Sol-Ark 15K Rejected by PG&E in California

[Goboatingnow]

They are! They are excellent at being wasteful and intrusive.

Rather like Twitter according to musk

 

[Tecnodave]

There is no government like no government

 

[Goboatingnow]

There is no government like no government

I’m sure the peoples in Iraq , Afghanistan and occupied Ukraine made have an alternative perspective

Seemingly the US is clearly unable to create efficient governments basecvov the attitude here anyway. Elsewhere people largely support their governments and like them to run things.

Anyway , private industry hasn’t showered itself in glory either.

Anyway it’s irelevant , people don’t want Govs to go away and no evidence they are.

 

[400bird]

 

[robby]

I wonder if this is also connected to Tesla cancelling orders in California and some other States?
I am not sure if they are getting out of the Solar business or is this confined to just a handful of States.

 

[Supervstech]

I’d hate to have to move this thread to the chit chat forum, but all the political rhetoric is pushing it that way…
Keep the posts on topic, or I guess it’ll have to be moved…

 

[Goboatingnow]

They are! They are excellent at being wasteful and intrusive.

And good at governing. Society needs governing

 

[timselectric]

I’d hate to have to move this thread to the chit chat forum, but all the political rhetoric is pushing it that way…
Keep the posts on topic, or I guess it’ll have to be moved…

Please do.
It's so far off the rails, it will never find its way back. lol

 

[Calvin98]

PG&E deserves blame for lots of things but in this case it's really not their fault. The advanced inverter requirements (CA Rule 21) were set by CPUC. So, all CA PoCo's (PG&E, SCE, SDG&E, etc.) are obligated to follow the rule.

From the SF EXAMINER
"As The San Francisco Examiner revealed last summer, several current and former CPUC officials have intimate connections with the energy utilities they are supposed to regulate. Commission President Michael Peevey is a former CEO of SoCal Edison. The agency’s top lawyer, Frank Lindh, worked at PG&E for 16 years. Delaney Hunter, a former CPUC government affairs chief, became an energy lobbyist in 2008. Former Executive Director Steve Larson left the CPUC in 2007 to work at a natural gas company. Ex-Commissioner Jessie J. Knight now leads San Diego Gas & Electric."

 

[jrcromer]

What confuses me about VPPs / utilities dispatching power on-demand is how it works with utility’s own TOU rates.

By definition the utility needs the power when it is most expensive and that’s also when the customer needs the power to have low electric bills.

It seems inevitable that VPP and TOU rates will conflict with each other.

I suppose it’s not the worse deal in the world if there is an incentive involved. But in my experience incentives go away and red tape remains…

 

[Ampster]

What confuses me about VPPs / utilities dispatching power on-demand is how it works with utility’s own TOU rates.

By definition the utility needs the power when it is most expensive and that’s also when the customer needs the power to have low electric bills.

I don't know the specifics of Tesla's arrangement with Powerwall users. I do know that given enough capacity of a system and some load management, there can be enough power to cover loads and do export for a short period of time. Sometimes a short two or three hour cut in demand or increase of power is all that might be needed to stabilize the grid during that period. The pricing mechanisms are complex and as a result confusing because they include elements of standby payments to power generators, just for being able to dispatch power quickly as demand ramps up.

It seems inevitable that VPP and TOU rates will conflict with each other.

The concept of high TOU rates during peak times was to discourage consumptiin during peak times and compensate power generators for bringing on power during those times. At least that was the theory in California and for a while Peaker Plants were doing that. Now grid scale battery plants have replaced peakers because they can operate with less cost and less pollution. At least that was the scenario in September when brownouts were avoided in California.

 

[LittleLebowski]

I’m sure the peoples in Iraq , Afghanistan and occupied Ukraine made have an alternative perspective

Seemingly the US is clearly unable to create efficient governments basecvov the attitude here anyway. Elsewhere people largely support their governments and like them to run things.

Anyway , private industry hasn’t showered itself in glory either.

Anyway it’s irelevant , people don’t want Govs to go away and no evidence they are.

Ever been to any of those countries in person?

 

[Goboatingnow]

Ever been to any of those countries in person?

Yes some of them. Aghanistan in the late 70s was amazing , Iraq was equally a fan imaging place to visit before the shah was toppled ( I learned to play a lot of backgammon )

 

[LittleLebowski]

Yes some of them. Aghanistan in the late 70s was amazing , Iraq was equally a fan imaging place to visit before the shah was toppled ( I learned to play a lot of backgammon )

They've...changed since then.

 

[Goboatingnow]

They've...changed since then.

Sure but the point is yes I was there and it answers the nonsense comment about good government is no government. Because one can quickly see what happened when these countries lost their governments and descended into chaos.

Societies need good reliable governments to function properly and to ensure fairness etc. it’s nonsense to spout “ bumper sticker” politics

That’s all I was saying

 

[Kornbread]

Sure but the point is yes I was there and it answers the nonsense comment about good government is no government. Because one can quickly see what happened when these countries lost their governments and descended into chaos.

Societies need good reliable governments to function properly and to ensure fairness etc. it’s nonsense to spout “ bumper sticker” politics

That’s all I was saying

Define good ...

 

[Goboatingnow]

Define good ...

The vast majority of people being contented to a point , so that society sleeps peacefully at night. I believe fundemebt rights like income irrelevant access to housing food medical and education are then respected , this requires tax collection , order maintenance etc or human greed wlll out and the weak are terrorised by the greedy, no point having “ resources “if you constantly have to defend them.

Sure humans are fallible nothing will be perfect but I’d prefer imperfect Gov to Chaos . Most people spouting “ bumper “ sticker politics about no Gov will be the first to scream for help when they get into trouble. !!

 

[Kornbread]

The vast majority of people being contented to a point , so that society sleeps peacefully at night. I believe fundemebt rights like income irrelevant access to housing food medical and education are then respected , this requires tax collection , order maintenance etc or human greed wlll out and the weak are terrorised by the greedy, no point having “ resources “if you constantly have to defend them.

Sure humans are fallible nothing will be perfect but I’d prefer imperfect Gov to Chaos . Most people spouting “ bumper “ sticker politics about no Gov will be the first to scream for help when they get into trouble. !!

I am a minority. Why does your version of 'good government' not represent me? I find your brand of 'good government', that only represents the vast majority, unfair and discriminatory.

 

[curiouscarbon]

please @Supervstech move this to chit chat

 

[Goboatingnow]

I am a minority. Why does your version of 'good government' not represent me? I find your brand of 'good government', that only represents the vast majority, unfair and discriminatory.

Well you can’t please everyone no Gov really tries that. You have to pick helping the most disadvantaged , those that have their own resources don’t need too much help. But you can’t leave the “
Dispossessed “ behind in a reasonable society. That just builds up resentment and that leads to the guillotine as Marie Antionette found out.

Hence if youre a resourceful outlier , then providing you contribute to society by your taxes some societies will leave you exist “ off the grid “ partly or less so. But it’s really an edge case and can’t be regarded as mainstream. Most people want support systems and want a caring society.