Sol-Ark 12k Time of Use settings

[DGSmooth]

Cheers all - my Sol-Ark struggles continue lol. I'm totally off grid, 48V, and trying to get the system to use the batteries as much as possible, and minimize generator run time. I know the Sol-Ark 12k isn't the best for an off grid system, but it's what I have. Seems like generator runs way to much. Example the generator will come on when batteries get down to 49V, say at like 7am, then sun comes up at 8 and I'm pulling in 4k from panels, loads are less than 1k, generator stays running. 4 hours later sun is still blazing, 7k from panels, batteries at 59V, generator still running. I think the time of use settings could be used to somehow limit generator, but life of me I can't figure it out lol. Anybody a pro at those settings?

 

[DIYrich]

TOU settings are ignored when the grid is down.
The generator start is a problem with the Sol-Ark. Once it turns on the generator, it won't stop until the battery is full. It should be smart enough to stop when it sees some level of PV, or have an SOC level to stop.

 

[DGSmooth]

TOU settings are ignored when the grid is down.
The generator start is a problem with the Sol-Ark. Once it turns on the generator, it won't stop until the battery is full. It should be smart enough to stop when it sees some level of PV, or have an SOC level to stop.

Thanks for the help.

What do you mean by "when grid is down"? I'm off grid, with gen connected to grid input.

So what does it use to determine when the "battery is full"? I'm using voltage mode instead of percentage mode.

 

[DIYrich]

What do you mean by "when grid is down"? I'm off grid, with gen connected to grid input.

Grid power is not available at the Grid Port.

So what does it use to determine when the "battery is full"? I'm using voltage mode instead of percentage mode.

 

[DGSmooth]

Grid power is not available at the Grid Port.


View attachment 272801

Oh I see. And there's no way for me to limit it? As in, at certain times of day, I only want the generator to get batteries up to 60% SOC?

 

[DIYrich]

Oh I see. And there's no way for me to limit it? As in, at certain times of day, I only want the generator to get batteries up to 60% SOC?

Not that I am aware of.

You might be able to use something like Solar Assistant to change the start parameter. Say: if battery is below 80% at 5pm, top up to 100%. Then at 6pm, drop the level down to 5% so it doesn't turn on later, unless the battery gets really low.

 

[Oldphile]

According to the manual TOU can limit SOC charge.

 

[DGSmooth]

According to the manual TOU can limit SOC charge.
View attachment 273025

Thats the way I interpreted it to work as well. Doesn't seem to work that way. Here is my system right now. Generator came on at some point in the night, brought batteries up, now panels are producing more than my loads, generator is still running. Why?

 

[Jose_Sol-Ark]

Hi @DGSmooth , the TOU feature can be used in off-grid installation to turn off the generator at specific times and SOC%/Voltages. You should activate all of the charge boxes in the TOU tab. If possible, please take a screenshot of your TOU settings so I can review them.

 

[DGSmooth]

Hi @DGSmooth , the TOU feature can be used in off-grid installation to turn off the generator at specific times and SOC%/Voltages. You should activate all of the charge boxes in the TOU tab. If possible, please take a screenshot of your TOU settings so I can review them.

Howdy there, thanks for the help. I actually have Bill at Sol-Ark, maybe you know him, helping me over the last few days. We've played with those settings and just can't get it to work. Best we could manage, is the invertor stops taking a charge from the generator once it hits that SOC voltage in the TOU setup, but it still triggers the generator to run. I'm also on the 226 software, which has the added absorption voltage timer.

 

[Oldphile]

I had a number of issues then did factory reset. After that all was good.

 

[MaikaiLife]

I had a number of issues then did factory reset. After that all was good.

Did the TOU start working after you did the factory reset, so that the generator would turn off at the right level of SOC?

 

[MaikaiLife]

I performed a factory reset last night and configured the settings to start at 20% and TOU charge to 30% across all time intervals. However, the same issue persisted—the generator continued running well beyond the 30% threshold. It only shut off this morning after I manually unchecked the “Charge from Generator” option in the My Sol-Ark app.


How can we get this working as intended?

 

[Oldphile]

I performed a factory reset last night and configured the settings to start at 20% and TOU charge to 30% across all time intervals. However, the same issue persisted—the generator continued running well beyond the 30% threshold. It only shut off this morning after I manually unchecked the “Charge from Generator” option in the My Sol-Ark app.


How can we get this working as intended?

@Cmiller knows more about generators on Sol-Ark.

 

[Cmiller]

I performed a factory reset last night and configured the settings to start at 20% and TOU charge to 30% across all time intervals. However, the same issue persisted—the generator continued running well beyond the 30% threshold. It only shut off this morning after I manually unchecked the “Charge from Generator” option in the My Sol-Ark app.


How can we get this working as intended?

I have a few questions on your specific install:

1. Is the gen feeding into the gen terminals or grid terminals?
2. Are you using the start value for gen or for grid? (This needs to match to where the gen is feeding to, IIRC.)
3. What firmware version is your Sol-Ark on?
4. Are you on-grid with gen backup, or full off-grid?

