Sol-Ark 15K FAILED! - My experience with Sol-Ark ; Their response was underwhelming

[Daddy Tanuki]

100 amp transfer switch and not grid interactive, this is an off grid inverter.

I need / want 200 amp transfer and be able to grid sell. I doubt I will have enough battery capacity initially for total self consumption and my utility still offers 1:1 net metering for the billing cycle.

If I was just going to stick with critical sub panel I would probably upgrade to dual 24v Victrons and a new 24v LFP, but I want whole home backup with enough solar to zero out my electric bill (20kw).

No matter the inverter I am going to have manual bypass because yes stuff fails, I do like the Gridboss because it has mechanical bypass built in.

Doubt I am going to do this DIY so want an installer who is also comfortable with the gear and can back it up if there is an issue.

Then long term do your self a favor Schneider, Victron, sunny island/sunny boy or Fronius (if fronius offer us compatible gear)

 

[jharrell]

Then long term do your self a favor Schneider, Victron, sunny island/sunny boy or Fronius (if fronius offer us compatible gear)

No one is doing Victron for whole home backup around here, many haven't even heard of them, not even sure it's UL listed for a ESS. I like Victron gear a lot and am comfortable programming it coming from the mobile RV / boat side off things, but I don't see them as a great whole home backup solution even if I DIY it. I added a Victron shunt and replaced the PWM Morningstar with a Victron MPPT on my old system so I could monitor it, almost bought the 24v inverter because not sure how long that Trace is going to last but have the means to go big and backup the whole house now.

Schneider yeah maybe, their 4024 is the evolution of the Trace 4024 I have which is a tank, again nobody installing them around I know of.

My Dad has an old Sunny Boy system been working well for about 10 years no batteries, haven't looked at their Sunny Island in a long time does it do 200 amp transfer?

Fronius, heard good things, no installers I know of.

Around here's it seems to be Tesla, Enphase, Sol-Ark for whole home backup in North FL.

 

[NC_hydro]

Basing things on what the “installers” are installing is like getting life advice from TikTok influencers. They’re in it for the money. That’s why there’s a blue zillion grid tie only systems out there. They’re doing whatever it takes to make the most money.

 

[jharrell]

Basing things on what the “installers” are installing is like getting life advice from TikTok influencers. They’re in it for the money. That’s why there’s a blue zillion grid tie only systems out there. They’re doing whatever it takes to make the most money.

Not always true. One of the installers recommending Sol-Ark is the same one who installed my current system 17 years ago when the original owner built the house. They have many installs and are not a big corporate operation, just an old small local business focused on home backup more than grid sell.

Yeah there are the ones selling solar leases and I have no interest in that sort of thing, I just don't have the time to deal with DIY and want a local installer that can support the products but that I can be comfortable with. I am sure I could get some of them to install whatever I want but prefer ones they have experience with.

 

[Daddy Tanuki]

Basing things on what the “installers” are installing is like getting life advice from TikTok influencers. They’re in it for the money. That’s why there’s a blue zillion grid tie only systems out there. They’re doing whatever it takes to make the most money.

Bingo

 

[Daddy Tanuki]

Not always true. One of the installers recommending Sol-Ark is the same one who installed my current system 17 years ago when the original owner built the house. They have many installs and are not a big corporate operation, just an old small local business focused on home backup more than grid sell.

Yeah there are the ones selling solar leases and I have no interest in that sort of thing, I just don't have the time to deal with DIY and want a local installer that can support the products but that I can be comfortable with. I am sure I could get some of them to install whatever I want but prefer ones they have experience with.

Well then pay your money and drop the subject.

 

[Shawn Hayes]

Not always true. One of the installers recommending Sol-Ark is the same one who installed my current system 17 years ago when the original owner built the house. They have many installs and are not a big corporate operation, just an old small local business focused on home backup more than grid sell.

Yeah there are the ones selling solar leases and I have no interest in that sort of thing, I just don't have the time to deal with DIY and want a local installer that can support the products but that I can be comfortable with. I am sure I could get some of them to install whatever I want but prefer ones they have experience with.

No matter how much support your local installer may offer, “warranty”, tech support, etc… goes back to the manufacturer. In my case, Sol-Ark which is sorely lacking…

 

[sunsurfer]

No one is doing Victron for whole home backup around here, many haven't even heard of them, not even sure it's UL listed for a ESS.

