Schneider EG4_LL Integration

[MaikaiLife]

Hello everyone!

I've had quite a lot of interest in adding these Schneider Insight devices to Schneider solar installations that don't have them. Many of the clients have either EG4 Lifepower or EG$_LL V2 batteries, and without the Insight they can't make SOC determinations for starting the Generator or system shutdown etc.

Anyways, I've successfully gotten the Insight to work with the Conext XW+, the XWPro and with both of the EG4 battery types LifePower4 and EG4_LL V1 and V2.

However, I'm running into an issue and I'm hoping the community might be able to help me.

I have a installation let's call it "site 3" and at this site, the owner has a Connext XW+ with 6 EG4_LL V2 batteries. I have the Insight Home with firmware 1.18 which I believe is required to support EG4 batteries in closed loop. (I'm realizing that the download below the one I have highlighted says XW+ systems )



Anyways... everything is working pretty good, the system is reporting SOC from the batteries and it's able to be accessed via the mobile and website versions of Insight cloud.

The issue I have is that when I enable the BMS to control the charge controllers the system shuts down saying it's exceeding the discharge value.

When I enable this.


I get this.


The challenge is when I look at the BMS data we're clearly way less than the maximum discharge current of 400 amps.


The unit then shows this error and shutdown power to the loads.

On the systems with the XWPro, I have this enabled and there is no issue, so I'm confused at why it doesn't work with the "Connext XW+" inverters also.

Anyways, if anyone has run into this before or has any ideas I'd really appreciate the help.

Thank you!

 

[MaikaiLife]

Where are all the Schneider folks?

 

[MaikaiLife]

Well, the feature that seems to be causing the issue is this, which works fine with XW Pro.



But then in the release notes I found this, not a "hard" don't do it, just a recommendation.


So maybe I just live with leaving that feature disabled. At least the SOC is working on the Gateway and passing it through to the other components.

 

[MaikaiLife]

Just a bump in the list, I know there are other folks on here with Schneider and I would love to hear any stories you've had with the Insight and the XW+ or Pro.

 

[jzampieron]

I just went through this with my system. Don't use that option. It doesn't quite propagate the settings correctly.

Here's what I discovered (the hard way):

1. Schneider MPPTs (the 100-600, etc.) don't understand SOC. Period. They don't.
2. That "MPPT Matches BMS settings" option pre-sets some of the Charger Values.
3. SOC control is only used for the XW Pros internal Charger (and other settings).

See: https://diysolarforum.com/threads/s...h-lifepower4-rack-xw-pros.89828/#post-1200843 for the full story.

I would strongly recommend using the Lifepower Comm Hub if you aren't already.

 

[MaikaiLife]

I just went through this with my system. Don't use that option. It doesn't quite propagate the settings correctly.

Here's what I discovered (the hard way):

1. Schneider MPPTs (the 100-600, etc.) don't understand SOC. Period. They don't.
2. That "MPPT Matches BMS settings" option pre-sets some of the Charger Values.
3. SOC control is only used for the XW Pros internal Charger (and other settings).

See: https://diysolarforum.com/threads/s...h-lifepower4-rack-xw-pros.89828/#post-1200843 for the full story.

I would strongly recommend using the Lifepower Comm Hub if you aren't already.

Interesting, I have always set the charge profiles on the custom on the charge controllers.
Bulk: 56.2, ABS: 56.2 and FLOAT: 54.2 with absorption for 120 minutes.

This setting never seemed to override the custom charge settings, but it also never caused a fault in the XP Pro units so I figured I would just leave it on. In the end, I turned it off and all is working well.

I’m not using the HUB as the batteries speak fine with the inverter which then lets the system use SOC for important things like generator control.

Anyways…. Thanks so much for your assistance. I really appreciate it.

 

[jzampieron]

Interesting, I have always set the charge profiles on the custom on the charge controllers.
Bulk: 56.2, ABS: 56.2 and FLOAT: 54.2 with absorption for 120 minutes.

Those are the same values I use... right from the battery manual.

This setting never seemed to override the custom charge settings, but it also never caused a fault in the XP Pro units so I figured I would just leave it on. In the end, I turned it off and all is working well.

That's what that "MPPT matches BMS settings" option does. It overrides the MPPT Charger settings and grays out the custom voltages. That's why you have to turn it off.

I’m not using the HUB as the batteries speak fine with the inverter which then lets the system use SOC for important things like generator control.

I like having the hub as a display on the wall of my mechanical room. I have it connected to the Insight Facility to do SOC control for some things.

