Shenzhen Basen vs Shenzen Luyuan Lifepo4?

Stepandwolf

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BTW, did BASEN shipped the cells from warehouse in Southern California or from other state? My replacement came from Southern California.
6300 Valley View St, Buena Park, CA 90620 No known tenant of the building but it is valued at #30M. The box came from KDS
 

Stepandwolf

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I didn't. I capacity tested mine after I hooked them up in series and relied on the BMS's results as well as a cheap DROK that uses a hall effect sensor. They were within a couple amps of each other and I ended up being happy with the results considering what I paid for the cells.

You could do the same as I did and if you are not happy with the results then you might need to capacity test the weak cell(s) if you were looking to get a resolution from Basen.
I haven't even hooked up the BMS...and the BMS isn't hooked to anything....all just parts at this point. I assumed the BMS had to actually be in a circuit, not just connected to the battery negative.
 

Stepandwolf

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OK guys...huge news...I asked Basen for clarification on what they shipped me. I have to say that Basen has been very communicative throughout the process. What happened next astounded me.

1. I am being told these batteries are identified on the QRC properly as what they are, LF280 model, not N, K, or alphabet soup. She provided a spec sheet for the LF280. Shows they were designed in 3/18, but she says they were made 6/24/21.

2. She said the date code is no longer interpretable. I suspect EVE knows what the code interprets to, but is not made public.

3. drum roll.....to further prove what she says I was sent, she sent me a section of a spreadsheet including the cell I had given her the QRC for.

eve lf280 spreadsheet.jpg

She shared this section of the spreadsheet with the arrow pointing to the cell I had given her the QRC for. The header is in Chinese, so you brainiacs can figure out what the other columns tell us. I assume the first column is the amperage, i.e. 291.9221. She says this spreadsheet is straight from EVE, presumably provided with the shipment.

4, The boxes were labeled XX/100. She gave me the FULL spreadsheet which shows the complete order was for 2000 cells. So, Basen bought 2000 cells, and then tested and repackaged 200 of them and sent them to the CA warehouse. The labeling on all of the boxes shows them being XX/100.

You can see the consistency in the cells based on actual EVE testing.

Has any other supplier provided the actual mfg testing data? I haven't seen anything like this before, but then I am a newbie.

I wish the sales people had accurate data on what they were selling. There has been a lot of consternation on my part due to the confusion on what I thought I was going to get vs. what I did get.

So, for whatever value it is, that is the current state of the world, as it turns.
 

Just John

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Has any other supplier provided the actual mfg testing data? I haven't seen anything like this before, but then I am a newbie.

Yes, I have the test results for the grade A cells I purchased.

They can say whatever they want, the 280 without the suffix hasn't been manufactured since early 2019. Feel free to ask Eve if you don't believe me. Nothing wrong with old new cells, provided they aren't used and were stored properly. Did you actually receive these cells?
 

Stepandwolf

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Yes, I have the test results for the grade A cells I purchased.

They can say whatever they want, the 280 without the suffix hasn't been manufactured since early 2019. Feel free to ask Eve if you don't believe me. Nothing wrong with old new cells, provided they aren't used and were stored properly. Did you actually receive these cells?
Yes, I have the cells.....Basen has said all along these were made in June and she referenced the top of the spreadsheet which says 6/24, but I don't know Chinese to read the whole thing.
"6月24日 JQ-0462 出货数据(2000pcs)"
 

Stepandwolf

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Yes, I have the test results for the grade A cells I purchased.

They can say whatever they want, the 280 without the suffix hasn't been manufactured since early 2019. Feel free to ask Eve if you don't believe me. Nothing wrong with old new cells, provided they aren't used and were stored properly. Did you actually receive these cells?
It was suggested I contact EVE. I found that they have a US location in OH. They are now closed for the day. So, I thought I would check and see what they have for sale. I went to their LFP page and guess what, they are selling a LF280. Not a N or a K, a (blank). They had a link to the datasheet. The data on their datasheet exactly matches the Product Specification I received from Basen... The product spec sheet is far more detailed, but every item on the EVE USA data sheet matches exactly the product spec sheet from Basen.

Do you think EVE USA is selling 2019 old stock?
 

Gazoo

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The USA website looks the same as when I looked at it over a year ago. Their office is located somewhere in this building. Good luck.
 