You mean UL Certified or rather 3rd party certified to UL specs. I do wonder if ANY solar gear is actually listed. There is a difference. Just a side note...FYI

Whole house Victron is something I am sure would be very reliable. They are out there but not in commie country just as you say, permit issues. I'm pretty much all Victron at this point for my house and feel fortunate. My old non Victron gear is mainly a side show now (well pump, wood harvesting, etc...) and I have ZERO AIO / HF in service. I might use one of my old HF inverters as a wheel chock or to hold up a book case but I couldn't in good conscious sell them.

 

[Daddy Tanuki]

No matter how much support your local installer may offer, “warranty”, tech support, etc… goes back to the manufacturer. In my case, Sol-Ark which is sorely lacking…

Yep Magnum had great customer support but they could not maintain the model as the damn things were like trace… only die after stupid USMC/Army level abuse. With delicate little AF/Navy treatment they last forever. Kind of hard to make money when shit Dont break and no repeat customers…

 

[Crowz]

You don't actually have to have a 200 amp transfer switch even if you have a 200 amp load.

You need 4 or 5 inverters that can do 50 amps or so.

Now with sol ark that could get expensive but with srne like I have that is the same price as one sol ark

 

[Oldphile]

“warranty”, tech support, etc… goes back to the manufacturer. In my case, Sol-Ark which is sorely lacking…

Yup. The contract I signed for my last install stated they would transfer the manufacturer's warranty to me when install was complete. People are mislead about installer warranty. They only warranty their workmanship, not the product. Yes, they will take care of product issues during commissioning, but it's your problem after that.

 

[455dan]

You mean UL Certified or rather 3rd party certified to UL specs. I do wonder if ANY solar gear is actually listed. There is a difference. Just a side note...FYI

Whole house Victron is something I am sure would be very reliable. They are out there but not in commie country just as you say, permit issues. I'm pretty much all Victron at this point for my house and feel fortunate. My old non Victron gear is mainly a side show now (well pump, wood harvesting, etc...) and I have ZERO AIO / HF in service. I might use one of my old HF inverters as a wheel chock or to hold up a book case but I couldn't in good conscious sell them.

Actually I would use the LF Inverter for a wheel chock as well for reliability- that big heavy Toroid transformer will hold a vehicle in place far better than just circuit boards after the box initially deforms.

 

[sunsurfer]

Actually I would use the LF Inverter for a wheel chock as well for reliability- that big heavy Toroid transformer will hold a vehicle in place far better than just circuit boards after the box initially deforms.

I don't know, those toroidal cores are kinda flat. I would go with something like an AIMS or Magnum with a big fat 2 pole laminate core. That should hold anything.

 

[CzerwonaKrowa]

Hence my statements about waiting for a zero crossing...geez guys. If the lights are dimming / flashing its because power is going away, the inverter sees the loss of voltage and decides to open the relay, but it does it when there is no voltage or current, not at the peak of the wave where its max amps:

"dimming/flashing" was simply an example. You think the system will also just "wait for a zero crossing" when there is a high voltage surge? Also, you are giving a lot of benefit of the doubt assuming that the inverter is programmed to perform zero-crossing stuff. I am not aware of any actual without-a-doubt confirmation that this zero crossing logic is actually implemented. Not to mention there is a latency between deenergizing the relay coil and when the physical contacts will separate so you can't even do it at the zero crossing, you have to hope/guess in-advance when the zero crossing is *going* to happen which can easily be guessed wrong when the waveform is doing unexpected oscillations from, say, a tree branch coming into contact with a power line causing odd fluctuations in voltage as things short out.

Even ignoring all that -- just because the voltage is at the zero crossing doesn't mean there is no current. There can, in fact, be a *ton* of current at the zero crossing. That assumption only holds true for purely resistive loads. Look into inductive and capacitive loads. Very obvious just based on the below diagram.


I don't understand why some of you people are hopeful and just assume "everything's going to be OK" instead of asking the tough questions, doing critical thinking, and performing worst-case analysis especially when we're talking about tens of thousands of dollars riding on some of these purchasing decisions. We need real answers for these questions, not wishful thinking.

 

[jharrell]

Whole house Victron is something I am sure would be very reliable. They are out there but not in commie country just as you say, permit issues. I'm pretty much all Victron at this point for my house and feel fortunate. My old non Victron gear is mainly a side show now (well pump, wood harvesting, etc...) and I have ZERO AIO / HF in service. I might use one of my old HF inverters as a wheel chock or to hold up a book case but I couldn't in good conscience sell them.

I am a fan of a LF Magnum or Victron as anyone else but they are being superseded by HF designs for a reason. The LF is operating at battery voltage but at grid frequency using a large transformer to step up to grid voltage.