 

[Cmiller]

Cheers all - my Sol-Ark struggles continue lol. I'm totally off grid, 48V, and trying to get the system to use the batteries as much as possible, and minimize generator run time. I know the Sol-Ark 12k isn't the best for an off grid system, but it's what I have. Seems like generator runs way to much. Example the generator will come on when batteries get down to 49V, say at like 7am, then sun comes up at 8 and I'm pulling in 4k from panels, loads are less than 1k, generator stays running. 4 hours later sun is still blazing, 7k from panels, batteries at 59V, generator still running. I think the time of use settings could be used to somehow limit generator, but life of me I can't figure it out lol. Anybody a pro at those settings?

Are you using the start parameter from the "gen" section or from the "grid" section? (In battery settings> charge tab [on physical screen])

If you are feeding into the grid terminals, I believe you need to be using the "grid" start voltage parameter. Also, make sure the "gen" start value is NOT same as the "grid" start. For some reason, if these are same, it makes things act wonky.... The best bet will also be to disable (uncheck) the gen charge check box.

If you are using the "gen" start parameter, it may be that the Sol-Ark is looking for charging on gen terminals, and therefore doesn't follow your TOU limits....

Something else that can play a huge factor in all of this is whether you have the inverter configured for "load first" or "battery first". (In physical screen under: limiter>other) This determines where PV power first goes to. If you have it set to "batt first", then as soon as PV comes out, PV will take over charging, and even if you have a large gen, the gen will only feed the loads, therefore gen run time will tend to be longer. If you set it to "load first", then PV will first feed loads, keeping the gen full-out charging, with "excess" pv (above load demand) "adding to" the gen charge amount.....

 

[MaikaiLife]

I have a few questions on your specific install:

1. Is the gen feeding into the gen terminals or grid terminals?
2. Are you using the start value for gen or for grid? (This needs to match to where the gen is feeding to, IIRC.)
3. What firmware version is your Sol-Ark on?
4. Are you on-grid with gen backup, or full off-grid?

Hi @Cmiller thank you for your response.

Adding responses to your questions below.

1: The generator is feeding into the GEN terminals in the inverter.
2: I'm using the Gen Start value at 21%, I have the Gen Signal unchecked, which is how I stopped the generator remotely.

3: I'm using the latest firmware (6.2.2.6), which has the onscreen value for absorption time now.

4: This install is completely Off-Grid.

For my "Work Mode" I have "Limited Power to Load" as per the Sol-Ark manual.


Finally, these are my "TOU" settings and it's the same all the way down.


In my estimate, the system should turn on the generator and charge from 21% to 30%, then turn off the generator. But it just keeps on charging to 100% or until someone intervenes. I only want it to charge the batteries 10% since it's often only needed to get by until the sun comes up shortly after the generator run.

Thanks again for your help. I really appreciate it.

 

[Cmiller]

1: The generator is feeding into the GEN terminals in the inverter.
2: I'm using the Gen Start value at 21%, I have the Gen Signal unchecked, which is how I stopped the generator remotely.
View attachment 308670

We are generally using the grid terminals for our off-grid installs, as that way you can use "grid peak shave" to limit the overall generator draw. In that case, you would then disable gen charge and enable grid charge, and use grid start as the start trigger.

If you would try that, be sure to toggle on the "gen on grid input" option.

There is a possibility that the inverter is not "honoring" the TOU setpoint because of not seeing power coming in on the grid terminals... But I can't say 100% for sure. If it were my system, I would try switching to grid input once, and see if that doesn't help.

3: I'm using the latest firmware (6.2.2.6), which has the onscreen value for absorption time now.
View attachment 308671

I haven't seen that firmware yet personally. The Sol-Ark website still lists 6.2.2.2 as the latest for the 12K, so 6.2.2.6 must be a very new version, or maybe even a beta version.

In my estimate, the system should turn on the generator and charge from 21% to 30%, then turn off the generator. But it just keeps on charging to 100% or until someone intervenes. I only want it to charge the batteries 10% since it's often only needed to get by until the sun comes up shortly after the generator run.

As far as I can tell, it should work the way you are expecting it to, with your settings how they are.

The only thing that I can think to try (other than using grid input) would be to try switching to "load first" instead of "batt first". That shouldn't make the difference, but I have discovered that sometimes settings do things you really don't expect, if it's on a Sol-Ark...

 

[MaikaiLife]

I’m hesitant to move the connection to the Grid input since the Generator input should be sufficient. It also allows me to control the battery charging—currently set to 90 amps in the previous screenshot, which refers to battery charging current, not generator output.

Everything starts and charges correctly, but it won’t shut off at the configured 30% state of charge. I believe I had this working on a different inverter before. I’m planning to call Sol-Ark later today to see if they can help troubleshoot. I also noticed some odd “Seasons” settings on the display, which seem to affect TOU behavior but aren’t available in the app.