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Stepandwolf

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The USA website looks the same as when I looked at it over a year ago. Their office is located somewhere in this building. Good luck.
So...that could be old information....I wrote them, will see what they say.
 

Just John

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Yes, I have the cells.....Basen has said all along these were made in June and she referenced the top of the spreadsheet which says 6/24, but I don't know Chinese to read the whole thing.
"6月24日 JQ-0462 出货数据(2000pcs)"
It is certainly possible that they just didn't put on the suffix. Until the latest version, they "new" models were essentially the same (I'm sure there are minor internal changes, formulations, etc). The latest that they started producing this August are just a tiny bit taller. It is quite likely they may have gotten a very good deal on the cells produced just before the switch. If they work well, don't worry about it.

The real grade A cells get matched at the factory for capacity and IR, in groups of up to 16 (48v), and from my limited experience will have the capacity printed on the QR sticker. What that does is makes charge and discharge very even and uniform in a battery pack. Bulk cells that aren't matched will work just fine for what we are doing, you will get some cell deviation, but keep the charge/discharge rate down (we mostly do, who wants a 1 hour battery) and you'll be fine with bulk cells. They are a great value for our use case. Like I said, I have 16 bulk cells myself, and they work fine, however two only measured out to 268AH rather than 280, the rest all measured 274AH or above. That means the weakest cells is what you get for capacity. If buying bulk cells, order a couple of extra, I wish I had. Buying matched grade A cells, no need.

When you watch what battery packs do with matched cells during charge/discharge, the difference is pretty significant if you watch cell differential voltages (some people get really hung up about that). Bulk cells will vary more, and especially at high charge/discharge rates will have very different cell voltages.
 
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Nikg736

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Aug 21, 2021
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Dang! I really opened a Pandora's Box here didn't I?

Ironically, for now, I think I might just do some lead batteries. I know, I know...heavier and less usable capacity than lifepo4 etc. Worse than lifepo4 in every way possible.

However, I have found a local guy selling a couple of 100ah deep cycle batteries that are only 4 months old and barely used. The story on them sounds legit and I can get them for under $200. That price for a total of 200ah of brand-name deep cycle I figure is worth it to get me started and should be sufficient for now.

Also, this will allow me the flexibility to not worry about waiting months for shipping and trying to get a good deal on lifepo4 probably from China. Now that Covid is starting to rage on again, I think we are going to see more and more supply issues over the next 6 months.
I'm curious to see what happens to pricing within the next year. On the one hand, prices apparently have gone down in the last few years due to larger production volumes. However, it is now far more expensive to ship things globally and materials prices are going up as well. At this point I am hoping to get those lead batteries and then just monitor what happens in the lifepo4 space. I'm thinking the lead will get me through at least a year as we see what unfolds.
 

Stepandwolf

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Dang! I really opened a Pandora's Box here didn't I?
Yes, sometimes a thread can take off, but in this case, it was still related to the message subject.

I would be fine having a topic specific to my battery issue but don't think there is a way to move the content from here to there?
 

BobFlyer

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Aug 25, 2021
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That used to be the case but I don't think it is now. You can contact EVE for pricing by going to their Alibaba page. Don't mention any other supplier when contacting them. A few things to ask:

1: Are the cells capacity matched and will you provide the test data?

2: Do the cells come with laser welded studs and if not how much extra will that cost?

3: Cost of shipping?

4: Warranty and what do you do in the event a cell does meet up to specs during the warranty period.

Then compare to what Amy is offering and make your decision. Now that we can get cells capacity matched with test data, and laser welded studs, it's the best way to go IMO. Having said that I have the utmost respect for Amy and would consider her to be a great supplier. I have never ordered from her but watched what she did when she was with Xuba and I liked the way she handled things then, and I like the way she handles things now that she has her own company.

Also there is no reason to buy a BMS from the same supplier selling cells other than maybe convenience. Just because a good supplier isn't selling BMS's should not deter you from ordering cells from them. I don't use a Daly BMS so I can't comment on that. But I will say buying capacity matched cells can relieve headaches. My BMS will cut off before my inverter because my cells are not capacity matched. It should be the other way around.

