Smell of electrical fire today

[CaliSunHarvester]

Some time today around 5pm when I let the dogs out, I noticed a faint smell of electrical fire. Melting plastic or so. I ran around the property looking for the usual suspects (2 battery banks, far apart), the panel that the tenant regularly overloads, arrays. Nothing to see. The smell was actually strongest on the South side, away from the batteries.

Now that it's dark, the fire is actually visible from the higher portion of our property. It's about 30 miles away. Yes, that big of a fire.

And yes, it's a *battery* fire. At a gas power plant, which -- I did not know -- also has batteries.

"construction of Phase 3 with another 350 MW / 1,400 MWh was underway to bring total capacity to 750 MW / 3,000 MWh, and commissioned in August 2023"

Smoke and fire stop at Moss Landing battery facility; water testing expected soon

As of Saturday, the flames subsided, and the smoke had not been seen coming from the building on Sunday. Water testing is expected soon.

www.ksbw.com

 

[SparkyJJO]

And....? What did you find?

 

[CaliSunHarvester]

And....? What did you find?

sorry, I clicked "post" too early.

 

[400bird]

How many fires have they had at the Moss Landing battery? 2? 3? I'm glad my safety record with my DIY pack is way better than the "pro's" lol

 

[CaliSunHarvester]

I didn't notice a fire this bad before but I found some reports of overheating/ involuntary shutdowns in recent years.

I am surprised that the power grid is still up. It's still burning, visible from Santa Cruz.

 

[400bird]

I didn't notice a fire this bad before but I found some reports of overheating/ involuntary shutdowns in recent years.

I am surprised that the power grid is still up. It's still burning, visible from Santa Cruz.

The grid has redundancy built in. One lost generator shouldn't effect the overall grid. Plus those battery plants are normally just peaker plants, to help shift solar power and cover the evening increase in usage.

 

[curiouscarbon]

Some time today around 5pm when I let the dogs out, I noticed a faint smell of electrical fire. Melting plastic or so. I ran around the property looking for the usual suspects (2 battery banks, far apart), the panel that the tenant regularly overloads, arrays. Nothing to see. The smell was actually strongest on the South side, away from the batteries.

Now that it's dark, the fire is actually visible from the higher portion of our property. It's about 30 miles away. Yes, that big of a fire.

And yes, it's a *battery* fire. At a gas power plant, which -- I did not know -- also has batteries.

"construction of Phase 3 with another 350 MW / 1,400 MWh was underway to bring total capacity to 750 MW / 3,000 MWh, and commissioned in August 2023"

Smoke and fire stop at Moss Landing battery facility; water testing expected soon

As of Saturday, the flames subsided, and the smoke had not been seen coming from the building on Sunday. Water testing is expected soon.

www.ksbw.com

link to fire incident:

Watch Duty - Wildfire Maps & Alerts

Real-time information about wildfire and firefighting efforts nearby

app.watchduty.org

watchduty is a nice website for tracking fires

 

[Skypower]

Dang, is that thing still burning? Traffic info still shows hwy1 closed

 

[Brucey]

Dang, is that thing still burning? Traffic info still shows hwy1 closed

300MWh of cells in a two story config in a massive turbine building are prob going to burn for quite a while.

 

[Brucey]

How many fires have they had at the Moss Landing battery? 2? 3? I'm glad my safety record with my DIY pack is way better than the "pro's" lol

They had three reported events prior to this big one.

1) Phase 1: water fire suppression system precharged due to faulty logic coding. Bunch of loose couplers that would feed water directly into batteries in the event that temp sensors indicated an actual fire leaked over a bunch of batteries, some of this leaked through the "floor" onto more batteries below. Bunch of arcing and melting resulted but no actual fire. System was never tested for leaks in fully assembled configuration. 7% of the batteries were damaged.

2) Phase 2: same issue as what happened in phase 1.

3) Tesla megapack fire. One of the 256 megapacks caught on fire and burned. Due to the outdoor standalone design it burned in place without spreading to neighboring units. Likely 2-3MWh of capacity?

Phase 1 LG design especially being inside a giant hall thats three football fields long, and double high design, absolute disaster once a fire propogated with 300MWh in there.

 

[sumpower]

Flourinated gases from burning lithium batteries are some of the most potent greenhouse gases that do not disperse readily, so they have a long lasting effect.
This is why refrigerants are being so heavily regultated as most are flourocarbon based.