Anyways…. Thanks so much for your assistance. I really appreciate it.

No worries. It was a fight getting the XW Pro system dialed in. Some of the options have weird un/semi-documented interacting effects and it made for a lot of trial and error.

 

[MaikaiLife]

Another oddity I noticed was the mobile app, on the XW+ for some reason it took nearly 2 weeks for the charge controllers to show up and enable the display of the Solar panels.

In the mobile app it looked like this.



Then suddenly for no apparent reason, nearly two weeks later it looks like this now.


And now, suddenly all the firmware data is visible for the devices.


I dunno if this has been your experience, but it seems like there are little hampsters working in the background that take weird and unpredictable amounts of time to show all the data in the Cloud, yet the status page on Insight says it's all connected, green lights end-to-end.

 

[jzampieron]

I dunno if this has been your experience, but it seems like there are little hampsters working in the background that take weird and unpredictable amounts of time to show all the data in the Cloud, yet the status page on Insight says it's all connected, green lights end-to-end.

I don't have my Insight Facility connected to Insight Cloud so I can't help there.

Frankly, I don't trust Schneider's firmware not to have a ton of cyber vulnerabilities. Their FW and communications update schedule is way too slow to have any kind of serious cyber risk management/mitigation strategy.

I haven't scanned their SBOM, but looking at the versions of some of those libraries in the InsightLocal gui, I'm sure there's more than a few CVEs.

Better to keep it air-gapped.

 

[MaikaiLife]

I’ve had ongoing concerns with Schneider’s approach to solar, including the slow pace, limited documentation, and the general lack of product and software updates to support their deployed equipment. As a result, I haven’t found them to be an emerging solar provider that stands out.

However, many of my clients were sold this equipment through other providers. While the equipment works, the primary requests are automating generator start-up based on SOC and being able to monitor their systems remotely. All of these installations are entirely off-grid, using Starlink for internet. Given the issues these clients have experienced over the years, their hesitation to fully trust the system is understandable—they want the reassurance and visibility a mobile app provides.

I currently have at least 3, potentially 5-7 more clients with Schneider systems lacking insights, who are eager to get mobile app monitoring and SOC tracking. Now that I’ve successfully integrated Insight 1.18 with both the XW+ and Pro, I plan to replicate this setup. For an investment of about $400 in hardware, on top of the $40k they’ve already invested, upgrading with Insight to modernize their installation is a clear win.

I appreciate all the conversations, as there are few installers in my area who are willing to dive into manuals and forums to find real solutions for clients—rather than just selling new equipment to avoid learning something new.

 

[MaikaiLife]

I don't have my Insight Facility connected to Insight Cloud so I can't help there.

Frankly, I don't trust Schneider's firmware not to have a ton of cyber vulnerabilities. Their FW and communications update schedule is way too slow to have any kind of serious cyber risk management/mitigation strategy.

I haven't scanned their SBOM, but looking at the versions of some of those libraries in the InsightLocal gui, I'm sure there's more than a few CVEs.

Better to keep it air-gapped.

I do have a question about the Insight facility, is it actually quick and responsive? The Insight home seems like it has an original iPhone processor or less in it, it's very slow to boot and even moving between pages etc sometimes takes a while for the screen to painfully paint downward.

 

[jzampieron]

I do have a question about the Insight facility, is it actually quick and responsive? The Insight home seems like it has an original iPhone processor or less in it, it's very slow to boot and even moving between pages etc sometimes takes a while for the screen to painfully paint downward.

Boot time: Is a couple minutes or so.
Response time: I mean it's not super-snappy, but its not painful either. It doesn't bug me to use it.

I have managed to somehow crash it a few times. Can't exactly reproduce it.

 

[MaikaiLife]

Boot time: Is a couple minutes or so.
Response time: I mean it's not super-snappy, but its not painful either. It doesn't bug me to use it.

I have managed to somehow crash it a few times. Can't exactly reproduce it.

Are you using an external power supply or the XANBus for power? Sorry for all the questions, but there aren't many folks actually deep into these Insight devices and I have so many experiences that I've never been able to talk to anyone about.. lol I need Schneider therapy.

 

[jzampieron]

Are you using an external power supply or the XANBus for power? Sorry for all the questions, but there aren't many folks actually deep into these Insight devices and I have so many experiences that I've never been able to talk to anyone about.. lol I need Schneider therapy.

I'm using the Xanbus for power.

I'm not sure that's a great idea, but it was easy.

I should probably rig up a straight to my batteries DC-DC thing with a power switch, but it's good enough at the moment.