• Have you tried out dark mode?! Scroll to the bottom of any page to find a sun or moon icon to turn dark mode on or off!

diy solar

diy solar

Smell of electrical fire today

Brucey said:
Yes but phase 1 which was the initial 300MW/1200MWh design in the old turbine hall is the one that's burning. Phase 2 and phase 3 are outdoors.
Click to expand...

I see. It's funny how little I know about that even though I can see the smoke stacks every day. Umm, not on foggy days.

Until this week, I thought this was still a gas power plant! I had no idea it had been converted to a battery storage site.

We do get our power from there, I think. It says power comes from "Central Coast Community Energy" on the PG&E bill. I always assumed that's the gas power plant.

Well, I have been working hard to get less and less power from them.
 
Just think of the HAZMAT abatement cost. It’ll eat any thought of profit or even solvency. The insurer will probably belly up or find an out through a technicality. Guess who that leaves?
 
There are going to be accidents and set backs....

Look at the nuclear industry.
There were accidents but we learn...
We had a pretty bad nuclear accident in the early 50s.
At the time NRU was one of the worlds biggest research reactor ( its origins come from the Bomb program Alloy tubes )
People didn't give up..
It would be 20 years but early experimental reactors lead to Shippingport and Calder hall and finally began to bare fruit and give us real working reactors.
The three mile Island was a set back but one of the two on that site continued to deliver power for decades with an excellent record.

BUT if people had of said it will never work and gave up we would not have the power reactors we have now and the next generation of technology thats starting to appear today.
All that could have been stunted if people believed it was not safe to build reactors for peaceful power generation

I'm worried the media will put it in people's heads that battery storage is dangerous.
It could stunt the technology for a decade or more if people fear batteries the way they feared nuclear.
 
CaliSunHarvester said:
PoCo customers. We have unlimited funds to pay them. Looking forward to more rate increases. 🥵
My investments in solar panels, batteries etc will break even even faster.
Click to expand...
"The Moss Landing plant is operated by Texas-based Vistra Corp., which has seen its stock price soar in the last year from about $39 to about $171 at the close of trading on Friday."

Privatize the profits. Saddle the taxpayers with the losses...
 
sumpower said:
Flourinated gases from burning lithium batteries are some of the most potent greenhouse gases that do not disperse readily, so they have a long lasting effect.
This is why refrigerants are being so heavily regultated as most are flourocarbon based.

www.epa.gov

Fluorinated Gas Emissions | US EPA

Information on emissions and removals of the main greenhouse gases to and from the atmosphere.
www.epa.gov www.epa.gov
Click to expand...
Strange that so many are clamoring to have that wonderful toxin put into their drinking water in the name of "dental health." Only a breath of airborne fluorine can be fatal, depending on the concentration.

Fluorine can cause things which are not ordinarily considered combustible to burn quite violently.
 
OK after all of the belly laughing just glad to see that the OP was not the issue. I really do want to see everyone successful on their solar ventures for whatever reason... I am self sufficiency so has nothing to do with going green... just power where I am currently located is not in the works with what TEPCO wanted as buy in...
 
CaliSunHarvester said:
there's talk on NextDoor about suing the operator of this plant. People are fed up with being told "nothing to worry about". The published air quality index (AQI) only measures particulate matter, not gasses, and people realize that.
Click to expand...
But do those same people benefit from the plant when it is in operation? Even if the plant is profiting from the people, is that not an endorsement for the usefulness of the plant? In a free market, people would not willingly give their money to something that did not benefit them or which had no value for them, right?

How is it, then, that the people should so willingly bite the hand that feeds them? If they feel they have been cheated, and have not received that for which they paid, perhaps that is one thing. But the very fact that they have supported the company with their own financial inputs suggests the people are somewhat complicit in its operations and risks.
 
Norwasian said:
But do those same people benefit from the plant when it is in operation? Even if the plant is profiting from the people, is that not an endorsement for the usefulness of the plant? In a free market, people would not willingly give their money to something that did not benefit them or which had no value for them, right?

How is it, then, that the people should so willingly bite the hand that feeds them? If they feel they have been cheated, and have not received that for which they paid, perhaps that is one thing. But the very fact that they have supported the company with their own financial inputs suggests the people are somewhat complicit in its operations and risks.
Click to expand...
Are you talking about investors or power company customers?
 
wpns said:
Are you talking about investors or power company customers?
Click to expand...
No, I'm talking about consumers.

EDIT: I'm not sure that the "customers" are such directly. They may benefit without having a direct/formal supplier-client relationship. It's my understanding that in this case the company was providing stability to the electric grid which the consumers may or may not have been aware of. However, the consumers would have been benefiting via their usual electric service.
 
Norwasian said:
No, I'm talking about consumers.
Click to expand...
In the US consumers don’t have the option of selecting the power company and grid infrastructure they choose to invest in, where it is built compared to where they live, or how the investment is paid back (or poor investments are paid off).
 
wpns said:
In the US consumers don’t have the option of selecting the power company and grid infrastructure they choose to invest in, where it is built compared to where they live, or how the investment is paid back (or poor investments are paid off).
Click to expand...
Even if the supplier has a monopoly in its market, it seems the consumers should still have the choice of purchasing or not purchasing from said supplier. Is it mandatory to be connected to the grid?
 