Fluorinated Gas Emissions | US EPA

Information on emissions and removals of the main greenhouse gases to and from the atmosphere.

www.epa.gov

 

[Brucey]

Flourinated gases from burning lithium batteries are some of the most potent greenhouse gases that do not disperse readily, so they have a long lasting effect.
This is why refrigerants are being so heavily regultated as most are flourocarbon based.

Fluorinated Gas Emissions | US EPA

Information on emissions and removals of the main greenhouse gases to and from the atmosphere.

www.epa.gov

They were very very lucky the weather conditions allowed the toxic plume to go straight up instead of lingering at ground level in fog which they often have there apparently.

Flames reignite at Monterey Co. battery storage facility as officials monitor toxic smoke

A fire at one of the world's largest lithium battery plants reignited Friday afternoon. Officials say the evacuation order has been lifted, but advise residents to limit outdoor exposure in abundance of caution.

abc7news.com

 

[Skypower]

Funny how California has such stringent home battery regulation(for LFP ) in regards to outside mounting, spacing between, maximum capacity and which ones you can use with what(paid certification bribes). And yet, because they don’t practice what they preach, here we are again with a second Armageddon event in a month(LA). Completely avoidable for anyone who has two brain cells.

 

[sumpower]

I worked for 10 years doing instrumentation/calibration and training others for operating pollution control systems in heavy industry. Makes me wonder how they got around the regulatory requirements for pollution control at this facility.
Well maybe, they were granted an exception when going through the permit process because it was a "green" energy project? (I don't know if this is the case). But it should have been placed in some type of building where they could have collected these gases in a pollution control system. Oh, more costs?

 

[Brucey]

I worked for 10 years doing instrumentation/calibration and training others for operating pollution control systems in heavy industry. Makes me wonder how they got around the regulatory requirements for pollution control at this facility.
Well maybe, they were granted an exception when going through the permit process because it was a "green" energy project? (I don't know if this is the case). But it should have been placed in some type of building where they could have collected these gases in a pollution control system. Oh, more costs?

Basically their fire prevention plan was to spray inside the battery racks/modules with water. Which led to previous smaller failures. This time apparently the water extinguishing function didn't work as expected. Being located on a previous gas peaker plant prob gave some loopholes as well.

 

[Brucey]

Morro Bay residents concerned over battery plant proposal after fire at Moss Landing facility

As one of the world’s largest battery storage facilities burns just up the coast, Morro Bay residents are raising the alarm over the proposed construction of a similar plant in their city.

www.ksby.com

 

[jdr93]

designed and operated for guaranteed failure

 

[Brucey]

Just realized the 300MW mentioned in the burning phase one is the inverter output, the battery size is actually 1200MWh!

From previous incident in phase 2:

"Project owner Vistra Energy said yesterday that the 100MW/400MWh expansion phase of the facility now joins the 300MW/1,200MWh Phase I in being out of action, after the incident late on Sunday (13 February)."

 

[Sunny Day]

So were these NCM cells? Someone responsible for the design should check their professional indemnity insurance is all paid up…

 

[Brucey]

So were these NCM cells? Someone responsible for the design should check their professional indemnity insurance is all paid up…

Yup, LG JH4 NCM pouch cells in racks:

 

[Brucey]

Msds

 

[SparkyJJO]

Ouch That much NCM in one place was asking for trouble!

 

[Brucey]

Ouch That much NCM in one place was asking for trouble!

Yeah they can't even get the Leaf car batteries right and Vistra decided to put 1.2 GWh of their cells together.

LG Energy Solution's New TR1300 Operational At World's Largest Utility-Scale Battery Energy Storage Project

/PRNewswire/ -- LG Energy Solution, South Korea's leading manufacturer of advanced lithium-ion batteries, recently supplied Vistra's Moss Landing Energy...

www.prnewswire.com

 

[CaliSunHarvester]

Just realized the 300MW mentioned in the burning phase one is the inverter output, the battery size is actually 1200MWh

Even bigger, 3000MWh, from my OP:

"construction of Phase 3 with another 350 MW / 1,400 MWh was underway to bring total capacity to 750 MW / 3,000 MWh, and commissioned in August 2023"

 

[Brucey]

Even bigger, 3000MWh, from my OP:

"construction of Phase 3 with another 350 MW / 1,400 MWh was underway to bring total capacity to 750 MW / 3,000 MWh, and commissioned in August 2023"

Yes but phase 1 which was the initial 300MW/1200MWh design in the old turbine hall is the one that's burning. Phase 2 and phase 3 are outdoors.