Should I Stick With EG4?

[Konvett]

Hello everyone. I have had 3 major issues with my system in the last two and a half years of owning it and I'm trying to decide what to do next.
I have 2x EG4 6500EX inverters and 4x 48V 100Ah LifePower4 batteries which power my entire home.

1. A few months into having the system, I had a fatal error on my 2P1 inverter which bricked it and it had to be replaced by Signature Solar. I had to wait about a month in total for them to receive back my old inverter and then send me my new one. I was on grid power the entire time which in California is very expensive, as I'm sure you all know.

2. Within the last few months, I've noticed that Solar Assistant is showing my batteries (20 kWh bank) is hitting the 20% mark after using only 12kW. Signature Solar told me that I needed to deep cycle for 7 days which I did. I would see the batteries last much longer in this mode, going all the way down to 46V. Once I switched back to their recommended settings in BMS (EG4 mode), same thing. Getting roughly half of the expected life of the batteries.

3. Today, my power just cut out completely. I went to the inverters and all 4 batteries had the alarm light on and inverter 2P1 had error 32 while 2P2 had error bp. I tried turning off and turning back on the system. After a lot of testing with Signature Solar, they've told me that I will likely need to replace the inverters with the EG4 6000XP and will have to pay $750 per inverter even though my EG4 6500EX are both still under warranty.

All of this is causing me concern. I've been very wary of these inverters since the start because of the seemingly constant slew of errors (including a number of smaller errors not listed here). When the 12k came out, I got an email from Signature Solar offering me $750 in credit towards both if I gave up my warranty on them and bought the 12k. That gave me reason to believe that these inverters are known to be bad and they're trying to get all of them off warranty or bought back. But does this mean the new ones are more reliable? I watched Will Prowse's video on the 6500EX and he praised it up and down which is what gave me the confidence to buy it. He seems to be a big fan of the 6k as well, but what's to stop it from having the same or similar problems further down the road?

At the end of the day, I just want confidence for myself and the family that the power is going to work. I don't want to have to be out of my inverters for a month or longer while they're being repaired, warrantied, or something of the sort. I would love the advice of this forum on what you would feel safe doing in my situation.

 

[registered-bum]

I had issues with the (2x) EG4 6500EX .. bought those in a package deal with (6x) EG4 LL batteries and rack. I could only make those SOBs work by disabling all comms and running the inverters with battery type set to lead/acid.

For another chunk of change I was able to upgrade to the 6000XPs and other than inconsistent and chaotic manual/materials they have been ok.

I had hope to save some money with the AIO platforms, but the hassle and upgrade costs have been a real PITA. Nothing like throwing still more money at the solution, and going through the rip-and-replace with the inverters. So much fun. /s


To your question about confidence, the best answer from my experience - maybe?

 

[Q-Dog]

Only time will tell. That's the price you pay for being an early adopter.

 

[EPicTony]

I had the same inverters EG4-6500EX and 1 failed. I jumped on the upgrade program to Eg4-6000XP. The 6000's are night and day better than the 6500's. No flicker, easier to connect, generator input, battery cb all around better. I've been very happy with them so far.
My only gripe is they are wi-fi and connect to some Chinese servers. The way to avoid this is to only use the wi-fi for setup and maintenance (firmware updates) which is what I'm doing. The battery connection is can/485 and that works fine. In my opinion $1500 is a good deal to upgrade the 6500 junk to something that is way better. Also your 5 year warranty will reset to new.

 

[marionw]

Based on how long you have had the batteries I am assuming these ate the LifePower4 V1.
Download the BMS_Test software for your batteries from the EG4 website as well as the latest firmware v3.40.
Run the BMS_Test software, on the bottom right of the screen will be the firmware version, 3.37 or greater is good although I did update my six to v3.40.

Are you operating in closed or open loop.

With the BMS_Test software you can look at each battery noting cell voltages, alarms etc. Monitor the batteries while charging. You need to get as many cells as possible charged to 3.45vdc at which time the BMS will start balancing cells. Manage the charge voltage from your inverter to ensure no cell in any battery gets to 3.60vdc which is the Cell Over Voltage Protection setpoint. The Cell Over Voltage Alarm setpoint is 3.55vdc, reaching this is OK. If possible manage the charging voltage to get cells to at least 3.50vdc.

Need to make sure all batteries are getting fully charged and at times the BMS has a chance to balance cells.

I have an EG4 Chargeverter which at times I use to charge my six LifePower4 V1 batteries to ensure they are fully charged.

 

[Konvett]

I appreciate the advice here, I will make sure all my firmware is as up-to-date as possible.

I'm not familiar with closed/open loop. What does this mean and then I can answer?

 

[Adam De Lay]

I appreciate the advice here, I will make sure all my firmware is as up-to-date as possible.

I'm not familiar with closed/open loop. What does this mean and then I can answer?

