diy solar

diy solar

RV setup

Rhavin

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May 19, 2022
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Hello everyone. I am working on planning a solar setup. I have little knowledge beyond the very basics for this stuff, but I like DIY and learning. I got a quote from an installer who wants 18k for a battle born/victron setup. I realize most of that is equipment cost. I got to watching some of Will’s videos, and being a beginner I am interested in the all-in-one setups. I have attached a photo of my planned diagram. If anyone is willing to take the time to look it over and let me know if I’m close, off the mark, tips, etc. thanks.
 

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Looks good at the basic level shown. Although I recommend going with 24v batteries instead of 2x 12v in series.
Actually I just stuck with 12v to avoid step down and step up converters.
 
Looks good at the basic level shown. Although I recommend going with 24v batteries instead of 2x 12v in series.
Actually I just stuck with 12v to avoid step down and step up converters.
Thanks. Would a setup like this need any additional bus bars or fuses between the batteries or solar and the all-in-one?

Why 24v batteries instead of in series?
 
What kind of RV and what is currently installed?
That's going to help determine what voltage you need to run.
In my case, we were already deep in 12v gear, so I kept it 12v, as it was easier to deal with.

Just looking at the diagram, I'd go with an all in one inverter that included the transfer switch, and just put a automatic surge protector in front of the shore connection. That would simplify the wiring and give integrated control, fewer boxes, fewer connections, less points of failure.

If you are going to cut and crimp your own cables, I'd go as large as you can. Resistance in the wires turns your battery power into heat on the trip to the inverter, the larger the cable, the lower the resistance and less loss in the connection. And if you decide to increase your output or battery bank, it's already there waiting on you.

Nothing wrong with BattleBorn but you could buy 2-3x the amount of storage for what they cost.
 
$18k is ridiculous.

But before you get started buying anything, we need more info on what you have
What kind of RV and what is currently installed?
That's going to help determine what voltage you need to run.
In my case, we were already deep in 12v gear, so I kept it 12v, as it was easier to deal with.

Just looking at the diagram, I'd go with an all in one inverter that included the transfer switch, and just put a automatic surge protector in front of the shore connection. That would simplify the wiring and give integrated control, fewer boxes, fewer connections, less points of failure.

If you are going to cut and crimp your own cables, I'd go as large as you can. Resistance in the wires turns your battery power into heat on the trip to the inverter, the larger the cable, the lower the resistance and less loss in the connection. And if you decide to increase your output or battery bank, it's already there waiting on you.

Nothing wrong with BattleBorn but you could buy 2-3x the amount of storage for what they cost.
This is very important. If you get this wrong, it will cost a fortune in returned kit. If we can get all the details, we can make sure you only have to buy things once.

Year/Make/Model of RV
What type of shore power connector? 30A or 50A
Do you have any fancy load management system on the AC side?

We'll start with those and see where that goes.
 
What kind of RV and what is currently installed?
That's going to help determine what voltage you need to run.
In my case, we were already deep in 12v gear, so I kept it 12v, as it was easier to deal with.

Just looking at the diagram, I'd go with an all in one inverter that included the transfer switch, and just put a automatic surge protector in front of the shore connection. That would simplify the wiring and give integrated control, fewer boxes, fewer connections, less points of failure.

If you are going to cut and crimp your own cables, I'd go as large as you can. Resistance in the wires turns your battery power into heat on the trip to the inverter, the larger the cable, the lower the resistance and less loss in the connection. And if you decide to increase your output or battery bank, it's already there waiting on you.

Nothing wrong with BattleBorn but you could buy 2-3x the amount of storage for what they cost.
It’s a ‘17 grand design momentum 397. The ems, ats, and genny are already in place. The rv is a 12v system. But listening to will prowse, he talks up the 24/48v systems as superior due to cost and efficiency. I just obviously need to add a step down converter (I assume between the all in one and the distro panel?). Im not dead set on battleborn, as long as I can find a good product. Leaning towards Weize for 12v, and signature solar makes a nice (I think?) 24v server rack battery but they are 1700 each for 200ah.

I’m trying to design a system that I can DIY without killing anyone that also won’t cost me $10k+, at that price point I could let the installer do it.
$18k is ridiculous.

But before you get started buying anything, we need more info on what you have

This is very important. If you get this wrong, it will cost a fortune in returned kit. If we can get all the details, we can make sure you only have to buy things once.

