SunGold Power SP6548 Flickering lights after new install

[Zwy]

Well......wiring diagrams are nice pretty things. I can't say I have the patience to make a nice pretty thing but I put this together... I am including a couple of photos to spare myself from drawing out the details. The distribution panel is backfed through a couple of phase-aligned 40A breakers from the inverters. The utility panel feeds the inverters through a couple of phase-aligned 40 amp breakers. I built my combiner myself from a DIN project box. Each string feeds a 10A double pole DC breaker and I combine them in terminal blocks. Then I tap those split blocks 2x2 with a pair of 20A dual pole DC breakers for the inverter PV feeds.

Note red arrow, you have a N-G from neutral busbar from EGC busbar with the green jumper located at the red arrow. This creates a parallel path.

As for the neutral, I'm assuming that is the larger (possibly #6 wire) white wire where the yellow arrows are located?


As you have a bond in the service panel shown below, the green jumper wire should not be present in the distribution panel.

 

[Electric_Blue]

Note red arrow, you have a N-G from neutral busbar from EGC busbar with the green jumper located at the red arrow. This creates a parallel path.

As for the neutral, I'm assuming that is the larger (possibly #6 wire) white wire where the yellow arrows are located?
View attachment 120802

As you have a bond in the service panel shown below, the green jumper wire should not be present in the distribution panel. View attachment 120804

Understandably from the photo, you've misinterpreted what you see. That green wire isn't jumping the neutral, it's riding up the side of the block but you can't see it until it bends around to the ground bar.

The two big bars on the sides are the plug-on neutral buses and yes the #8 whites are the inverter neutrals. The second photo is the interior sub-panel so that's not bonded either. The only neutral bond exists is in the main panel outside, I didn't include a photo. So you're analysis matched mine but we were both incorrect.

The SGP inverters that I have are not performing a neutral bond in the inverter distribution panel and I verified that with a continuity check between neutral and ground and it was open. That means the neutral being supplied to both inverters is not being passed through the inverter to the panel or it would have carried the bond continuity through.

So now I do have a neutral bond (screw) in the inverter panel and therefore continuity between the n&g in that panel. And boy, did it help things out considerably in the house

 

[Zwy]

Understandably from the photo, you've misinterpreted what you see. That green wire isn't jumping the neutral, it's riding up the side of the block but you can't see it until it bends around to the ground bar.

Yes, I see it now.

The two big bars on the sides are the plug-on neutral buses and yes the #8 whites are the inverter neutrals. The second photo is the interior sub-panel so that's not bonded either. The only neutral bond exists is in the main panel outside, I didn't include a photo. So you're analysis matched mine but we were both incorrect.

Wasn't quite sure what that panel was, makes sense.

The SGP inverters that I have are not performing a neutral bond in the inverter distribution panel and I verified that with a continuity check between neutral and ground and it was open. That means the neutral being supplied to both inverters is not being passed through the inverter to the panel or it would have carried the bond continuity through.

So now I do have a neutral bond (screw) in the inverter panel and therefore continuity between the n&g in that panel. And boy, did it help things out considerably in the house

Question, was there originally a screw for N-G bond inside the inverter originally? Or was it built without? The reason I ask is many remove the bonding screw (in one inverter or both) in some inverters such as the ES5000, LV6548, EG4. My opinion has always been to leave the screws in the inverter, even if in parallel operation.

 

[Electric_Blue]

Yes, I see it now.



Wasn't quite sure what that panel was, makes sense.

Question, was there originally a screw for N-G bond inside the inverter originally? Or was it built without? The reason I ask is many remove the bonding screw (in one inverter or both) in some inverters such as the ES5000, LV6548, EG4. My opinion has always been to leave the screws in the inverter, even if in parallel operation.

No bond screw or any type of bond offering in the inverter. No talk of neutral handling at all in the manual. I swear these inverters remind me of this scene from Family Guy

Good luck everybody!

 

[Zwy]

No bond screw or any type of bond offering in the inverter. No talk of neutral handling at all in the manual. I swear these inverters remind me of this scene from Family Guy

Good luck everybody!