Closed loop means that your inverter communicates with the batteries and the batteries control charging and discharging rates. (Option 5 on inverter set to EG4)

Open loop means there's no direct battery communication and the inverter relies on voltage to control charging and discharging. (Option 5 on inverter set to USE)

 

[Konvett]

I am in closed loop, EG4 mode.

Closed loop means that your inverter communicates with the batteries and the batteries control charging and discharging rates. (Option 5 on inverter set to EG4)

Open loop means there's no direct battery communication and the inverter relies on voltage to control charging and discharging. (Option 5 on inverter set to USE)

 

[Adam De Lay]

3. Today, my power just cut out completely. I went to the inverters and all 4 batteries had the alarm light on and inverter 2P1 had error 32 while 2P2 had error bp. I tried turning off and turning back on the system. After a lot of testing with Signature Solar, they've told me that I will likely need to replace the inverters with the EG4 6000XP and will have to pay $750 per inverter even though my EG4 6500EX are both still under warranty.

I have heard of cases where faulty 6500s have been replaced without being charged the standard "upgrade fee". If the hardware still works without issues, I can see the reason to charge for upgrading to newer hardware. In this case if the hardware is actually failing, it does seem like SS should stand by the existing warranty and upgrade the hardware for you. @SignatureSolarJess can you look into this one?

Being another one of those people that started with the 6500EXs, I can tell you that the 6000XP is night and day different. Completely different manufacturer and the quality is much better. The only downside is that you loose 500W of output power per leg (if you get 2 6000XPs). There are a lot more features built into the 6000XP than the 6500 as well. You can also use Solar Assistant on them.

 

[Konvett]

I have heard of cases where faulty 6500s have been replaced without being charged the standard "upgrade fee". If the hardware still works without issues, I can see the reason to charge for upgrading to newer hardware. In this case if the hardware is actually failing, it does seem like SS should stand by the existing warranty and upgrade the hardware for you. @SignatureSolarJess can you look into this one?

Being another one of those people that started with the 6500EXs, I can tell you that the 6000XP is night and day different. Completely different manufacturer and the quality is much better. The only downside is that you loose 500W of output power per leg (if you get 2 6000XPs). There are a lot more features built into the 6000XP than the 6500 as well. You can also use Solar Assistant on them.

Yeah, I walked through it with a tech rep and he said that the inverter itself is failing, seemingly shorted out, and the inverter only works in bypass mode.

 

[Quattrohead]

The Luxpower based inverters are superior to the 6500EX by a mile. Many of us here have abused the crap out of them and they love it !!!
I would put firm pressure on SS to replace them with a pair of 6000XP, maybe even a single 12000XP depending on your PV strings.
Batteries, check and update if you can. They may also be happier with a properly working inverter.

 

[Konvett]

I realize this isn't conclusive, but here's something I've noticed over the last few days. I've noticed my batteries are charging from the grid very early in the evening where usually I can go the whole night. The MPPT voltage has increased on inverter 2 (likely due to the weather getting colder here) and decreased on inverter 1 (the inverter with the issues). I have reviewed security camera footage to verify that there was no cloud cover or shading on the MPPT1 array. As I said, this isn't totally conclusive, but it could definitely be a sign of the inverter beginning to fail as early as six days ago.

 

[Adam De Lay]

View attachment 257062

I realize this isn't conclusive, but here's something I've noticed over the last few days. I've noticed my batteries are charging from the grid very early in the evening where usually I can go the whole night. The MPPT voltage has increased on inverter 2 (likely due to the weather getting colder here) and decreased on inverter 1 (the inverter with the issues). I have reviewed security camera footage to verify that there was no cloud cover or shading on the MPPT1 array. As I said, this isn't totally conclusive, but it could definitely be a sign of the inverter beginning to fail as early as six days ago.

There's a lot of variables that could account for the changes, so it's probably going to be hard to say that what you're seeing is an identification of premature failure. Unfortunately I've heard of way too many instances of the 6500s working one day and then they just fail the next.

 

[Konvett]

There's a lot of variables that could account for the changes, so it's probably going to be hard to say that what you're seeing is an identification of premature failure. Unfortunately I've heard of way too many instances of the 6500s working one day and then they just fail the next.

Yeah, I figured as much. Just something I noticed, seemed coincidental in terms of the timing. But I'm hoping Signature Solar doesn't make me pay for two new inverters since they don't make these anymore (obviously because of how often they fail).

 

[rogerheflin]

View attachment 257062

I realize this isn't conclusive, but here's something I've noticed over the last few days. I've noticed my batteries are charging from the grid very early in the evening where usually I can go the whole night. The MPPT voltage has increased on inverter 2 (likely due to the weather getting colder here) and decreased on inverter 1 (the inverter with the issues). I have reviewed security camera footage to verify that there was no cloud cover or shading on the MPPT1 array. As I said, this isn't totally conclusive, but it could definitely be a sign of the inverter beginning to fail as early as six days ago.