I’ll keep you posted.

Thank you for your help!

 

[MaikaiLife]

@Cmiller

I contacted Sol-Ark and they had me factory reset, remove the closed loop comms, unplug the can comms cable and then set everything to voltage.

Then we set the generator to start at 51.2, TOU to 52v roughly 20% SOC to 40% SOC. Generator started as programmed and blew right past the 52v shut off.

Support said, I dunno I have to ask some L2 person, said they would call me back and ended the call with the generator just sitting there running, the same problem I had before.

Rather than wait for them, I went into “Basic Settings” -> Time and I enabled the “Seasons” option and then set season 1 from 1-1 to 12-31.

As soon as I hit save the generator disconnected and went into cool down, eventually shutting down and it’s now off.

I’m pretty sure the mostly undocumented setting for seasons are the issues. They can’t be adjusted online and can only be set on the inverter itself.

I’m waiting for a call back before I leave, but I think there is a dependency unknown or undocumented that the seasons must be turned on for TOU to work.

More to come.

 

[Cmiller]

I’m hesitant to move the connection to the Grid input since the Generator input should be sufficient. It also allows me to control the battery charging—currently set to 90 amps in the previous screenshot, which refers to battery charging current, not generator output.

The generator input is severely lacking in the ability to dynamically limit the draw from the generator as loads go up and down. The grid input allows you to utilize "grid peak shave" to dynamically limit generator draw. In other words, if your loads go up by 2kw, the charger will "throttle back" 2kw until the loads drop again, then it will "ramp up" the charging again to match the peak shave setpoint. In our experience, on off-grid systems, it just tends to work better when we use grid input for the gen. (When grid-tied with generator backup, we use the gen terminals.)

Also, the grid input has a charge amp setpoint as well. Though we usually actually then set that pretty high and just allow the peak shave to limit the amps.

Support said, I dunno I have to ask some L2 person, said they would call me back and ended the call with the generator just sitting there running, the same problem I had before.

Sounds pretty familiar. As soon as it is anything in-depth, you tend to get zero help. (In my experience anyway...)

I’m waiting for a call back before I leave,

Don't hold your breath on that phone call! I would be quite surprised if you ever hear back on that!

but I think there is a dependency unknown or undocumented that the seasons must be turned on for TOU to work.

That is interesting! I have one job where the Sol-Ark pretty much does the same (blows past the TOU setpoint) and I will now have to try messing with the seasons to see if that makes the difference for them! Thanks for the info on that!

 

[MaikaiLife]

At the conclusion of my call with Sol-Ark, I agreed to set everything to voltage to appease them for testing purposes.

I had their L2 tech confirm my settings, cranked up the loads (AC) and then left. At about 19:44 the voltage reached the threshold where the generator should have started (51.2).



I was swimming and afterward checked my phone and caught the system at 50.4, nearly a full volt below the configured start point.



I scaled back the loads and used the "Force Generator" option to charge up the batteries, then left it for the night with minimal load, about 400 watts.

This morning, when I looked at the system, I was surprised to see the Generator was running on it's own, and of course, it blew past the TOU settings of 52 volts and was already at 53.2 by the time I woke up and killed the "Gen Signal" toggle in the MySol-Ark interface.



Even with the system relying solely on voltage, the generator failed to start last night as expected, then unexpectedly turned on this morning. However, we’re still facing the original issue—it didn’t shut off according to the configured TOU settings.

I’ve reported these findings to Sol-Ark, but frankly, this is getting frustrating. It’s hard to understand why something so straightforward continues to be unreliable. I’ve spent nearly an entire day troubleshooting what has consistently worked without issue on EG4, Schneider, and Victron systems.

 

[Cmiller]

I’ve reported these findings to Sol-Ark, but frankly, this is getting frustrating. It’s hard to understand why something so straightforward continues to be unreliable. I’ve spent nearly an entire day troubleshooting what has consistently worked without issue on EG4, Schneider, and Victron systems.

I don't think Eg4 has necessarily worked better for people. But Schneider and Victron, etc. have worked well in the past.

We do have some jobs using the gen start relay in the Sol-Ark and working ok, but those are using the grid input for the gen. I think it would be worth your effort to try switching to grid input. There is zero "drawback" to trying grid input!

 

[robby]

I think that the tech was wrong to tell you to take it out of closed loop mode.
Unfortunately I don't have a generator hooked up to mine so I have limited experience. Only experience I have is just hanging with my installer buddy who had just put in a unit which was working fine with a Generac in closed loop mode.

 

[MaikaiLife]

@robby
I'm in agreement that if it works with Voltage, it will work with Closed Loop, but in order to get Sol-Ark to actually help me resolve whatever the underlying issue is, I've got to play ball and downgrade the battery experience to voltage to get it working.

@Cmiller, if I can get the generator to start/stop correctly, I will give your idea a go and switch it over. One step at a time as to not introduce too many variables, thank you so much for your assistance.