, while we often disagree, make a good team to provide working safe solutions.

Lucky we both do agree that the current setup is not ideal, and should not have been connected to the grid in the first place.

The installer made it work, probably beyond the local regulations and specifications of the Revo II.

I'm still amazed it did work.

@Bleedingblue
Can you tell what's wrong with the dead unit?


Started beeping and throwing a code. It did not recognize any PV array maybe a couple hrs after paralleling them . Fault accurred after hooking everything up in parallel. Had everything cut off while hooking up though.
Fault only came on hooked up to PV. Turned the unit off with the switch underneath and the fault light cut off.

Erus told me that the IGBT on the main board is broken

20201017_092234.jpg
 
Why not throw away the perfect good functional Revo II??
1) I'm not suggesting you throw them away, selling them on ebay to an overseas market were they are designed to be used would be my first choice
2) they are not "perfectly good functional" Revo units.
 
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