Can you add in a graph of the battery voltage to the state of charge? The voltage may show the SOC was wrong and the SOC being wrong seems to be a common design defect in a lot of BMSes. I have seen mine (not an EG4 BMS) hit 100% when the voltages said it was not 100% I have seen my batteries suddenly jump from 30% SOC to 0% soc (and in that case the voltages were indicating an actual 0% SOC when the battery BMS was reporting 30%).

 

[SignatureSolarJess]

I have heard of cases where faulty 6500s have been replaced without being charged the standard "upgrade fee". If the hardware still works without issues, I can see the reason to charge for upgrading to newer hardware. In this case if the hardware is actually failing, it does seem like SS should stand by the existing warranty and upgrade the hardware for you. @SignatureSolarJess can you look into this one?

Being another one of those people that started with the 6500EXs, I can tell you that the 6000XP is night and day different. Completely different manufacturer and the quality is much better. The only downside is that you loose 500W of output power per leg (if you get 2 6000XPs). There are a lot more features built into the 6000XP than the 6500 as well. You can also use Solar Assistant on them.

Yeah for sure! Just call into tech to troubleshoot. If it's deemed defective, there are a couple of options. It's not an upgrade but a full credit if it's under warranty and then you'd just put that credit toward the 6000XP.

 

[EPicTony]

Yeah for sure! Just call into tech to troubleshoot. If it's deemed defective, there are a couple of options. It's not an upgrade but a full credit if it's under warranty and then you'd just put that credit toward the 6000XP.

This is what SS did for me, a very cost effective solution to go from lame 6500's to great 6000's. Super happy with the entire process from SS. An added plus is the 6000's are currently on sale now saving even more $$$$.

 

[Konvett]

Yeah for sure! Just call into tech to troubleshoot. If it's deemed defective, there are a couple of options. It's not an upgrade but a full credit if it's under warranty and then you'd just put that credit toward the 6000XP.

This is really helpful, thank you so much Jess! I will wait to hear back from the T2 support team about next steps with my current inverters.

 

[SignatureSolarJess]

This is really helpful, thank you so much Jess! I will wait to hear back from the T2 support team about next steps with my current inverters.

You're so welcome!

 

[EscapedAritst]

Hello everyone. I have had 3 major issues with my system in the last two and a half years of owning it and I'm trying to decide what to do next.
I have 2x EG4 6500EX inverters and 4x 48V 100Ah LifePower4 batteries which power my entire home.

1. A few months into having the system, I had a fatal error on my 2P1 inverter which bricked it and it had to be replaced by Signature Solar. I had to wait about a month in total for them to receive back my old inverter and then send me my new one. I was on grid power the entire time which in California is very expensive, as I'm sure you all know.

2. Within the last few months, I've noticed that Solar Assistant is showing my batteries (20 kWh bank) is hitting the 20% mark after using only 12kW. Signature Solar told me that I needed to deep cycle for 7 days which I did. I would see the batteries last much longer in this mode, going all the way down to 46V. Once I switched back to their recommended settings in BMS (EG4 mode), same thing. Getting roughly half of the expected life of the batteries.

3. Today, my power just cut out completely. I went to the inverters and all 4 batteries had the alarm light on and inverter 2P1 had error 32 while 2P2 had error bp. I tried turning off and turning back on the system. After a lot of testing with Signature Solar, they've told me that I will likely need to replace the inverters with the EG4 6000XP and will have to pay $750 per inverter even though my EG4 6500EX are both still under warranty.

All of this is causing me concern. I've been very wary of these inverters since the start because of the seemingly constant slew of errors (including a number of smaller errors not listed here). When the 12k came out, I got an email from Signature Solar offering me $750 in credit towards both if I gave up my warranty on them and bought the 12k. That gave me reason to believe that these inverters are known to be bad and they're trying to get all of them off warranty or bought back. But does this mean the new ones are more reliable? I watched Will Prowse's video on the 6500EX and he praised it up and down which is what gave me the confidence to buy it. He seems to be a big fan of the 6k as well, but what's to stop it from having the same or similar problems further down the road?

At the end of the day, I just want confidence for myself and the family that the power is going to work. I don't want to have to be out of my inverters for a month or longer while they're being repaired, warrantied, or something of the sort. I would love the advice of this forum on what you would feel safe doing in my situation.

I have two installations with 4 of your 6500ex inverters and 8 Lifepower4 batteries at each. They have been extremely unreliable. I get random errors once a week with F60 being the most consistent.. I also lost 6 out of 16 batteries, but SS replaced the BMSs and I think that fixed that problem. I'm just about to abandon the 8 inverters and buy something reliable. I have not made a brand choice yet.