Thanks for the info: I have been looking for sources for either 105ah EVE cells or the 280ah cells to make a solar generator.
I just finished getting a quote from EVE direct per the link. Here are the results

105 ah quote, ship to USA 32408 Florida, via UPS and with handling charge.
2021-09-04 10:35
cost for 4pcs 105ah:
product cost:46.9*4=187.6usd
DG package certificate and UN box:49.6usd
shipping cost by UPS:325usd

Total for 105ah 4ea of 105 cells is $562

cost for 4pcs 280ah:
product cost:125.5*4=502usd
DG package certificate and UN box:49.6usd
shipping cost by UPS:468usd

Total for 280ah 4cells $1019.60

Shipping and handling IMO is unrealistic compared to cell costs.
I have asked for alternate shipping other than UPS but not available until Monday.

Cell prices are attractive shipping is a deal breaker so far?
Thanks to all for great info.
 

Just John

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Thanks for the info: I have been looking for sources for either 105ah EVE cells or the 280ah cells to make a solar generator.
I just finished getting a quote from EVE direct per the link. Here are the results

105 ah quote, ship to USA 32408 Florida, via UPS and with handling charge.
2021-09-04 10:35
cost for 4pcs 105ah:
product cost:46.9*4=187.6usd
DG package certificate and UN box:49.6usd
shipping cost by UPS:325usd

Total for 105ah 4ea of 105 cells is $562

cost for 4pcs 280ah:
product cost:125.5*4=502usd
DG package certificate and UN box:49.6usd
shipping cost by UPS:468usd

Total for 280ah 4cells $1019.60

Shipping and handling IMO is unrealistic compared to cell costs.
I have asked for alternate shipping other than UPS but not available until Monday.

Cell prices are attractive shipping is a deal breaker so far?
Thanks to all for great info.
I can add I purchased 8 of the 105ah cells (matched grade A) from Amy for approximately $520 (slightly under) including shipping, taxes, and Alibaba fees in April. Well worth the money.

EVE really would rather not sell to us. Amy gets the cells from EVE, but has committed to buy a quantity each month. You will receive the test reports for each cell from EVE.

Message Amy on Alibaba chat and get a quote. You will be very satisfied with the quality, and will not receive bloated used cells, but you pay for it.

Thread 'Introducing the New & Improved Shenzhen Luyuan Technology Co.' https://diysolarforum.com/threads/introducing-the-new-improved-shenzhen-luyuan-technology-co.15880/
 
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Stepandwolf

Solar Addict
Joined
Nov 14, 2020
Messages
635
Thanks for the info: I have been looking for sources for either 105ah EVE cells or the 280ah cells to make a solar generator.
I just finished getting a quote from EVE direct per the link. Here are the results

105 ah quote, ship to USA 32408 Florida, via UPS and with handling charge.
2021-09-04 10:35
cost for 4pcs 105ah:
product cost:46.9*4=187.6usd
DG package certificate and UN box:49.6usd
shipping cost by UPS:325usd

Total for 105ah 4ea of 105 cells is $562

cost for 4pcs 280ah:
product cost:125.5*4=502usd
DG package certificate and UN box:49.6usd
shipping cost by UPS:468usd

Total for 280ah 4cells $1019.60

Shipping and handling IMO is unrealistic compared to cell costs.
I have asked for alternate shipping other than UPS but not available until Monday.

Cell prices are attractive shipping is a deal breaker so far?
Thanks to all for great info.
For my location in NM, Amy quoted $1246 shipped from China, and of course 2 months delivery. Instead, I bought the same cells from Basen USA for $1216 and they arrived in 7 days. Just finished load testing the "weakest" cell and it exceeded specs, so I woke up with a smile.
 

Posplayr

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May 27, 2021
Messages
145
For my location AZ 85704, I have an 8/21/2021 order into Amy for 32 LF280K for $126/cell plus shipping $4743 grade A matched cells (additional $140 credit card fees for AMX). They were to ship (to me 50-60 calendar days) last week but EVE apparently had a delayed shipment now expected to arrive this coming Monday. This was Friday morning status.

That is $148.21 per cell or the equivalent of $592.87 for 4.
 

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Posplayr

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More details about the order.
I will be able to do my parallel cell balancing based on the Factory measured cell capacity data so will not have to duplicate that effort because it comes with the matched cells.

 

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nekit

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Sep 3, 2021
Messages
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For my location in NM, Amy quoted $1246 shipped from China, and of course 2 months delivery. Instead, I bought the same cells from Basen USA for $1216 and they arrived in 7 days. Just finished load testing the "weakest" cell and it exceeded specs, so I woke up with a smile.
Can you share what your results from the load tests were? Thanks
 
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