If you have HVDC from solar then you don't need a giant transformer to step down to grid voltage so your typical grid tied no battery inverter is HF without the need for the step up front end from battery voltage. In a AIO with HVDC mppt's then its makes more sense to use a HF front end to boost battery voltage to HVDC mix with solar HVDC then invert down to grid voltage or reverse it for battery charging. Once you go to HV batteries like a EV (Sol-Ark 30k and 60k) its makes even less sense, but even at 48v the HF design makes more sense with solar for an AIO. These big HF inverters for whole home backup have large capacitor banks on the HVDC bus to do what the large transformer inductance does in the LF design.

 

[solar8484]

The OMRON shows they have been tested up to 10 times at full load in their test protocol, so thats a minimum. They don't seem to publish a durability curve like they do for others and like Churod does.

Sol-Ark uses the physically larger 1000vac Churods not the 830vac. I think the EG4 18kpv uses the 830's, the new Gridboss uses 270 amp 1000 vac's which are the same physical size as the Sol-Ark 200's

For clarification, the datasheet for the 1000V CHUROD relay (used in Sol-Ark and Gridboss) does not show durability curve.

 

[quantum`]

I haven't found any Fronius that are UL.

 

[jharrell]

I don't understand why all you people are hopeful and just assume "everything's going to be OK" instead of asking the tough questions, doing critical thinking, and performing worst-case analysis especially when we're talking about tens of thousands of dollars riding on some of these purchasing decisions. We need real answers for these questions, not wishful thinking.

Yes you are correct there will be some phase angle depending on the load, but you're showing a massive 90 degree angle with basically 0 power factor , what in your house is going to do that at 200 amps? Maybe your at .8 power factor worst case which is like 30 degree phase angle so something more like this, so your still cutting current in half without even trying to correct for power factor and wait a little longer:



Again how often are you pulling 200 amps and how often will the relay experience 200 amps during a disconnect event. If power is being lost the amps are gone, even with some phase angle waiting for a zero crossing will cut the amps significantly in a non grid down event.

This isn't wishful thinking every relay last longer the less its switched under load, AC relays have the benefit of zero crossing just like AC breakers and why DC breakers and relays have to be more robust for the same current.

 

[jharrell]

Sorry dupe

 

[CzerwonaKrowa]

Yes you are correct there will be some phase angle depending on the load, but you're showing a massive 90 degree angle with basically 0 power factor , what in your house is going to do that at 200 amps? Maybe your at .8 power factor worst case which is like 30 degree phase angle so something more like this, so your still cutting current in half without even trying to correct for power factor and wait a little longer:

Again how often are you pulling 200 amps and how often will the relay experience 200 amps during a disconnect event. If power is being lost the amps are gone, even with some phase angle waiting for a zero crossing will cut the amps significantly in a non grid down event.

This isn't wishful thinking every relay last longer the less its switched under load, AC relays have the benefit of zero crossing just like AC breakers and why DC breakers and relays have to be more robust for the same current.

Apparantly often enough to break OP's unit.

 

[jharrell]

Apparantly often enough to break OP's unit.

Really where was it said that this thing failed under a 200 amp load? Nothings perfect everything has defects like I said I would not install one these things without a manual bypass regardless of brand or quality of relays.

Everything I am hearing is these units are very reliable and many people are happy with them, whats concerning from this thread is how they are handling customer support which might sway my decision but actually the pics early on showing the 1000vac Churods with cooling fan definitely would make me pick a Sol-Ark over an 18kpv with 830v Churods and no cooling fan.

What whole home back up system has better relays for 200 amp ups grade transfer? Franklin? Tesla? Enphase?, 4 Victrons in parallel?

 

[CzerwonaKrowa]

Currently, the way I see it is that all of these units (doesn't matter the brand) have under-spec relays that have a good chance of getting cooked when they switch on/off during anomalies with the grid. Until it's proven otherwise, I can only assume the only safe level of current while expecting a reasonable life span is 50A through these relays. So prioritize buying the one that has the easiest to replace relays by the user if you draw more than 50A lol...

 

[Quattrohead]

18kpv with 830v Churods and no cooling fan.

If it makes you feel better about the 18K pv, the board with these relays is easy to get to and change.
I shared pictures front and back of this board somewhere on here a couple weeks ago.

 

[jharrell]

If it makes you feel better about the 18K pv, the board with these relays is easy to get to and change.
I shared pictures front and back of this board somewhere on here a couple weeks ago.

Sol-Ark looks like a replaceable board too, doesn't it help if they won't send you one for replacement, will EG4 do this?

 

[Quattrohead]

I don't know.