Year/Make/Model of RV
What type of shore power connector? 30A or 50A
Do you have any fancy load management system on the AC side?

We'll start with those and see where that goes.
’17 grand design momentum 397
50a shore power
There is a load management system, i haven’t touched it in the 3 months we have had the rv.
There is a progressive industries EMS hardwired
 
Ok, this is good info. Basically, you have a trailer that is bigger (and nicer) than my first apartment. Nice!

While it is fun to jump right into the bits and pieces, you should complete the energy audit first so we can size the system accordingly.

https://diysolarforum.com/resources/system-energy-audit-and-sizing-spread-sheet.12/

That will help us size the system. Don't get hung up on 12/24/48V just yet.

As an example, my system is 1200W solar --> 400Ah 12V batteries --> 3000W inverter/charger. This works great for occasional aircon, and can run anything in my 5er but not more than one big load at once.

If you want to run aircon more, you'll want a much bigger system. If you never need aircon, maybe something smaller will work.

So let's get that energy audit done and then start designing! It is fun to plan, install and then use a well designed solar setup.
 
Ok, this is good info. Basically, you have a trailer that is bigger (and nicer) than my first apartment. Nice!

While it is fun to jump right into the bits and pieces, you should complete the energy audit first so we can size the system accordingly.

https://diysolarforum.com/resources/system-energy-audit-and-sizing-spread-sheet.12/

That will help us size the system. Don't get hung up on 12/24/48V just yet.

As an example, my system is 1200W solar --> 400Ah 12V batteries --> 3000W inverter/charger. This works great for occasional aircon, and can run anything in my 5er but not more than one big load at once.

If you want to run aircon more, you'll want a much bigger system. If you never need aircon, maybe something smaller will work.

So let's get that energy audit done and then start designing! It is fun to plan, install and then use a well designed solar setup.
I am heading to sleep (dang night shifts). But I just recently paid my electric at my campground and we averaged 48.8kwH for the month. I get that is probably beyond the scope of rv solar, but gives you an idea. It has 3 AC and we do a lot of microwave/crockpot cooking as well as a washer and dryer. If we could ideally run 2 of those big loads at once in addition to say some internet, tv/video games, and cell phone chargers that’s the goal; or at least an endgame even if I can’t get that out of the gate.

I will do the audit on Monday (my next day off)
 
I am heading to sleep (dang night shifts). But I just recently paid my electric at my campground and we averaged 48.8kwH for the month. I get that is probably beyond the scope of rv solar, but gives you an idea. It has 3 AC and we do a lot of microwave/crockpot cooking as well as a washer and dryer. If we could ideally run 2 of those big loads at once in addition to say some internet, tv/video games, and cell phone chargers that’s the goal; or at least an endgame even if I can’t get that out of the gate.

I will do the audit on Monday (my next day off)
That is doable, a 200Ah 24V battery should handle you, now getting enough solar to keep 5kWh/day charged on a trailer may be tricky.
 
I am heading to sleep (dang night shifts). But I just recently paid my electric at my campground and we averaged 48.8kwH for the month. I get that is probably beyond the scope of rv solar, but gives you an idea. It has 3 AC and we do a lot of microwave/crockpot cooking as well as a washer and dryer. If we could ideally run 2 of those big loads at once in addition to say some internet, tv/video games, and cell phone chargers that’s the goal; or at least an endgame even if I can’t get that out of the gate.

I will do the audit on Monday (my next day off)
Coolio. Get some rest and report back. We will be standing by. We love to help other people spend money on a good system. Most folks buy the parts first and then come on and ask how to hook it up not knowing they already have the wrong parts.
 
be sure that you are ok with the limitations of an AIO unit before you commit. No AIO unit I know of does power sharing. (The ability to set a limit for incoming amps and add inverter power to make up the difference) this is a huge deal if you plan to do a lot of “moochdocking”. Because of how an AIO works you either need a oversize generator (about double the inverter specs) or a inverter generator or creative power management to avoid damage to the AIO unit. The monitoring system for AIO units tends to not be as nice as a more expensive moudular system.

Since I started writing this you posted som more information. If your present situation of full hookups is intended to be your normal arrangement a AIO will work quite well. Make sure your charge profile matches the size of your generator so you don’t damage the AIO under heavy loads and you should be good. I setup my travel trailer with a 3500w AIO (it matches my 30amp service almost perfectly) we have been using it since September of 2021. I have used it with FLA batteries and now Lithium batteries. I have 5000 watts of batteries and 2100 watts of solar.
Try to get as much solar on the camper as you can. Panels are cheap and once you have the layout designed and all your materials in place it’s not that much harder to put on 10 panels than 2. I have never heard anyone say I wish I didn’t have so much solar power on my roof.
 