That's hilarious.

Bonding is an interesting subject, thank you for relating your experience and glad you found a solution.

 

[nofear72784]

I know it has been a long time but I have not had anything useful to report. Over the winter we lost multiple appliances that were working just fine. Our 3YO LG fridge, our 2YO dishwasher and our 8YO washing machine. All 3 had fried boards. LG refused warranty on the fridge and dishwasher stating "power fluctuations caused stress on the filtering capacitors leading to their failure" (it took 3 weeks to even get someone out there to look at them and another 2 for a warranty response). LG had 0 knowledge of what was powering their appliances. I 100% attribute this to this inverter. After many more months of back and forth with the SunGold they admitted that there is an issue with the inverter and there would be no fix. During this time the EG4 6500EX was released and whatcha know.. same issues. Got my hands on a LV6548 for testing and VOILA.. no more flickering, dimmer issues or random UPS's tripping. Ordering myself a genuine LV6548 from Watts247 and sticking a fork in it.

 

[nofear72784]

I hate to say it but those of us that are having issues with these clones will be out the purchase price. There is no fix, they have junk parts and the manufacturers know it. Cut your losses or pay more in the long run with ruined electronics. Learned my lesson trying to save a few bucks.

 

[HRTKD]

I know it has been a long time but I have not had anything useful to report. Over the winter we lost multiple appliances that were working just fine. Our 3YO LG fridge, our 2YO dishwasher and our 8YO washing machine. All 3 had fried boards. LG refused warranty on the fridge and dishwasher stating "power fluctuations caused stress on the filtering capacitors leading to their failure" (it took 3 weeks to even get someone out there to look at them and another 2 for a warranty response). LG had 0 knowledge of what was powering their appliances. I 100% attribute this to this inverter. After many more months of back and forth with the SunGold they admitted that there is an issue with the inverter and there would be no fix. During this time the EG4 6500EX was released and whatcha know.. same issues. Got my hands on a LV6548 for testing and VOILA.. no more flickering, dimmer issues or random UPS's tripping. Ordering myself a genuine LV6548 from Watts247 and sticking a fork in it.

There are times when your gut says something is very wrong but nobody else can see it. I'm sorry to hear about your appliance failures.

 

[upnorthandpersonal]

That sucks so much... sorry you have to go through this.

 

[nofear72784]

I think we all knew there was something going on with these clones but were hoping for an easy fix. Almost a year since I installed mine, no fixes. Think it's safe to say we will never have a fix. More likely that the manufacturers will sell though the defective units and implement changes unbeknownst to us. Unfinished threads drive me nuts, wanted to be sure we had a conclusion to this one. Thank You to everyone that tried to help and offered advice.

 

[Quattrohead]

Wanna sell the SP6548 cheap ?

 

[nofear72784]

Wanna sell the SP6548 cheap ?

You want an inverter with clear issues? Insanity

 

[LydMekk]

Holy necro Batman!

 

[Zwy]

I captured the zero crossing being what caused my LED dimmer to actually turn off for 1-2 seconds. The white trace is the saved waveform and blue being the live waveform. The white trace did not cause the flicker.

Yes, exactly what I have been looking for. At the zero crossing, I'm seeing the glitch and this confirms my theory. https://diysolarforum.com/threads/eg4-6500-ex-under-an-oscilloscope.54931/post-770237

 

[Zwy]

Here's another scope capture. Note that the over and under percentages is what I believe to cause flickering, i.e. no flickering when the ac amplitudes are symmetrical/equal.

I have seen the same, the voltage goes over/under on the scope trace, the resulting voltage fluctuation causes flicker.