Norwasian said:
Even if the supplier has a monopoly in its market, it seems the consumers should still have the choice of purchasing or not purchasing from said supplier. Is it mandatory to be connected to the grid?
Click to expand...
It’s my personal opinion the grid operator should be a public owned for profit enterprise
The generation capacity should be public private of any combination there of

Then the public can chose who they want to buy electricity from plus a delivery fee
 
DPC said:
It’s my personal opinion the grid operator should be a public owned for profit enterprise
The generation capacity should be public private of any combination there of

Then the public can chose who they want to buy electricity from plus a delivery fee
Click to expand...
Kind of how it works here. I pay a generation fee to whoever from a list of choices, and a delivery fee to the Poco who owns the lines in my area. I use one for both for my generation and delivery because last I looked no one else had better generation rates. Oh a "green" company tried to sell me on their "cheap and green wind and solar power" but it was way more expensive than my primary poco. Not surprised since around here wind is a really stupid choice and solar is crap in the winter so they have to pay some ridiculous amount to transfer "green" generated power from halfway across the country lol.
 
  • Like
Reactions: DPC
SparkyJJO said:
Kind of how it works here. I pay a generation fee to whoever from a list of choices, and a delivery fee to the Poco who owns the lines in my area
Click to expand...

Same here (where the batteries burnt). PG&E owns the lines and gets delivery fees, generation can be bought from PG&E or from CCCE (central coast community energy). CCCE is affiliated (??) with the battery plant. Afaik, there is no alternative to CCCE besides PG&E.

The bill looks typically like this:
PG&E charges $100 for delivery
PG&E charges $90 for gemeration
PG&E credits $90 for generation
CCCE charges $80 for generation

So CCCE is usually 5 to 10% cheaper than what PG&E would charge for generation.

However, 1 or 2 months of the year, CCCE charges a little more than PG&E would.

Delivery is more expensive than generation.
 
CaliSunHarvester said:
Same here (where the batteries burnt). PG&E owns the lines and gets delivery fees, generation can be bought from PG&E or from CCCE (central coast community energy). CCCE is affiliated (??) with the battery plant. Afaik, there is no alternative to CCCE besides PG&E.

The bill looks typically like this:
PG&E charges $100 for delivery
PG&E charges $90 for gemeration
PG&E credits $90 for generation
CCCE charges $80 for generation

So CCCE is usually 5 to 10% cheaper than what PG&E would charge for generation.

However, 1 or 2 months of the year, CCCE charges a little more than PG&E would.
Click to expand...
Maybe @Norwasian can explain where the ROI on your investment in the battery plant comes in. :LOL:
 
Norwasian said:
Is it mandatory to be connected to the grid?
Click to expand...

I think so, if there is power available. I don't think you can nowadays get a building permit (in our county) without connecting to the power grid. In rural areas, you are allowed to have a well, but I heard that new wells have a mandatory water meter.

With the mandatory power grid connection, one could refuse to pay the bill and see what happens. My observation is that since covid-19, nobody gets disconnected any more, even if they don't pay for 5 years.
 
CaliSunHarvester said:
you are allowed to have a well, but I heard that new wells have a mandatory water meter.
Click to expand...
That's a bizarre concept to me living here in a temperate rain forest. The majority of the people in my county have a private well. But I suppose for out there it makes sense with your water scarcity. Anyone else here read the novel "The Water Knife?"
 
jeff.lankford said:
That's a bizarre concept to me living here in a temperate rain forest. The majority of the people in my county have a private well. But I suppose for out there it makes sense with your water scarcity. Anyone else here read the novel "The Water Knife?"
Click to expand...

It is extremely upsetting to me.

I heard around 2008 a local water company had their annual meeting and equipping private wells with meters for billing purposes was on the agenda. Supposedly some well owners came to that meeting with rifles.

A well maintenance company told me last month that I was lucky with my situation (they did a repair) as if I had ended up with drilling a new well, a permit would have been required.. and likely a meter.
 
That is a California thing... they still do off grid and wells in most of the rest of the country if they are needed.
 
CaliSunHarvester said:
It is extremely upsetting to me.

I heard around 2008 a local water company had their annual meeting and equipping private wells with meters for billing purposes was on the agenda. Supposedly some well owners came to that meeting with rifles.

A well maintenance company told me last month that I was lucky with my situation (they did a repair) as if I had ended up with drilling a new well, a permit would have been required.. and likely a meter.
Click to expand...
Well permits are needed here, but that's just a public health thing - to make sure someone doesn't do something stupid regarding their well location wrt their septic drain field.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

Z
MPP is a garbage company, change my mind (jk you can't)
Replies
1
Views
268
JerryK
J

diy solar

diy solar
Back
Top