FWIW, Victron will let you "power assist" the incoming circuit if you need additional amps.

Does your Grand Design use Power Levelers? If so are the 12V?
Just trying to understand how many 12V loads you have to deal with.
If it's just a few, then going 24 or 48 and stepping down for the 12v loads would be fine.
I would have liked to have done that in ours, but there were just too many 12V loads to deal with.
 
FWIW, Victron will let you "power assist" the incoming circuit if you need additional amps.

Does your Grand Design use Power Levelers? If so are the 12V?
Just trying to understand how many 12V loads you have to deal with.
If it's just a few, then going 24 or 48 and stepping down for the 12v loads would be fine.
I would have liked to have done that in ours, but there were just too many 12V loads to deal with.
Yes it has power levelling. I’m fairly sure it’s 12v, I can operate them without shower power or the truck?

If so, it’s just the levelers, exhaust fans, and some lightning I believe.
 
I will interject that the easiest integration for a 50A RV will be a Victron Multiplus II which is only 12V right now. The MPII has a 50A pass through and know how to handle a single phase 30A input from shore power. They are coming out with a 24V version later this year if you are willing to wait.
 
I will interject that the easiest integration for a 50A RV will be a Victron Multiplus II which is only 12V right now. The MPII has a 50A pass through and know how to handle a single phase 30A input from shore power. They are coming out with a 24V version later this year if you are willing to wait.
Is there a way to send an all in one through the ATS and bias the ATS to shore power, the AIO, then the genny?
 
In general, the Genny will take priority once it's running.
Out of the box most inverters will stick to shore until you fire up the genny.
That part is usually just a relay based circuit so it's easy to build.
You'd start on shore since it's effectively "unlimited" if you lost shore, it would start using the batteries and when you hit the selected threshold on the batteries the Automatic Generator Start (AGS) would fire up the genny to handle the house loads and charge the batteries.
 
Ok, this is good info. Basically, you have a trailer that is bigger (and nicer) than my first apartment. Nice!

While it is fun to jump right into the bits and pieces, you should complete the energy audit first so we can size the system accordingly.

https://diysolarforum.com/resources/system-energy-audit-and-sizing-spread-sheet.12/

That will help us size the system. Don't get hung up on 12/24/48V just yet.

As an example, my system is 1200W solar --> 400Ah 12V batteries --> 3000W inverter/charger. This works great for occasional aircon, and can run anything in my 5er but not more than one big load at once.

If you want to run aircon more, you'll want a much bigger system. If you never need aircon, maybe something smaller will work.

So let's get that energy audit done and then start designing! It is fun to plan, install and then use a well designed solar setup.
Here’s the audit. Either I did something, or we use a ton of energy (I think I know which).

Had to upload as a screenshot as incouldnt get the file to upload due to format.
 

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If you live in this full time and run it like a house, then you should size and plan accordingly. 48V system for starters.
 
be sure that you are ok with the limitations of an AIO unit before you commit. No AIO unit I know of does power sharing. (The ability to set a limit for incoming amps and add inverter power to make up the difference) this is a huge deal if you plan to do a lot of “moochdocking”. Because of how an AIO works you either need a oversize generator (about double the inverter specs) or a inverter generator or creative power management to avoid damage to the AIO unit. The monitoring system for AIO units tends to not be as nice as a more expensive moudular system.

Since I started writing this you posted som more information. If your present situation of full hookups is intended to be your normal arrangement a AIO will work quite well. Make sure your charge profile matches the size of your generator so you don’t damage the AIO under heavy loads and you should be good. I setup my travel trailer with a 3500w AIO (it matches my 30amp service almost perfectly) we have been using it since September of 2021. I have used it with FLA batteries and now Lithium batteries. I have 5000 watts of batteries and 2100 watts of solar.
Try to get as much solar on the camper as you can. Panels are cheap and once you have the layout designed and all your materials in place it’s not that much harder to put on 10 panels than 2. I have never heard anyone say I wish I didn’t have so much solar power on my roof.
I re-read your post. Help me understand. With an AIO, what happens if I just wire the ATS to the AIO and then to the dist panel? Does it fry the AIO? My gen is an onboard 5500w generator (you mentioned in your post).
 
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