 

[Zwy]

I know it has been a long time but I have not had anything useful to report. Over the winter we lost multiple appliances that were working just fine. Our 3YO LG fridge, our 2YO dishwasher and our 8YO washing machine. All 3 had fried boards. LG refused warranty on the fridge and dishwasher stating "power fluctuations caused stress on the filtering capacitors leading to their failure" (it took 3 weeks to even get someone out there to look at them and another 2 for a warranty response). LG had 0 knowledge of what was powering their appliances. I 100% attribute this to this inverter. After many more months of back and forth with the SunGold they admitted that there is an issue with the inverter and there would be no fix. During this time the EG4 6500EX was released and whatcha know.. same issues. Got my hands on a LV6548 for testing and VOILA.. no more flickering, dimmer issues or random UPS's tripping. Ordering myself a genuine LV6548 from Watts247 and sticking a fork in it.

There certainly are problems with many of these units. https://diysolarforum.com/threads/n...t-without-the-bonding-screw.53547/post-781863

I'm currently testing the LV6548's. If SS sends new EG4 6500EX's, I'll test those also.

 

[sparrowhawk]

I hate to say it but those of us that are having issues with these clones will be out the purchase price. There is no fix, they have junk parts and the manufacturers know it. Cut your losses or pay more in the long run with ruined electronics. Learned my lesson trying to save a few bucks.

Where did you purchase your sungolds?

 

[adamdavidson]

Is anyone seeing the voltage (specifically the output voltage) jump around anywhere from 111 to 129 volts when the flickering is occurring? We are having the same or very similar issue with the SP6548 and hoping to resolve the issue.

When voltage on inverter is steady at 120 (or the generator is running) then the lights are all steady.

Can someone provide me a short summary of what solved the problem for anyone else, including any pictures and info that could help.

Thank you so much for all of the info and for making this available to others.

ALSO... when the generator is running (Generac 18kw) and we turn the setting for amps up over 60amps (in program 11 shown in user manual) on the inverter, the inverter/charger kicks off and the generator over-speeds briefly and then runs normal again. The inverter then starts charging again. It keeps doing this randomly every 1.5 minutes up to every 20 minutes. Can anyone offer direction on how to get this corrected and allow for charging at the full specs of 120 apms (each as there are 2 inverters).

Adam

 

[Zwy]

Is anyone seeing the voltage (specifically the output voltage) jump around anywhere from 111 to 129 volts when the flickering is occurring? We are having the same or very similar issue with the SP6548 and hoping to resolve the issue.

These are some of the posts I wrote regarding voltage fluctuation on the EG4 6500EX inverters, the SP6548 is the same. There is a video somewhere in my posts showing the voltage fluctuations also. I had also some videos showing the dirty sine wave. https://diysolarforum.com/search/1952622/?q=voltage+fluctuation&c[users]=Zwy&o=relevance

When voltage on inverter is steady at 120 (or the generator is running) then the lights are all steady.

That would be correct, the flickering lights always occur with the voltage swings.

Can someone provide me a short summary of what solved the problem for anyone else, including any pictures and info that could help.

I solved my problem by installing a pair of MPP Solar LV6548 inverters that I had purchased before the 6500EX's but had not used because I wanted to use higher PV voltage. Those have worked flawlessly, no light flicker and I have the original firmware still installed. The problem is if the original LV6548's are still available. I recently asked Ian at Watts247 if he had any about the same age as what I have and he never answered that question. So later manufacture dates may have internal hardware plus firmware changes that will cause light flicker like you experiencing.

What to purchase now? Or how to solve your problem? You could move to some of the newer inverters out there like the EG4 6000 or a SRNE which members have reported have no issues with light flicker. You could try different LED fixtures/bulbs. You can explore changes to the N-G bond which might help.

I went thru my house looking for a cause. Switched out dryer circuit from 3 wire to 4 wire, no change. Replaced a subpanel upstairs in the house, no change. If you read those links from above, you will see I was interested in a fix. Even had Signature Solar send me another pair of inverters. They all had this problem. The LV6548's were installed and the problem was gone. That is quite revealing, it is the output voltage regulation that is the cause of the light flicker. I will caution you about having electronics plugged in with the light flicker, one member here told me privately he lost his TV and fridge due to this problem.

My best advice is to swap out the inverters for something different.

Thank you so much for all of the info and for making this available to others.

Adam